Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Health => Topic started by: Barefoot Instincto on May 16, 2013, 09:16:38 am
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Hello all. Since about the age of 13/14 (a decade ago or so) I developed a severe case of hyperhydrosis, a sweating "disease". About this time I began to develop strong anxiety feelings, occasional feelings of depression, and other things like kidney stones (to date I've had at least 15).
I've been suffering horribly in a lot of ways for a long time, every day of my life. In the last year it had gotten to be just too much and I couldn't take it anymore. It was debilitating to have my hands and my arm pits soaked for hours on end at work. Especially when I need to handle objects and people are witnessing me. Nothing I ever did in the last decade helped at all.
Then I came across a possible solution by deducing the symptoms I had with a magnesium deficiency, and discovered how hard it is to get even nearly adequate amounts in the diet today. To make matters worse, sweating creates a bigger magnesium deficiency. And I was sweating a lot.
I began taking 1000mg-1500mg a day (currently at about 1500). I've heard "recommendations" of something in the order of 800-1000mg. I prefer to judge by my stool, and so far its been great at this level. I attempted to take less than 1000mg for a stretch of time and my sweating and anxiety rebounded worse than ever and I was in hell again.
Now I sip it in my water, at concentrations of about 500-600mg per 400ml of water. I notice that in the morning my first drink can hold it off for a few hours, but then as I go without for another 3 hours or so, the sweating and anxiety starts to return. Then, if I sip on the magnesium water again the symptoms begin to disappear.
Sort of kicking myself for not realizing this sooner (no doctor I had ever seen ever connected these dots). In the end it actually seems pretty obvious, while I let it ruin my life year after year.
I expect my deficiency to be under control soon, but think I'll always have to supplement with at least some magnesium.
Does anyone else have any terrible things (or not so terrible) that magnesium has fixed?
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what brand of supplement do you use?
what got you to consider magnesium in the first place? i think it's great you found your way! sounds like you're beating yourself up, but you should be proud of yourself for finding your way!!
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Tell us also when your body says stop supplementing.
When the your body says full.
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BI,
what does your current diet consist of?
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From what little I know optimum potassium status is very helpful in building up your magnesium position. I would also think that replenishing salt would be important. I drink a mixture of magnesium, potassium and salt in five equal doses pretty equally spaced throughout the day, the first dose on waking up, the last dose last thing at night. Each of these five doses give me180mg of magnesium, 750mg sodium and 320mg potassium. In practice that means for me 1.1g magnesium citrate powder, 2g potassium gluconate powder and 2g sea salt crystals dissolved in water. The unrefined sea salt should also help in replacing a whole range of trace minerals. This combination may not suit you especially if you are high carb. If you perspire extra then you need to replenish in response to that.
I am afraid that I don't agree that the magnesium is curing you, it is part of a work in progress.
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Tell us also when your body says stop supplementing.
When the your body says full.
I don't think it works this way with supplements.
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Barefoot, good for you. I read of a doctor claiming that if we all got our magnesium, hospitals would be emptied.
I make ionized magnesium water- instructions easily found on the net. If consists of club soda and Milk of Magnesium. I have read that Magnesium Chloride is the best form for taking internally and externally, as a body rub that is absorbed. Magnesium is the great regulator of the electrolyte family (sodium, potassium, Magnesium, calcium and phosphorous). However, one can only store so much and the excess is evacuated via the bowels, though it might also be reabsorbed if the BM is not stupendous. (The other electrolytes are then best regulated when magnesium is readily available.)
Vitamin C is stored in the linings of the stomach and intestines but an excess (in double digit grams) has the same effect loosening the bowls; so I wonder if magnesium isn't to a degree also stored in those linings.
Magnesium needs to be taken throughout the day so a pocketful of weaker tablets might be advised, a bottle of the MoM Club Soda water always on hand or Magnesium Chloride rub from a small bottle.
Recipe for ionized MoM concentrate. Chill MoM & 2L quality Soda Water. Add 90ml MoM. Cap and shake 30 seconds. Refrigerate half hour+. Re-shake. Bottle should collapse as magnesium ionizes.
MoM drink. Add 100ml concentrate to 1L/1quart water. Sip throughout day. If bowel evacuation becomes a prob, add less concentrate. I also add 100g (3.5 oz) cranberry concentrate or black cherry juice, lemon juice, stevia or Xylitol and 1/2 tsp baking soda which also helps the body with CO2, though I don't drink within two and a half hour after a meal so as not to compete with acids needed for digestion. We don't think of CO2 as being important (some governments have declared it a toxic poison) but our stomachs work hard to make it and all life is dependant upon it. It also helps alkalizing the body.
You are protecting your heart with the regulatory magic of magnesium, preventing and clearing out calcification, calming your nervous system and I suspect your heavy perspiration might improve. Test your handwriting before and after taking magnesium. Some are so attuned to their need for magnesium they sense when they are deficient. Sensing is an acquired skill, especially in these times of highly commercialized processing of foods.
Are you constantly thirsty?
When I was around your age I lived in the tropics and I was often thirsty and sweated profusely. I couldn't get enough water. Then one day a local shop keeper must have recognized my dilemma and added salt to my lime drink. I was too thirsty to send it back and upon drinking it, my thirst was quenched. You might also be an O blood type and a higher fat, low carb regime might be in line. Experiment on your own personal laboratory (your body). Continue to listen wisely to the signals your body sends, Barefoot, and you will do well.
My mum was rushed by ambulance to emergency in 1972. She had a severe potassium deficiency and made three more emergency trips before I learned about magnesium's regulatory importance. She lived twenty-two years hospital emergency free using magnesium until she was being assessed in a hospital setting for independent living. She was not allowed to bring her magnesium with her and died three days later from heart stress. The importance of the great regulator cannot be over stressed.
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what brand of supplement do you use?
what got you to consider magnesium in the first place? i think it's great you found your way! sounds like you're beating yourself up, but you should be proud of yourself for finding your way!!
The Natural Calm Citrate powder brand. I stumbled upon the fact that an anxiety issue can be related to not enough mag. Anxiety has been a constant issue for me since my symptoms started over a decade ago. The mag lessens it considerably and its getting better the longer I use it (about 3 weeks in so far).
BI,
what does your current diet consist of?
Generally one type of red meat in the morning, or on the rare occasion veg (or suet, which I've been having once a week or so for breakfast). I eat a dozen and and a half eggs or so a week, half of them raw, half cooked. For lunch I almost always eat meat to satiety (I cook all of my meat, but not overcook. I rarely under cook now though too).
A few hours later I'll eat a lot of a type of vegetable (or a few pieces of fruit now that its getting warm out). Then for dinner its usually meat and vegetables, or (twice a week or so) a nut, berry, raw egg, coconut, chocolate type concoction. I swing between 100 grams of protein up to 200 on some days. I eat a few hundred grams of feta cheese per week now, which I seem to do fine on. This can be interspersed with other random extra meals of meat and vegetables on some days, like the weekends.
No matter what I eat I don't think dietary magnesium will be enough.
I don't get particularly thirsty, mhikl, but I do seem to drink more than most people. I've definitely noticed I have to sip it throughout the day, as I deplete it very fast and the symptoms begin to return.
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The Natural Calm Citrate powder brand. I stumbled upon the fact that an anxiety issue can be related to not enough mag. Anxiety has been a constant issue for me since my symptoms started over a decade ago. The mag lessens it considerably and its getting better the longer I use it (about 3 weeks in so far).
Generally one type of red meat in the morning, or on the rare occasion veg (or suet, which I've been having once a week or so for breakfast). I eat a dozen and and a half eggs or so a week, half of them raw, half cooked. For lunch I almost always eat meat to satiety (I cook all of my meat, but not overcook. I rarely under cook now though too).
A few hours later I'll eat a lot of a type of vegetable (or a few pieces of fruit now that its getting warm out). Then for dinner its usually meat and vegetables, or (twice a week or so) a nut, berry, raw egg, coconut, chocolate type concoction. I swing between 100 grams of protein up to 200 on some days. I eat a few hundred grams of feta cheese per week now, which I seem to do fine on. This can be interspersed with other random extra meals of meat and vegetables on some days, like the weekends.
No matter what I eat I don't think dietary magnesium will be enough.
I don't get particularly thirsty, mhikl, but I do seem to drink more than most people. I've definitely noticed I have to sip it throughout the day, as I deplete it very fast and the symptoms begin to return.
Any reason why you don't do the raw diet?
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Raw meat has a disgusting factor for me (and everyone around me). I derive the negative of enjoyment from it, as opposed to my current MUCH enjoyment. Its a compromise I'm willing to take (and its still making me look and feel absolutely incredible now).
Its not optimal, but I certainly don't think its going to prevent me from living to my 100's in fantastic shape and health. I just make sure its a very high quality diet with supplementation and many other raw foods.
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Raw meat has a disgusting factor for me (and everyone around me). I derive the negative of enjoyment from it, as opposed to my current MUCH enjoyment. Its a compromise I'm willing to take (and its still making me look and feel absolutely incredible now).
You know this is a raw diet forum?
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I'd say give him time,, I went to Montrame five times over five years before I would be willing to eat raw meat. My suggestion would be to slowly decrease the cooking time of your meat. When I dine out, I'll occasionally get the chef to sear the outside of the steak for two seconds each side. One time the chef came out and thanked me for ordering it that way. It happened to be Kobe beef.
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You know this is a raw diet forum?
Did I ever say raw meat was not the most optimal? I hold that opinion, and like to converse and interact with others who share that opinion. I just can't bring myself to do it, so I simply won't. Smart ass comments like these shouldn't even be made. Because heat creates toxins doesn't necessarily mean it makes the food anywhere close to garbage. Because I advocate that lightly cooked meats may not be QUITE so bad certainly doesn't mean I of course think raw is still much more optimal. We're all at different levels, and I admire many of you for being able to do it. I just simply won't, at least not in any large amounts, only maybe if I'm swallowing frozen bits of liver or something. Which is stuff I should be doing. I have been eating a decent bit of suet. I swallow mouth fulls very quickly with water. The kidney taste and smell turns me off.
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Did I ever say raw meat was not the most optimal? I hold that opinion, and like to converse and interact with others who share that opinion. I just can't bring myself to do it, so I simply won't. Smart ass comments like these shouldn't even be made. Because heat creates toxins doesn't necessarily mean it makes the food anywhere close to garbage. Because I advocate that lightly cooked meats may not be QUITE so bad certainly doesn't mean I of course think raw is still much more optimal. We're all at different levels, and I admire many of you for being able to do it. I just simply won't, at least not in any large amounts, only maybe if I'm swallowing frozen bits of liver or something. Which is stuff I should be doing. I have been eating a decent bit of suet. I swallow mouth fulls very quickly with water. The kidney taste and smell turns me off.
That wasn't a smart a** comment. Nothing in your thread is about a raw paleo diet. Mg is chemical and it is produced like all supplements with a variety of chemical processes which were not invented in paleo times. ; )
You are complaining about health issues and asking about something that is not apropos here.
I have no doubt that Mg helps you and I wish you good luck.
We have found that once we acclimatized to raw food, we need to eat a lot less and the logistics of cooking etc disappear so life is easier. Also illnesses seem to disappear or not appear in the first place.
Consuming raw meat is not so bad if you can come up with recipes that ease you into it. Some raw food grosses me out also, so I take that as a sign not to eat it.
KIdney/chicken is gross to me as well. So is anything ground up. Liver we can take in small amounts. We chop up beef etc and chew it well. If it's too hard to eat, throw some kind of flavouring onto it till you get used to it.
There is a thread here somewhere on raw recipes.
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Consuming raw meat is not so bad if you can come up with recipes that ease you into it. Some raw food grosses me out also, so take that as a sign not to eat it.
KIdney/chicken is gross to me as well. So is anything ground up. Liver we can take in small amounts. We chop up beef etc and chew it well. If it's too hard to eat, throw some kind of flavouring onto it till you get used to it.
There is a thread here somewhere on raw recipes.
Right there are some foods I really don't like. I've come up with a "raw ketchup" recipe which makes anything delicious. A cup of (home made) sun dried tomatoes, half a lime, 1 tbls raw honey, and some sea salt. Also for other foods I just throw some lime on it and that helps. I imagine there are tons of raw herbs you can put on food too.
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i started eating raw meat by cutting it up into small pieces and eating it will poached eggs. i'd only eat a few pieces, and i would dip the meat into the egg yolk. i topped the whole thing with loads of herbamare (a salt blend). it took me three weeks to ditch the herbamare and actually start like the meat raw. it helps if the meat is room temperature when you eat it. a dehydrator might help too.
i eat liver, but i found a way to make it tasty for me. i cut it up into little pieces and dehydrate it at 85 F for half the day or so. i've yet to eat any organs straight up and fresh.
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i started eating raw meat by cutting it up into small pieces and eating it will poached eggs. i'd only eat a few pieces, and i would dip the meat into the egg yolk. i topped the whole thing with loads of herbamare (a salt blend). it took me three weeks to ditch the herbamare and actually start like the meat raw. it helps if the meat is room temperature when you eat it. a dehydrator might help too.
i eat liver, but i found a way to make it tasty for me. i cut it up into little pieces and dehydrate it at 85 F for half the day or so. i've yet to eat any organs straight up and fresh.
We dehydrate it in the fridge on a metal rack.That is a very nice way to do it. Lots of threads on making jerky.
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We dehydrate it in the fridge on a metal rack.That is a very nice way to do it. Lots of threads on making jerky.
that's what i do with my muscle meat :D
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Magnesium works as a glutamate antagonist, if you look into the concept of excitotoxins you can see a likely reason as to why this works for you.
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The Natural Calm Citrate powder brand. I stumbled upon the fact that an anxiety issue can be related to not enough mag. Anxiety has been a constant issue for me since my symptoms started over a decade ago. The mag lessens it considerably and its getting better the longer I use it (about 3 weeks in so far).
Generally one type of red meat in the morning, or on the rare occasion veg (or suet, which I've been having once a week or so for breakfast). I eat a dozen and and a half eggs or so a week, half of them raw, half cooked. For lunch I almost always eat meat to satiety (I cook all of my meat, but not overcook. I rarely under cook now though too).
A few hours later I'll eat a lot of a type of vegetable (or a few pieces of fruit now that its getting warm out). Then for dinner its usually meat and vegetables, or (twice a week or so) a nut, berry, raw egg, coconut, chocolate type concoction. I swing between 100 grams of protein up to 200 on some days. I eat a few hundred grams of feta cheese per week now, which I seem to do fine on. This can be interspersed with other random extra meals of meat and vegetables on some days, like the weekends.
No matter what I eat I don't think dietary magnesium will be enough.
I don't get particularly thirsty, mhikl, but I do seem to drink more than most people. I've definitely noticed I have to sip it throughout the day, as I deplete it very fast and the symptoms begin to return.
I see you eat cooked foods. Make your you never eat any of the excitotoxins on this list. http://www.truthinlabeling.org/hiddensources.html (http://www.truthinlabeling.org/hiddensources.html)
I would also recommend 1-3 grams of Omega 3 DHA oil per day. It's important that it's DHA concentrated, not EPA, and of high quality. It's the DHA component that protects against excitotoxicty and it's also anti-inflammatory. If you notice fish burps or stomach pains it is probably not a very high quality supplement.
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in response to bi's confession that he is not eating "full raw", i say...
"who cares"?
i'm sure many of the online guests (and many members) who constantly peruse this forum are not on a full raw paleo diet, either. this forum is not only a place where some (members) can commune and converse with the commonality of living out similar lifestyle choices, more importantly, it is a resource for some very fantastic and comprehensive information regarding diet and nutrition. if bi finds help here, i think it's good. while i don't profess at this time to completely be raw "paleo" (i am raw omnivorous), after 14 months, i'm about 98% there. the very few things left on my list of food items to omit from my diet are gradually being replaced by alternatives, as i create new recipes and dishes, and as my diet evolves to be what it needs to be, for me. the more i learn from this forum and it's members, the closer i come to my goal of being 100%. the process will take as long as it needs to. it's the end goal of healthy eating and living that are important.
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Yes. Unfortunately some of us just can't go full raw meat. There can be a wide range of reasons, all valid to that person. But they can still believe in it as a path to better wellness (and there is a lot of other raw things you can eat besides meat).
My plan is to start consuming at least some raw organs a week. I think its the biggest thing my diet lacks at the moment. I'll do this by cutting them into small pieces, freezing them and downing them. I experimented with raw meat last year, and I'm not looking to bite into that anymore.
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Barefoot,
Throw some flavour on it like mustard or whatever you like till you get past that part.
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or maybe your raw meat source tastes bad. especially if it is grain fed.
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Thanks to everyone who recommended Natural Calm.
After seeing multiple people make positive reports about the Natural Calm Mg, I gave it another try. In the past I tried a sample size that I realized was too little to make much of a judgement. I bought a container of it and found that it digests more easily than the "Super Mag" powder I had. I can believe the claims that it's more absorbable.
Because it's so absorbable, it doesn't help move the bowels as much as less absorbable magnesiums, but I found that I can add just a little bit of epsom salt (Mg sulfate), about 1/4 tsp, to give it sufficient kick when needed. I find epsom salt too nasty tasting to ingest on its own. I also take epsom salt baths now and then.
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I think it might be a more person to person basis. Mag Calm, which is mag citrate, gives me watery shits. Mag glycinate does not.
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Interesting, thanks for sharing the TMI. ;D The Super Mag contains Mg gluconate, aprartate, carbonate and citrate, but no glycinate. Mg Natural Calm does contain some Mg carbonate too, which along with sulphate is one that most strongly moves the bowels for me. Citrate works more gently for me than carbonate and thus seems to absorb better while still providing some hydration and movement in the bowels, unless it's the small amount of carbonate that's doing that.