Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Hot Topics => Topic started by: pioneer on July 18, 2010, 12:16:55 pm
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I once read a book called "lights out", by TS Wiley and Bent Formby. It was all about sleep and melatonin. She stated that it is our innate desire to crave sugar in the summer while the fruit is in season as we simultaneously increase our insulin resistance to store fat. The problem is with the invention of the lightbulb, humans are not going to sleep when it gets dark out so we always think its summer. Apparently we should be sleeping all through the night, even during those long 14-16 hour winter nights. Our bodies are conditioned to sleeping 7-8 hours or less like the length of darkness on summer night: so we always have insulin sensitivity and crave sugars because we think its summer. It seems like a far fetched theory to me but could be plausible. Sweetness however, is associated nutrition in nature. A prime example is sweet fruits provide many nutrients and vitamin c that prevent scurvy. Inuit and indigenous tribes that solely eat meat and no fruit get their vitamin c from adrenal glands (which happen to be the richest known source of vitamin c) and disperse individual portions to their tribe members. Also, raw meat in general contains vitamin C before cooking. C can also be found in stomach lining I think. I'm getting off topic, but does anyone think the sleep-crave theory has any validity?
heres the link to the book
http://www.amazon.com/Lights-Out-Sleep-Sugar-Survival/dp/0671038680
Once again, Im gonna post a shawn croxton video. Love the guy, he speaks for the people and in search for the truth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeeAVkF_TeE
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I don't believe in it. Humans have been using fire for quite sometime now. Sure its not as convenient as a light bulb but we could still easily roam in the dark with a torch.
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I don't believe in it. Humans have been using fire for quite sometime now. Sure its not as convenient as a light bulb but we could still easily roam in the dark with a torch.
I understand this but people underestimate the importance of sleep all the time. Im sure that this has huge relevance in our lives. Staying up till 2am is certainly not paleo. The thing I dont understand is how does anyone really know the recovery cycles? I mean is there any accurate ways of being certain we physiologically repair between 10pm and 2am, or psychologically repair between 2am and 6am?
I am sure our natural sleep cycles is pretty much half the battle in health. It is the reason why bears hibernate in the winter. No one would say it doesnt matter if bears hybernate or not. I feel that it is the same with us.
I am skeptical about much of this theory but I will stand with the notion of sleeping with the moon and waking with the sun.
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Unfortunately I think this may be one of those things that we will never know for sure. However I will say that even if I tried I would not be able to sleep 16 consecutive hours. Also bears don't hibernate for "repair" they do it so that they don't have to find food during the winter.
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I know that, but who knows how long the caveman on a raw diet could have slept. I dont think its bad staying up a little after dark but people who stay up all night and sleep during the day are doing it all wrong.
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I dont think its bad staying up a little after dark but people who stay up all night and sleep during the day are doing it all wrong.
Couldn't agree more.
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yeah, I mean we all know about the indians and their after dark parties around the fire, but in general people didnt stay up too late.
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Actually I just saw a history channel episode on this subject. It was called afraid of the dark. I don't know how to get a hold of a copy but it was very interesting.
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thanks I hope I can find it on youtube.
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Why is it then that I normally feel so much more tired during the daylight hours, especially if it is hot, than during the night?
I actually don't believe humans should be strictly diurnal or strictly nocturnal. I live in a very hot desert-like climate, and sleeping during the hottest hours of the day while staying awake more during the cooler nights seems a lot better idea to me. Extreme heat causes me to feel very sluggish and fatigued, as well as easily irritable at having to make the slightest movements.
During a time while I was unemployed and had for a time, given up on finding a new job because of the terrible economy, I would only sleep when my body told me I was tired enough to fall asleep. I would wake up whenever I naturally woke, and not because I was woken by any alarms. I would never try to sleep if I did not feel tired, no matter what time it was, nor would I ever set my alarm to wake me at any specific times.
During this time, I noticed that my sleeping schedule normally rotated. There would be a few days where I would sleep during the day, and be awake all night, then a few days later I was sleeping for half the day, and half the night, then a few days later I was sleeping all the night and awake all day, then sleeping half the night and half the day, and so on. Being that I spent most of this time inside an air-conditioned house, my sleep was mostly unaffected by temperature. At times I did stay in an un-airconditioned house, which would sometimes reach temperatures of 90 degrees (F) I was far more inclined to sleep during the day, but since the house was my mother's and since she strictly believes in a diurnal sleeping schedule, she would often interrupt my day-sleep and tell me to go to bed at night.
I think that people should only sleep if their body feels the need to sleep, and only wake when people feel the need to wake, regardless of the position of the sun, rather than forcing themselves to sleep at night and forcing themselves awake in the mornings with alarm clocks. However, this becomes nearly impossible when one has a schedule of work/school that they cannot be late for.
As far as staying up until 2am "not being paleo," how do you know when they slept and when they were awake? I know they probably were more often awake during the day since that was when most prey-animals were also awake, so they would need to be awake during the day to hunt, but that doesn't mean they would necessarily be strictly diurnal. But do you have any sources that show that cavemen were definitely diurnal?
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If you feel better staying up during the night, and sleeping during the day then by all means do what feels best. However science knows that melatonin secretes from the pineal gland(I think) as soon as darkness comes. There have even been cases where people cannot sleep because a switchlight is on in their room. Even if your eyes are closed, your brain knows whether or not there is even the smallest bit of light. Even the smallest light can disrupt melatonin. Melatonin is one of the most underlooked hormones and may even play more of a role in repair then testosterone. Melatonin works with testosterone and growth hormone to repair the body. It is known that nocturnal animals do not have the same melatonin type reaction we have. That heat exhaustion is likely your adrenal glands. Everyone exhausts their adrenals when the first hot days of summer come. In the first few 100+ degree summer days I am lethargic and usually sleep all day. However after about a week I adapt and am fine to be outside in the heat. You do make a point about the heat. I dont think paleo men were exercising outside in the summer much, but just lounging around, sleeping, and hunting. However, on the flipside, people who live in the winter would need to stay up during the day and sleep at night because its so cold.
To answer your question of feeling so tired during the day, it could be a factor in your insulin or adrenals. I used to have the same problem. Had mild adrenal exhaustion pumping out too much cortisol. If thats the case, try to destress yourself any way possible, dont exercise as much, get more sleep, and eat raw foods. The insulin and adrenals also relate to eachother, and if the blood sugar is too high (type 2) it could be making adrenals pump out cortisol because of the stress and lower testosterone in the process.
I lowered my bloodsugar when going on this diet by doing ketogenic and I never had as much energy during the day. My theory is that going low carb or ZC will produce the healthiest blood sugar level, thus making adrenals happy and insulin work properly.
Many people who tell me they are tired during the day I just tell them to cut out all the sugar and stimulants, esp caffeine. Almost immediately they feel better during the day. You want an average blood sugar level for sustained energy. Spiking insulin is a result of high blood sugar, then once the excess insulin lowers the blood sugar, the blood sugar is lower than before, hence the fatigue.
hope that helps a little. But, good point with the position of the earth one is on can impact sleep cycles.
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Hm, I had never heard about Melatonin and stuff, very interesting.. I can usually just as easily fall asleep with the light on as off, and I know a lot of times I'll start to feel sleepy once the sun starts to shine in through my windows.. but maybe I just have messed up Melatonin or glands or something, lol. My sleeping schedule has never been very regular except for when I was in school, and then I always had the most horrible times trying to wake up in the mornings no matter how early I went to bed the night before. You ever get that feeling right after you wake up and you try to grip onto something, like a cap to twist it off, and it just feels like you hand is useless and can't do it? That was pretty much how my entire body felt every single morning. Not fun.
Ever since getting out of school and not being forced on such a rigorous sleeping schedule though, I actually haven't felt that way in years.
as far as trying to combat the fatigue, lol.. I hardly every feel stressed out, I rarely, if ever, exercise much more than a bit of walking around during work (bad, I know, but I'm extremely lazy), and I tend to sleep about 10 - 12 hours a day.. sometimes more.
I also rarely, if ever, eat any candies, cookies, ice creams, treats, chocolates, or sweets, I pretty much avoid anything sweet other than fresh fruit (my idea of the perfect dessert is a bowl full of strawberries, pineapple, blackberries, and kiwi.. yummy!) and sugary juices to drink (because I hate the taste of water, but when there's milk and fruit available I prefer to consume those for hydration than the bad for me sugar juices) and have mostly cut soda from my diet altogether (neither do I drink coffee).
So, uh.. lol, I really don't know what causes so much of my fatigue, except that maybe I actually don't get enough exercise, and maybe my somewhat usual SAD diet was to blame.. I'm hoping that starting to eat most of my foods raw, will help with my fatigue, though.
Thank you for your advice, though.
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Also along with the whole sleep thing, I've noticed there were times where I could go into something I like to think of as "hibernation mode," where I would sleep for a few days straight, only waking up about every 10 - 12 hours to eat/drink something and use the bathroom, before going right back to sleep again for another 10 - 12 hours. I've also used this "hibernation mode" during times that were low on food, as an alternative to fasting. I've only done it for at most about 3 - 4 days before either there was food again, or there was something I needed to stay awake for (like work/school/family stuff/or even feeling guilty for sleeping too much) though I'm pretty sure I could have continued like that for at least a week, if not much longer.
I don't know if this is a bad thing, since it is pretty much controllable by me, or if any other human is capable of such a thing.. nor do I know if it really is a type of state of true hibernation, since I have no idea if hibernating creatures wake up every once in a while to eat or uh.. relieve themselves, or anything, or if I am in any sort of deeper/hibernation-type sleep than normal. I have no idea, though I would think not. But I don't know what it is that makes me capable of sleeping for days on end.
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When you talk about staying up all night and sleeping in the day, you're talking about in a house, where the temperature and lighting stay the same, where you know there's no predators hiding round the corner, where you know the way so you're not going to fall down a hole and die, where you can see your food in the fridge.
Also, you talk about being irritable in the heat etc, that's because your clothes stop your body from perspiring effectively, as well as insulating you unnecessarily... Paleo people would have no problem hunting in the day during the summer, because they weren't wearing clothes, nor would you be uncomfortable if you were not wearing clothes.. Sweat keeps the body from overheating.. it evaporates and takes the heat away with it.. if you wear a t-shirt, it can't evaporate and the heat stays with your body.. As well as, the t-shirt slows down the heat from leaving without the sweat too..
Sweat is one of the main adaptations that helped early human catch faster mammals(in hot climates...), whereas the other mammals have to stop to pant in order to cool-down, the human can keep running and cool-down as he goes. Some other adaptations were: Tight, long leg(calf & hamstring) tendons(to recycle energy, think springs), bipedalism(less energy wastage[less things to move and more consistent motion{like cycling} as opposed to the heave-glide{like rowing} motion], which means the other mammals tire themselves out sooner whereas the human can keep running over longer distances), possibly also the ability of the human to breath through their mouth while running.
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Hm, being inside a house might be a major factor of my sleeping schedule, however as far as being able to see, outside I can still see pretty much perfectly well on any clear night when the moon is out, and especially if the moon is full.. and I also don't put much stock in being able to see well anyways.. my natural eyes have terrible eyesight, and anything even armslength away is pretty blurry for me. If I was just using my natural eyes, I'd be pretty much just as blind in full daylight as most humans would be in the dead of night with only a sliver of moon. I wear contacts to see, though.
Also, you assume that during hot times I am also wearing clothes.. I actually prefer not to be wearing clothes, or wearing very little clothing, no matter if the temperature is cool or hot. I think actually this has increased my intolerance to heat, because whereas before when I was normally always wearing clothes, I was used to being so heavily insulated even when it was very hot, and my body got used to it, so that when it became unbearably hot, removing some clothing was "extra" cooling. Now that I am used to very little clothing, I am not used to so much heat anymore, and I also no longer have that "extra" sense of being cooled by being able to remove clothes.
also, perspiration only works effectively in dry climates. When you're in a humid climate, the perspiration is not able to dry, therefore unable to cool you. While I do live in a dry climate, the insides of houses still become humid, so during those hot days it's pretty much a choice of whether you want to be in 115ºF dry outside weather or 90Fº humid indoor weather. You feel over-hot either way.
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my advice- move. Lol I dont know what else to say. If your body is fine with your current lifestyle then thats great, but if your always exhausted because of the extreme heat, is it really worth it ten years down the line to be in the same situation and regretting not moving. Also, most people I know get tired as soon as it gets dark. I am a waiter in a restaurant and as soon as the lights go dim, we all feel groggy and tired. However, once the manager turns the lights up again, we feel good again. IDK what your situation is though?
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I might move out of here someday, I don't know, but for now I don't have much of a choice.
And usually I actually feel quite a bit more invigorated by the moonlight and the cool night air than in sunlight and hot day air. I work at a pizza place delivering pizza, so actually most of the time I'm out driving around in the sunlight, but my car also has no air conditioning so it's usually uncomfortably hot and I can't wait until the sun goes down and things cool off.
Another thing that makes me feel actually rather hyper and energetic is rainy weather. i LOVE rainy weather! it makes me just want to run all around outside and go crazy, lol.
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I might move out of here someday, I don't know, but for now I don't have much of a choice.
And usually I actually feel quite a bit more invigorated by the moonlight and the cool night air than in sunlight and hot day air. I work at a pizza place delivering pizza, so actually most of the time I'm out driving around in the sunlight, but my car also has no air conditioning so it's usually uncomfortably hot and I can't wait until the sun goes down and things cool off.
Another thing that makes me feel actually rather hyper and energetic is rainy weather. i LOVE rainy weather! it makes me just want to run all around outside and go crazy, lol.
Haha, I absolutely love rainy weather, especially in the summer. I usually go outside and run and jump around in it. I also love being indoors when it rains and watch movies all day. I wish it rained every night and was sunny every day, that would be great. As for your feeling of invigoration at night, Id have to agree, I feel that as well, however for me I think it is the feeling of freedom after a days work.
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My sleep schedule is messed up and I experience insomnia. Sleeping is very tiring to me and I wake up feeling terrible. The rest of the day I feel terrible and weak like a zombie, but after about 7:00-9:00 PM I begin to feel slightly better and have more energy.
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My sleep schedule is messed up and I experience insomnia. Sleeping is very tiring to me and I wake up feeling terrible. The rest of the day I feel terrible and weak like a zombie, but after about 7:00-9:00 PM I begin to feel slightly better and have more energy.
That's sounds a lot like me, actually, except maybe not so bad and I don't really have insomnia.
I've been feeling rather more energized so far since starting raw, but it's only been about a day or two lol, so I don't know if it will last or go away or get better.
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you guys sound a lot like you may have adrenal exhaustion. I had that for a year and it was the worst time of my life. Getting on the RPD and making myself have a regular sleep schedule cured it completely. Diet should account for 80% of curing the issue if you eat Raw foods.
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Adrenal fatigue...
I suppose I should be getting to bed.
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I would be in Wolf and Moonstalker's camp here... (Moonstalker - what an appropriate name.) I used to say that my sleep schedule was all messed up, but I don't anymore. I embrace it, it works for me, it's flexible. I am self-employed, usually work evenings, and function very well evenings. One of my very favorite things to do (I consider it a luxury) is to fall asleep when I want to sleep and not set an alarm - I like to wake up and get up when I'm ready to do so. I don't usually oversleep unless I'm compensating for previous lack of sleep, just need the extra rest, or I'm depressed. ;D I do set my alarm if I have to get up in a few hours and want to make sure I don't oversleep.
I'm just a night owl. Even as a child. I didn't want to sleep at night. It doesn't matter if I'm awake all day and exhausted in the evening, I just don't want to sleep before 2 am. I'll fight it.
Several years ago, my holistic practitioner muscle tested that my body did not produce melatonin. So she recommended that I take some around 6 pm so I can fall asleep at night... uh, I'm not sure why/if I saw her for that issue because I never bought the melatonin. I thought about it, but my nocturnal instinct was probably like, "Ah, you don't really want it."
Very generally, my "natural" schedule is to go to bed around 4 am - give or take four hours. I often go to bed at 6 am or 8 am. I get plenty of afternoon sunlight and I darken pretty easily, so I'm not lacking any sun (not in so cal!). In addition, my sleep schedule changes if I have to or choose to be awake earlier in the day. And sometimes I'm like on a 36-hour or 48-hour "day" schedule. But like Wolf, I feel relieved to avoid the hot daytime sun of Southern California. I shut out most of the daylight in my bedroom while sleeping and it just feels right for me to rest during this time of day.
I'm sure in paleo times there was the small majority who were nocturnal. Even just for safety - nightwatches. And just because today we would feel so uncomfortable/vulnerable/bored if we were to mill about in the dark nighttime without the modern conveniences of electric light or fire, paleo people had to be like a different breed. Even AV talks about the night vision he developed from living outdoors (WWTL pg. 119). Imagine the night vision we - er, I mean, paleo people had living in real darkness every night (except for moon and stars). Just as we have night workers today (bartenders, graveyard shift workers, bouncers, police officers, etc.), I can totally see the paleo night hunters - hunting in darkness, even without moonlight - supplementing the group's diet with nocturnal prey. Paleo people were a different breed. Imagine how heightened their other-than-visual senses were. And being in tune with their environment, directly connected to their source of sustenance (the supreme locavore), and just vibing with the earth. I'm sure it was rough, but survival is its own meditation.
So I don't believe that people who stay up all night and sleep during the day are doing it all wrong, but it's definitely not for everyone. I've read that a daily routine - and a diurnal one - contributes to health, youthfulness, well-being, etc., but I've adapted to my nocturnality instead of fighting it, so I don't think it has aged or worn me out. Wolf, Moonstalker, and I were probably the ones looking out for our diurnal paleo buddies while they slept - so no nocturnal sasquatch or giant cat snatched you up. And we got you fresh nocturnal meat to enjoy upon waking.
Oh and lastly, I think paleo sleep cycles were likely very different. I can function well with two 4-hour nap sessions spread out in 24 hours. In other words, I doubt that the majority of diurnal paleos tucked in at 10:00 pm and slept soundly (even on such a great RPD ;)) for six hours or so. Depending on the climate and environment (dangers, predatory animals, etc.), paleos probably napped 3 hours here, nighthunted a couple hours there, slept in a cool cave for 5 hours during extreme daytime temperatures here, etc. Just as the RPD frequency of eating and the amount eaten in one or a couple (maybe a few) sittings are so widely variant and different from the "3 square meals" or "5 smaller meals per day" of today's modern eating, I'm sure paleo sleep/rest/catnap - frequency and amount - was way different from modern sleeping today. The end. :D
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you guys sound a lot like you may have adrenal exhaustion. I had that for a year and it was the worst time of my life. Getting on the RPD and making myself have a regular sleep schedule cured it completely. Diet should account for 80% of curing the issue if you eat Raw foods.
I suspected it to be adrenal related.
(Moonstalker - what an appropriate name.)
lol ;D
Your theory sounds very interesting and makes sense. Night was definitely a time that would make it necessary for a number of people to stay awake in most climates. Also, humans are supposedly more active during the full moon because the extra light brings about hunting opportunities.
When my sleeping ability improves I will try to split my sleeping session.
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Adrenal fatigue...
I suppose I should be getting to bed.
Its not necessarily going to bed at night and waking up when its light out. The main thing is training your body to get into a circadian rythm (natural sleep cycle). If you can train yourself to go to bed and wake up at the same times every day, that'll be great for you. However, besides that, curing adrenal exhaustion for me was mostly accomplished through a raw diet with plenty of raw meat and fat.
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Awesome explination Cinna, and I agree with you.
And, for me at least, whenever I go to bed and wake up at the same time every day I feel like crap.. I prefer to have a more erratic sleeping schedule, and like Cinna said, paleo's probably didn't have such sound sleeping schedules either. But it seems just like no diet is the same for everyone, maybe no sleeping schedule is that same for everyone, either.
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I doubt that the majority of diurnal paleos tucked in at 10:00 pm and slept soundly (even on such a great RPD ;)) for six hours or so.
Maybe they wouldnt need that much sleep at all since the RPD diet takes care of most of recovery. Aajonus says he sleeps only 4hrs a night after being raw for 40 years
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Our bodies are conditioned to sleeping 7-8 hours or less like the length of darkness on summer night: so we always have insulin sensitivity and crave sugars because we think its summer. It seems like a far fetched theory to me but could be plausible. Sweetness however, is associated nutrition in nature. A prime example is sweet fruits provide many nutrients and vitamin c that prevent scurvy. Inuit and indigenous tribes that solely eat meat and no fruit get their vitamin c from adrenal glands (which happen to be the richest known source of vitamin c) and disperse individual portions to their tribe members. Also, raw meat in general contains vitamin C before cooking. C can also be found in stomach lining I think. I'm getting off topic, but does anyone think the sleep-crave theory has any validity?
heres the link to the book
http://www.amazon.com/Lights-Out-Sleep-Sugar-Survival/dp/0671038680
I agree with the theory about sleeping when it is dark. In the Inuit country of the Arctic Circle they actually do get a bit of berries in the summer with the long days. I visited there and nowadays is not comparable to what it was, as they have all the technology we have, but the people tend to sleep more in the winter because I asked some of the locals that question. In the summer I was out for a walk at 04:30 and I bumped into a bunch of kids out playing. (Inuvik NWT Canada 63 degrees North)
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Maybe they wouldnt need that much sleep at all since the RPD diet takes care of most of recovery. Aajonus says he sleeps only 4hrs a night after being raw for 40 years
aajonus eats bread, His definition of raw is 80 per cent raw
And Paul Nison wrote a similar book about daylight eating, adrenals, exhaustion stress, and light, and light's role in health
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aajonus eats bread, His definition of raw is 80 per cent raw
And Paul Nison wrote a similar book about daylight eating, adrenals, exhaustion stress, and light, and light's role in health
No he does not, he hasn't for decades. This topic has already been beaten and battered in this forum. He is 100% raw. Maybe you got it mixed up with his endorsement of cooked starches for people who crave them. But he certainly does not eat bread himself.
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4 hours sleep doesn't mean anything
so did margaret thatcher, i doubt she ate raw paleo
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4 hours sleep doesn't mean anything
so did margaret thatcher, i doubt she ate raw paleo
There are people who get by on very little sleep. Maharishi Mahesh Yogi was one and I doubt if he had a piece of meat in his life. Some people catnap or powersleep or whatever you want to call it.
I suspect that it helps to be very healthy to do it without problems.
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Pioneer,
I finally got hold of that book at the library "Lights Out". He tells quite a compelling story. Thanks for the excellent read.
One interesting thing he says is that we are all offspring of people who have managed to live in the current (NPI) environment where lighting and carbohydrates are everywhere and so staying awake is possible. I suspect that being a night owl in a non-electric society would have been a non-issue/ challenge. It's one thing to stay up all night on the computer or driving around town or working or watching TV or whatever, but unless you have developed excellent vision, roaming around in the dark can be challenging.
His story about the native Americans being one of the last to adapt to carbohydrates and electric lighting makes perfect sense.
Personally I know that flying in the nightime is fraught with danger. Particularly all nighters. I feel for the airline guys who go across the pond at night. They are not bangin on all four. I don't care what anyone says. I have gone on medevacs at night and been on approach when I have to pinch myself and keep talking, moving and have the other guy verify information/settings. Touching down is like being allowed to breathe again. Throw in an emergency..... A brief look at nightime accidents tells the story instantly... The guys were brain dead, long before their body followed suit. Same with doctors working 48 hour shifts. That is nutty.
I am starting to plan my life so I am asleep after dark. To me it's like putting money in the bank.
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Glad you liked the book raw al. It made perfect sense to me. One thing I liked that the author said is that our pacteria get pissed off if we dont sleep and that as soon as we begin to sleep, the LPL bacteria shuts down and our immune system can recharge throughout the night. I can attest to this, for whenever I get very little sleep, I usually wake up only to have stomach pains and diarrhea. I feel that making healthy stools is directly related to sleep and the bacteria that rest while you sleep.
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I was interested in this because I came form a family where they would watch tv til about 12 at night.
it definitely affected my sleep patters.
I read all bright light 3 hours before bed overstiumaltes you, causes stress to the body, and thus causes adrenal fatigue, which in turn will cause thyroid problems etc.
Keep it simple, if its dark outside, use dim lit lamps in your house, not bright overhead ones which trick the body. or use candlelight. keep computer and tv use to a minimum, and try not to before bed. be aware how artificial light affects health. Also, paul nison said that whenever light enters the eye, it triggers something in the body to keep digestion going, when you shouldn't be eating.
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I was interested in this because I came form a family where they would watch tv til about 12 at night.
it definitely affected my sleep patters.
I read all bright light 3 hours before bed overstiumaltes you, causes stress to the body, and thus causes adrenal fatigue, which in turn will cause thyroid problems etc.
Keep it simple, if its dark outside, use dim lit lamps in your house, not bright overhead ones which trick the body. or use candlelight. keep computer and tv use to a minimum, and try not to before bed. be aware how artificial light affects health. Also, paul nison said that whenever light enters the eye, it triggers something in the body to keep digestion going, when you shouldn't be eating.
Yeah, its called melatonin its a powerful hormone that is secreted when you sleep, and its not just entering the eye though. There is this phenomenon not yet understood, but when you are sleeping, with your eyes closed, your pituitary gland (where melatonin is produced) in your brain knows when it is light or dark. Studies were done on brainwaves and melatonin levels while sleeping. Apparently, even that little nightlight in the corner of the room affects melatonin. Also, something as simple as having your computer on in your room while you are sleeping can effect melatonin because of the electroradiation. I cant sleep well unless the room is completely dark and no computer is turned on. Some people will go as far as cutting the power to their house. Nevertheless, empirical evidence shows that this is very effective.
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Pioneer,
I tried going to bed a lot earlier last night and felt great. I think your idea was spot on.
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Yeah, its called melatonin its a powerful hormone that is secreted when you sleep, and its not just entering the eye though. There is this phenomenon not yet understood, but when you are sleeping, with your eyes closed, your pituitary gland (where melatonin is produced) in your brain knows when it is light or dark.effective.
Is it not just that light passes through the eye lid? I can close my eyes and still see when someone turns a light on/off.
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Is it not just that light passes through the eye lid? I can close my eyes and still see when someone turns a light on/off.
That is true, but that is also along the lines with what I am saying. When your eyes are closed, your body can sense even if there is a little light in the room, and even when you are unconscious or sleeping. I meant that the light can travel through your closed eyes and signal to the pituitary to suppress melatonin and also disrupt brain waves such as alpha, gamma, and beta. By all means, you could sleep great in a bright room with one of those eye covers. i use one every time I go on a plane. The best and most natural alarm clock is light. I am one of those people who does not wake up easy to sounds, but when there is even just a minute amount of light, I wake. I think this is how it is supposed to be. This is why the most important thing must be to keep the room as dark as possible. Get some of those drapes that block out 100% of light. This is the only way we can get good sleep if we stay up too late. if we cant abide by light and dark cycles of the sun, we have to create our own. I go to bed at 12am every day and wake up at 8:30 or 9, but I never wake up from the sun, which rises at 6, because I have those great drapes.
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Pioneer,
I tried going to bed a lot earlier last night and felt great. I think your idea was spot on.
Thanks, glad it helped. Sleep is the #1 factor in physical performance, probably mental performance too. It is said that from 2-4am your hormones recharge, other parts of the night recharge immune system, psychological and physiological functions, but I forget what times. This is why it is imperative to go to bed sometime before 12. Now if you create your own dark environment, which you can ensure at least 8-9 hrs of dark sleep it may not matter, and Im sure the times may vary (i.e. your 3-4am, might be another persons 2-4am). Plus, I think the studies were done with people who went to sleep at 10pm, but I could be wrong. More and more recent research on sleep suggests that we really need to be getting to bed by 10pm, but Idk.
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Hm. It would've probably been done for people who are starting work at 9am I suppose.
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I have not finished the book but he mentioned that there was a study done in which the pointed the light from a fibre rod at the skin behind the subjects knee and the melatonin production dropped quite a bit even from this small amount of light.. So he says that any source of light in the room including electronic doo dahs will affect your health. He also says a minimum of 9.5 hours of sleep from September on.
He says that in the summer you can eat drink and be merry but come the fall back off slow down and hibernate.
He says that cancer is a result of our lifestyle and he goes through explanations of the various forms of cancer and the reasoning behind the statements.
I am not a biological student so he lost me on some of his explanations but he made sense.
I am not sure I like all of his logic as he is a lover of supplements and a few other items but I think his overall theory makes sense. BTW I am writing this in the dark with lights and the computer on... tee hee hee : ) Off to the land of Nod with Winkin and Blinkin........
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raw al, I must say I envy your progress with sleep. I am a busy college student, who usually stays up til at least 12, so I am bad. I think I am going to really try going to bed at 11 and waking at 8:30 now. Thanks for letting me know about your devotion, it is inspiring me. Also, I have been feeling like horse poop lately because I have a girlfriend now, who actually thinks its cool I do raw paleo. Anyway, she keeps me up til 3am sometimes, I am exhausted. I guess I gotta man up and tell her I need my sleep.
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... He also says a minimum of 9.5 hours of sleep from September on.
Why the exact 9.5 hours of sleep? How do you determine that? What if you sleep 9.4?
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Why the exact 9.5 hours of sleep? How do you determine that? What if you sleep 9.4?
That is a huge question which can only be answered accurately by reading the book.
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That is a huge question which can only be answered accurately by reading the book.
I dont understand why you need a whole book to briefly explain how did he come up with that number.
This 9.5 thing is in contradiction with Aajonus theory that as one gets more and more clean, the sleep requirements should get lower.
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No, not at all, the premise of the book is you sleep mostly with the moon and are always awake with the sun. In other words, those long winter nights like 12-14hrs long, we should be hibernating, and those short summer nights like 5-6hrs long we should sleep, but be up and about the other 18 hrs. It is supposed to be a seasonal cycle. Sleep long in the winter and short in the summer. Sleeping long in the winter is especially smart because sleeping lowers our basal metabolism and makes us burn less calories, it is a way of not needing as much food in the winter when food is scarce.
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I dont understand why you need a whole book to briefly explain how did he come up with that number.
This 9.5 thing is in contradiction with Aajonus theory that as one gets more and more clean, the sleep requirements should get lower.
The world is full of theories. The belief that any author has a liplock on the truth is a bit inane. It's whatever works.
If I started to explain, there would be a chorus of detractors. Easiest just to tell you to read the book as that is what this thread is based on. I do not have the breadth of knowledge to explain his theory in a few short sentences. Neither did the two authors. That's why they wrote a book, not just a few sentences.
Pioneer answered as I was typing. Further to what he said, carbohydrates provides the fuel to stay awake but at a great cost regarding ones health because carbohydrates represent famine food.