Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Other Raw-Animal-Food Diets (eg:- Primal Diet/Raw Version of Weston-Price Diet etc.) => Raw Weston Price => Topic started by: ster546464@yahoo.co.uk on October 16, 2010, 10:45:04 pm
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The say, all the tribes weston price studied got ill eventually, he didnt study them properly, etc etc.
yet they ate a raw paleo diet ?? are they implying that the raw paleo diet made them ill ?
They counter this by saying they got ill because they cooked their meat, they ate grains, or they ate dairy.
Yet, not all the tribes ate dairy, not all the tribes ate grains either.
They cooked some of their meat, ate some raw aswell.
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:o Prepare for the wrath of Tyler. ;D
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-v -v -v -v -v -v -v -v -v -v l) l) l) l) l) l) l) l) l) l) l) l) :o :o :o :o :o >: >: >: >: >: >: >:
The above remarks in the opening post are the biggest load of b*ll*cks imaginable. None of the tribes Weston-Price studied practised a genuine rawpalaeodiet. The closest to rawpalaeo were the Inuit and yet even they ate something like 50 percent of their diet in cooked form. The rest all did something wrong, such as eating grains or raw dairy or whatever.
Now, many HG tribes benefitted by undergoing caloric restriction and Intermittent Fasting which helped alleviate some of the negative effects of their deficient non-rawpalaeodiets - plus they went in for greater levels of exercise which, just like fasting, has been shown by scientists to reduce a little the levels of heat-created toxins in the body(well, only in the case of AGEs/advanced glycation end products). However, that, of course, does not make those HG diets remotely healthy, in and of themselves.
As for WP, he blithely ignored multiple evidence showing that some of his tribes were not remotely as healthy as he had claimed( 2 years ago, here,I gave previous examples re ill-health among the manioc-eating Maori, for example), plus his whirlwind tour around the world made it physically impossible for him to get sufficiently accurate data to support his silly claims.
This makes me yearn for the good old days of stocks and tarring-and-feathering.
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ahem, yes, other than that the usefulness in WP is in his observation that their were common denominators in various tribes of what they ate and what they did not despite their large variations in actual dietary makeup. People here are interested in a raw 'paleo' nutrition/lifestyle. Why would it be wrong to analyze or criticize peoples that obviously varied from this concept particularly when we do not enjoy their circumstance/food quality/conditions-of-health? If you feel like WAPF that one can just appropriate any old traditional way of eating and create the best health or cure all your ailments, power to you. Speaking for myself, I do not. Ah well, from other posts it sounds like you are not genuinely interested in hearing what other people have to say anyway and have it all figured out.
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I agree with you, but the people he studied certainly have better teeth than me, or anyone else in the westernised countries.
So what, they got ill. Was this after they introduced westernised foods ?
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The say, all the tribes weston price studied got ill eventually, he didnt study them properly, etc etc.
yet they ate a raw paleo diet ?? are they implying that the raw paleo diet made them ill ?
They counter this by saying they got ill because they cooked their meat, they ate grains, or they ate dairy.
Yet, not all the tribes ate dairy, not all the tribes ate grains either.
They cooked some of their meat, ate some raw aswell.
you love to troll this forum.
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NO, I just want to understand why they hate weston price. So what, the man made a few mistakes in his research. His heart was in the right place and Im sure he enjoyed travelling the world.
So according to you, raw paleo eaters are invincible and will never get ill ?
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NO, I just want to understand why they hate weston price. So what, the man made a few mistakes in his research. His heart was in the right place and Im sure he enjoyed travelling the world.
So according to you, raw paleo eaters are invincible and will never get ill ?
LOL
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I agree with you, but the people he studied certainly have better teeth than me, or anyone else in the westernised countries.
hmm, yeah its because you are British.
but seriously, that IS the whole conundrum of WP, the research isn't in-it-of-itself bad (maybe could have been more thorough like Tyler suggests). It is the translation to modern peoples in modern conditions and its relevance which is under scrutiny. So while it could be totally possible (though not nec. so) that a living HG type eating a fair amount of cooked traditional foods might have better health than a RVAF dieter that spent 20+ years living a typical industrial life, the important thing is which diet is better for making that person healthier. There is no hypocrisy in being specific about one wants and doesn't. Although I agree that some of the 'bashing' for reasons of promoting fermented grains and dairy (which I believe are health foods compared to how most of the world eats) is pretty unnecessary but would only be hypocritical if people in turn eat these things no?
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you love to troll this forum.
Yes, I agree, it does seem suspicious.
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Yes but he found tribes that didnt eat grains or dairy either.
He also found they ate some raw and some cooked.
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and
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Yes but he found tribes that didnt eat grains or dairy either.
He also found they ate some raw and some cooked.
Irrelevant as he wrongly suggested that all the various combinations were healthy. As for raw and cooked issues, also irrelevant as the cooked element meant that the tribespeople could not possibly have had the idyllic health that WP pretended they had, as cooked foods contain toxins in them , directly related to worsened aging effects etc.
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so your saying they got ill because they ate cooked food ? wow, you will do anything to prove weston price wrong.
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so your saying they got ill because they ate cooked food ? wow, you will do anything to prove weston price wrong.
Trolling again, I see....
try to read the previous entries I made showing how unhealthy the Maori were well BEFORE they took up Western diets. Then you might eventually grasp that Weston-Price did not take enough time to evalute properly the health of his tribes, and simply assumed, falsely, that the Noble Savage theory was right, without real evidence.
Aside from that, we have ample scientific studies showing the negative effects of eating cooked foods, so it is absurd to suggest that these cooked-eating HG tribes were somehow immune from such effects.
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so your saying they got ill because they ate cooked food ? wow, you will do anything to prove weston price wrong.
'wow' = shaming language
Now you've been outed what will you post next?
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what are you quoting this from.
At least I can refer to the weston price book for details, where do you get this information
And Weston Price himself said, the tribes got cavities, about 1 per 100, compared to the westernised sugar diet, where it was about 25 per 100,
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what are you quoting this from.
At least I can refer to the weston price book for details, where do you get this information
And Weston Price himself said, the tribes got cavities, about 1 per 100, compared to the westernised sugar diet, where it was about 25 per 100,
Try at least to read the past threads before making such absurd comments, where I quote the various links where it is mentioned just how badly the maoris did re health pre-Contact with Europeans. And cavities are irrelevant as really horrible dental health is mostly to do with SAD-eaters and dental health is only a tiny part of real health. In other words, having a dentist like WP state what is healthy is absurd as he was not even qualified as to real, general health.
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Okay.
How would you argue with durianriders ? I quoted to him weston a price and he mentioned the china study in response. What else can be said about 30bananasday(70 bananas actually) apart from the fact that eating all that fruit is just silly and ridiculous.
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The china study has already been shown to be flawed by numerous websites.
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2 things,
even if the weston price tribes ate dairy and grains and cooked food, his point was they were healthier than evryone eating westernised food. he did more than the teeth, explaining how they were generally happier and told of a man who ate a westernised diet had 'great difficulty' waking up in the morning compared to a man who ate a tribe diet, and other things not connected to teeth
secondly, the tribes were eating the best they could with what they had ! not all of them could eat a raw paleo diet for obvious reaons like a lack of animals, lack of food choices in general. for example the gaelics lived on fish and oats predominantly, the swiss lived on bread, dairy, and meat only once or twice a week.
they did the best they could from the land they were living on. it wasn't a competition to see who was healthiest.
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they did the best they could from the land they were living on. it wasn't a competition to see who was healthiest.
ster, the point of this forum (and intelligent discussion in general I believe) is to not state obvious things that everyone already knows but to find deeper truths (in this case health). if you are satisfied with the diet supplied by the WAPF as an interpretation of WAPs findings, than you should have no reason to argue with folks here or fruitarians or whatever you spend your time doing, that is, if you are even on a WAP-esq or paleo or raw diet which is increasingly doubtful.
the whole reason people are dismissive (which would not include everyone here) of WAP is that it is an oversimplification of what it means to be healthy -particularly for modern folks removed from such situations - not that the people studied were not healthy by modern low standards or did not do the best they could, or that WAP himself did not enjoy himself traveling or whatever. I personally don't believe these people were unhealthy as I already mentioned or had serious debilitating issues from their traditional foods but that doesn't mean it has value necessarily in my life, as i am not them.
can you bring any experience to this discussion whatsoever about how WAP or WAPF style diets have improved your health, to the point of making a RAF diet unnecessary or hypocritical?
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The point is that WP was solely qualified re dental health( and maybe not even then given that some of his dental-related theories have been heavily criticised in the past). His claims re other non-teeth-related subjects are generally without foundation, given his lack of expertise in them, and he did not spend enough time on each specific tribe to make a decent analysis of their health and lifestyle.
More to the point, the claim that HG diets were healthier than SAD diets is irrelevant as there were a number of aspects of HG diets which made them less healthy than rawpalaeo diets. Naturally, for anyone in ill-health, it would be stupid for us to advocate a WAPF-based diet consisting of things like dairy or grains or partially-cooked diets when so many of us have had past serious problems from eating such diets.
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Use your energy to argue with durianrider and Therawvoice on youtube, it would be more worthwhile.
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Use your energy to argue with durianrider and Therawvoice on youtube, it would be more worthwhile.
I tried, but they somehow blocked my comments. At any rate, the various points I have raised are simply ones already raised by a multitude of other RVAFers, so I am simply repeating the obvious.
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Durianriders/ therawvoice blocks everyone
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how long did you have mercury amalgams tylerdurden
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how long did you have mercury amalgams tylerdurden
Lasted c.10 years or so I think . Got rid of them c. 9-10 years ago.
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The WP study was good in that it attempted to cronicle civilizations that were becoming extinct and had no contact with VERY RECENT civilizations. These people were still civilized and suffered because of the human modified food they ate. If WP could have studied back about 3,000 years instead of a few hundred it would have been much better.
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That was just it - many of the tribes and peoples he visited were anything but cut off from others. 3000 years ago would not have been enough - at least 12,000 years ago would have been required given Neolithic foods ebing eaten plus more processing of foods involved in later periods etc., and for the best effect on health, c. 350,000 years ago.
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I havent read all of your posts, however you mentioned that drinking raw buffalo milk ruined your life or something ?
Did you live in Italy for some part of your life ? Or did you get it in the UK ?
How do you know it ruined your life ?
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I had various problems , early on in life, such as a near permanently runny nose which only vanished once I cut out all dairy, even raw for good. I had the raw buffalo milk in Nepal, in my childhood.
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fair enough
if raw dairy of any kind, sheep, goat, buffalo etc, cause problems, dont eat it/ drink it
at least try it first, because the evidence is there that it might help some people, but obviously not all