Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Other Raw-Animal-Food Diets (eg:- Primal Diet/Raw Version of Weston-Price Diet etc.) => Primal Diet => Topic started by: Projectile Vomit on February 25, 2012, 04:04:49 am
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I've read We Want to Live and Recipe for Living Without Disease, and while I think there are nuggets of useful information in both books I can't help but remain skeptical of AV himself. After reading widely about him, I have two questions for those who might know him personally:
1. What is AV's real name? He mentions his first name was either Richard or Dick in WWtL, but I've read that 'Vonderplanitz' is a new-age take on the German translation of "Beyond the planets" and isn't his original (or actual) last name. Any insight on this?
2. Second, I have read that AV claims to have a PhD. I'm curious what discipline his PhD is in, and what the degree granting institution was. Anyone know this?
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I vaguely recall that two of his aliases were "Brock Bison" and "Jimmy(?) Swaggart". No idea if either of those are real. I have heard that it is quite normal for LA-residents of any note to have as much as 6 aliases at any one time. So they have a real name for their personal life, one or two for their work, and may add further names if they switch to some other field(for example Aajonus used to be a Natural-Hygiene follower, which is basically raw vegan in tone).
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Over the years I have verified a lot of his healing principles do work. He could be the tooth fairy or Santa Claus. Thanks AV!
My other teacher Barefoot Herbalist MH requests that his real name not be revealed on the internet. It does not change that he is a great healer, teacher and master herbalist.
My friend Sifu Jen Sam is a master acupuncturist and TCM healer and kung fu master... He also does not like publicizing his real full name.
They all have their reasons.
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I don't think he'd mind my sharing that Aajonus told one of his fans that his birth name is John Richard "Dick" von der Planitz. Planitz doesn't mean "planets," it's a town in Saxony, Germany. It looks like it's a suburb of the city of Zwickau (http://www.mindat.org/loc-16044.html (http://www.mindat.org/loc-16044.html)).
In 2003, he received a Ph.D. Degree in Nutrition from Richmond University in London, England. http://www.cancercontrolsociety.com/bio2011/vonderplanitz.html (http://www.cancercontrolsociety.com/bio2011/vonderplanitz.html)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richmond,_The_American_International_University_in_London (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richmond,_The_American_International_University_in_London)
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http://www.richmond.ac.uk/content/academic-programs/graduate-programs.aspx (http://www.richmond.ac.uk/content/academic-programs/graduate-programs.aspx)
I don't see anything remotely related to nutrition/PhD there.
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I don't either. In fact, I don't see any PhD programs listed as being administered by this University at all.
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And on further inspection, I don't even see any undergraduate programs in nutrition, or anything remotely related to nutrition.
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AV may or may not be quite honest in this regard. But it doesn't matter. Quite frankly, I have come across so many moronic remarks by modern nutritionists with degrees aplenty that I very seriously doubt they have done any serious research into food-science.
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This is the only thing I found at the University of Richmond for nutrition--a "Nutrition and Food Science Certificate" in their "personal enrichment" program: http://spcs.richmond.edu/personal/culinary/nfs-certificate.html (http://spcs.richmond.edu/personal/culinary/nfs-certificate.html)
That sounds more like Aajonus' speed than a PhD. Aajonus claimed to get his PhD in 2003, but I didn't find any evidence that Richmond ever had a PhD program.
Aajonus Vonderplanitz | LinkedIn
www.linkedin.com/pub/aajonus-vonderplanitz/7/11a/a08 (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/aajonus-vonderplanitz/7/11a/a08)
Greater Los Angeles Area - Independent Health, Wellness and Fitness Professional
Aajonus Vonderplanitz's Overview. Education. Richmond, The American International University in London.
Tyler's right that a nutrition degree wouldn't add much credibility anyway. Some of the worst nutrition advice I received was from a certified nutritionist my physician recommended to me. I've noticed over the years that the field of nutrition seems to be dominated by women who are attracted by vegetarian-oriented diets and who assume that such diets are healthy for all, and this nutritionist was no exception.
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Fair enough, I'm certainly no stranger to bad health advice from 'certified' nutritionists, or from medical professionals more generally. It's amazing to me that the people who organized the Cancer Control Society conference at which he spoke didn't double-check his PhD credential before advertising it.
The main reason I'm interested in this is because I have a PhD myself (not in nutrition), and I actually earned it with 4 years of hard labor at an accredited institution. It bothers me when others claim the credential without earning it, and further bothers me when others justify lying about such credentials.
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Wow, 32 hours course. That definitely equals a 5000+ hours PhD.
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Fair enough, I'm certainly no stranger to bad health advise from 'certified' nutritionists, or from medical professionals more generally. It's amazing to me that the people who organized the Cancer Control Society conference at which he spoke didn't double check his PhD credential before advertising it.
Yeah, given some of the kooky things he says, and without providing any references to back them up, it is rather surprising that no one has bothered to investigate his credentials until us now, not even his harshest critics, probably because they don't take him seriously.
further bothers me when others justify lying about such credentials.
I certainly wouldn't do that. Aajonus has told so many bizarre and contradictory tall tales and made so many outlandish claims without evidence by now (on which Tyler has commented critically multiple times) that his apparent lying about his credentials--about which he hasn't had a chance to explain--hardly makes a difference. It would just be par for the course.
Besides, even if Aajonus had a PhD, it wouldn't convince me any more that his most outlandish claims are true, so when he claimed he'd earned one I was skeptical, but didn't bother to look into it, because it didn't increase his credibility in my eyes, nor change my opinion on anything he says. I guess I tend to focus more on evidence and what actually works for me (among which the raw eggs, raw honey--albeit fermented in my case--and raw meat/organs that Aajonus advocates have worked for me) than credentials, but I can certainly understand your frustration with his apparent lying about something you worked so hard for and I would probably feel more strongly about it if I were in your shoes.
Plus, Aajonus already gets ridiculed quite a bit by critics of meat and high meat and proponents of cooking, and I haven't seen a lot of praise of him in this forum recently (though that could be in part because I only read a minority of the posts), and some people do seem to benefit more from his dietary advice than conventional recommendations, so I don't see a lot of point in piling on. I suppose if he started developing a strong following here, I might point out more of these unfavorable points about him and his claims, although Tyler would probably manage it fine without me.
Also, Aajonus responded politely when one of his fans passed on a question and comment regarding his name that I made. I try to respond to politeness and courtesy with the same.
You've piqued my curiousity, though. Maybe Aajonus duped more people than I expected and maybe it had more effect than I imagined. Did anyone here really ever give much credence to Aajonus' PhD?
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I vaguely recall that two of his aliases were "Brock Bison" and "Jimmy(?) Swaggart". No idea if either of those are real. I have heard that it is quite normal for LA-residents of any note to have as much as 6 aliases at any one time. So they have a real name for their personal life, one or two for their work, and may add further names if they switch to some other field(for example Aajonus used to be a Natural-Hygiene follower, which is basically raw vegan in tone).
Brock Bison!? HAHA. Funny name.. I would like to have some more names, too!
Löwenherz
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I certainly wouldn't do that...
I didn't mean to imply that you, personally, did. I got the sense that another person was.
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Maybe Aajonus duped more people than I expected and maybe it had more effect than I imagined.
Aajonus is promoting his "Primal Diet" now for many years. I find it suspicous that there still so few references on youtube.
Most of his recommendations have been completely disastrous for my health: Especially raw dairy including butter, eggs, honey and grain-fed meats. If I remember correctly he didn't write about the differences between grain fed and grass fed meat in his books.
Nevertheless I still like Aajonus and his unconventional approaches. Without him I wouldn't eat raw animal foods today and I would most probably know nothing about the healing power of raw coconut cream.
If he had really helped so many cancer patients as he always claims, he should document and publish these cases, IMO. But obviously he is constantly busy with useless legal actions regarding raw cows shit.
Löwenherz
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I actually didn't find my way to my current diet through AV's work. I found my way here through a simple Google search, "eating raw meat". I was inspired to do the search back in late 2009 because I had recently killed my first deer and so had a huge amount of wild, fresh meat and was curious about the diversity of ways that I could prepare it.
I only bought AV's books later, and got rid of both soon after reading them. The only idea that I've held onto is the use of 'high' meat, although I haven't made or eaten any in a very long time.
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Did anyone here really ever give much credence to Aajonus' PhD?
As a Californian, I take everything Aajonus says with a grain of salt. He writes with a self-aggrandizing style that sounds like a non-stop commercial advertisement for himself. By my way of thinking, a person who has to speak so strongly for himself possibly has nobody else who will speak for him. Granted, he does have some good advice, but he never lets that good advice speak for itself, so it's easy to walk away from his soapbox and stop listening.
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His name is listed in his father's obit:
http://www.gsbfuneralhome.com/obituaries/JosefGarfield-Swigart-209/#/Obituary (http://www.gsbfuneralhome.com/obituaries/JosefGarfield-Swigart-209/#/Obituary)
"Aajonus Vander Planitz (John Richards Swigart)"
What I am most curious about is, did he really have the childhood cancer he described in his autobio, including the treatments which nearly killed him? That is the core of his self-cure story and public identity. He would do well to publish those medical records, if true.
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His name is listed in his father's obit:
http://www.gsbfuneralhome.com/obituaries/JosefGarfield-Swigart-209/#/Obituary (http://www.gsbfuneralhome.com/obituaries/JosefGarfield-Swigart-209/#/Obituary)
"Aajonus Vander Planitz (John Richards Swigart)"
That's curious. So is the obit right, or Aajonus himself? Aajonus' predilection for tall tales, including apparently his alleged PhD, does cast doubt on his claim, but why would he lie about his own name? Might it be so that he wouldn't have a mundane history and could better convince his followers that he is some sort of mystical guru? And if Swigart is his real name instead of an alias, how did he come up with Vonderplanitz? Did he search for the weirdest name he could find or something? ;D Ow! My brain hurts! :o :P Why does this always happen whenever I try to understand Aajonus?
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If that obituary is accurate, and as of this moment I have no reason to believe that it is not, then that's an interesting find and I'm grateful you spent the time.
I never thought to doubt AV's (or JRS's) claims to severe childhood illness, but I wonder if there's something worth looking deeper into here?
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Aajonus' claims about his past illnesses and healings seem to self-contradict at times, so I've been skeptical about them, though I suspect that there's some truth to them, but perhaps embellished, but I don't know for sure and don't consider it particularly important. The claims of gurus are less important to me than my own experience.
OK, I dug into my files on the name question. Here's what Aajonus said when I told his fan about the Swigart claim:
"Hi, Donald,
Those are the correct spellings. However Swigart is not the true ancestral spelling and it is my great great grandfathers mothers name. Von der Planitz was his true name.
healthfully,
aajonus"
So it sounds like Aajonus is claiming that Swigart was an alias from his mother's side adopted by his father with the Von der Planitz name, which is not completely far-fetched, as many people changed their names when they came to the USA, though it does suggest that Swigart was Aajonus' birth name. I don't know what he means about "spelling", though, as it's a completely different name, not just a different spelling. I didn't really want to think much about it at the time, because my general philosophy is to let people call themselves whatever they wish. He could call himself I. M. God, for all I care.
So it seems like Aajonus' father took on his wife's maiden name, perhaps because it would be less odd to Americans, and then Aajonus decided to re-adopt his father's ancestral name, except merging it into one word?
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http://www.richmond.ac.uk/content/academic-programs/graduate-programs.aspx (http://www.richmond.ac.uk/content/academic-programs/graduate-programs.aspx)
I don't see anything remotely related to nutrition/PhD there.
Does it matter?
Aajonus did his own research and made his own conclusions and wrote his own books.
Many of us who did our own experiments concur with many of his principles.
Aajonus' teachings have made my life and my family's life much better.
For me, Aajonus Vonderplanitz balances out the shortcomings of Hulda Clark (also another great original researcher / independent scientist.)
This is what matters for me.
As the family healer I keep Aajonus' books and Hulda Clark's books handy at all times because they have a vast amount of experience.
When my son was recently sick... my protocols combined some from Aajonus (diverticulitis and candida), Hulda Clark (dental clean up, pollution avoidance), Barefoot Herbalist MH (colon restoration herbs, orange juice fasting) and more.
We should treasure independent researchers and just accept that what works for them, may not necessarily work for you and I at all times. And that their work is VAST, a couple of things that don't work for you or me is fine.
Maybe they should be given titles such as: "Great Independent Healer" or "PhD +++" something that shows that their healing knowledge is above and beyond what current organized schools can teach.
How about giving Geoff Purcell a title: "Raw Paleo Diet's First Professor" or something better?
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Aajonus had to do what he had to do to publish his books and make it available for as much public as possible. Not everybody would buy a book on raw meat eating from a guy named "dick" without a Phd. But Aajonus Vonderplanitz a man with Phd I would certainly pay for his work.
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Err no, I hate titles - knighthoods/nobility/professorships etc. are often granted for all sorts of skulduggeries - besides, all I do is take small bits of info from a 1,000 different sources and check to see whether they fit in with my own or other RVAFers' experiences or whether they are scientifically valid, not something that requires much expertise, to put it mildly.
I've had relatives in the academic world who have stated that many excellent people have been blocked from becoming professors by the actions of incompetent, 2nd-rate people who simply disliked their stances on certain issues, not because of the quality of their work, while less competent, but more pliable people were promoted instead. And I've come across plenty of examples of people getting jobs based on fake degrees, and plenty others who have gotten degrees in a valid way, but who then have turned out not to be competent academics. So, I don't view degrees as all that relevant a marker, especially in the field of food-science where very little research has been done by comparison to some other areas of science.
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Ok, how about "Raw Paleo Diet's Promoter and Humble Researcher" ?
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Ok, how about "Raw Paleo Diet's Promoter and Humble Researcher" ?
Frankly, this would just lead to hubris on my part. I am no guru and there are plenty other RVAFers with more media-savvy etc. than I have, and none of the ideas I have re diet were originally my own, just borrowed from others.
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Ok, how about "Raw Paleo Diet's Promoter and Humble Researcher" ?
If you change your mind about the hubris thing, how about "Discoverer and Founder of the Raw Paleo Diet, Internet Forums, and Paleolithic Man"? You could donate all your speaker's fees and the royalties to charity.
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If you change your mind about the hubris thing, how about "Discoverer and Founder of the Raw Paleo Diet, Internet Forums, and Paleolithic Man"? You could donate all your speaker's fees and the royalties to charity.
I'm useless at public speaking and get stagefright during such occasions; so that's out! And I didn't start up this forum, Craig Bates did the all-important tech-stuff and GS got things going after that, and I certainly didn't invent "Palaeolithic Man"(!) and Vinny Pinto invented the term "Raw, Palaeolithic Diets". The only difference is that VP used the term to also describe raw diets which incorporated non-palaeo foods like raw dairy or raw veggie-juice and I kept on coming across negative online reports re those foods, so I chose to use the term in a more restrictive way.
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Yes, Aajonus Vonderplanitz is his real name, because he legally changed it to that. I do know what he was named at birth although I think I should get his OK before posting it. Someone may wish to malign him although I don't see what is wrong with having an ordinary name or an extraordinary one for that matter. You are right about the Richard. His family name is an ordinary one also.
His Ph.D. is in nutrition.
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very itneresting thread. Perhaps he lied about his degree in order to get the info out to help more people. Maybe he is part hollywood huckster. All I know at this point is that much of what he says worked for me. Before I took all of what he said to be almost 100 percent true but now I am much more open to the idea of how he imbellishes things. Perhaps I will stray away from his teachings a bit more and take on GS's approach of combing the best things from other which I was before more reluctant to do since I had much trust in this guy because his teaching made me healthy more so than any other person I have looked to for help.
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OK, I dug into my files on the name question. Here's what Aajonus said when I told his fan about the Swigart claim:
"Hi, Donald,
Those are the correct spellings. However Swigart is not the true ancestral spelling and it is my great great grandfathers mothers name. Von der Planitz was his true name.
healthfully,
aajonus"
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You took this differently than I did. From what I can tell, Swigart was his great great great (great x 3) grandmother's name, which, for some reason, his great great grandfather took. Basically, 5 parental steps back there was a Mr Vonderplanitz and Miss Swigart who got together, and for whatever reason their child took the name Swigart. Generations later, Richard/Aajonus changed his surname to Vonderplanitz to be what it should've been in the first place.
The original ancestral spelling just means that it wasn't originally swigart, but something close - http://www.houseofnames.com/Swigart-history?A=54323-292. (http://www.houseofnames.com/Swigart-history?A=54323-292.)
After watching him on youtube talking about being abused (beaten) as a child, I'm guessing maybe the name change was, in part, to distance himself from family a little? I don't know, now I'm grasping at straws, but I just wanted to throw that first part out there since no one else popped in with that interpretation.
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You took this differently than I did. From what I can tell, Swigart was his great great great (great x 3) grandmother's name, which, for some reason, his great great grandfather took.
OK, only difference from what I said is the generation. I thought AV's father was the one who took the Swigart name. Thanks for letting me know that it was AV's great great grandfather who took it from AV's great x3 grandmother.
The original ancestral spelling just means that it wasn't originally swigart, but something close - http://www.houseofnames.com/Swigart-history?A=54323-292. (http://www.houseofnames.com/Swigart-history?A=54323-292.)
By alias I only meant a different last name was adopted by a man. There's probably a clearer term for that, but I don't know what it is.
After watching him on youtube talking about being abused (beaten) as a child, I'm guessing maybe the name change was, in part, to distance himself from family a little? I don't know, now I'm grasping at straws, but I just wanted to throw that first part out there since no one else popped in with that interpretation.
That sounds plausible.
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Ah, from reading your post, I was thinking that you understood it to mean he changed Swigart to the original ancestral spelling "Vonderplanitz". Like I was saying, Vonderplanitz (or similar) would've been his great x3 grandfather's name.
I was just posting the link to show that Swigart could've been Schwick or Schwiger, or who knows what (but not anything close to Vonderplanitz). Him saying that it wasn't the original ancestral spelling is kind of like those math problems where they give you one piece of information you don't need to solve the problem.
Anyway, that's the way I interpret it. Oh, and I think alias worked.
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Cool, thanks.
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Anyway, that's the way I interpret it. Oh, and I think alias worked.
Pen name?