Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: viking on September 20, 2013, 01:46:45 pm
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Hello, new here, I suppose you can identify me as a "Recent convert".
I just had one question on raw fish (sashimi) now I have no problem going into a high quality/ high end sushi restaurant and ordering raw fish from the sushi bar, I suppose its because I "trust" the expert (sushi chef) but I have some slight, very slight, reservations on purchasing wild caught, sushi grade, pre frozen salmon /yellowfin tuna from a supposed reliable source (santa monica seafood in costa mesa if anyone else here lives in so cal)
Is there any difference in purchasing sushi grade fish by the pound as oppose to ordering sushi from a sushi restaurant? does the restaurant do any final preparations to the fish that we dont normally do? I just have this ridiculous and rather unfounded idea that im going to get sick from parasites, not because of the quality of the fish (which I stated is probably even better than most sushi restaurants, given their fish is farmed raised most of the time) but rather because I am doing the slicing and dicing myself, and I am somehow foregoing a crucial step. Perhaps this is just normal anxiety one gets before going raw paleo, are my concerns valid? do any of you guys eat raw sushi grade fish at home that you make yourself?
the only reason I am inquiring about this is because raw fish is going to be the main bulk of my protein sources, and I want to make sure im not alone and that other people prepare their own raw fish at home and im not doing something revolutionary, ha.
thanks!
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Hi Viking,
I don't know what is "sushi grade fish", we don't have it here in Europe and I never saw it anywhere else in the world. I buy fresh wild sea fish, cut it open, throw the innards and the head before eating the rest, sometimes I even eat bones if they are small enough to be crushed. I would not eat fish in a restaurant because it might have been frozen and would surely have been washed with chlorinated tap water. BTW, I like to wash my fish in sea water after having cleaned it.
If I have too much , I cut it into fillets and dry them in a desiccator.
Eating raw fish is no big deal, it's very common for Pacific Islanders.
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I no longer eat Pacific seafood because of Fukushima. It's a terrible thing that happened. Atlantic seafood is all frozen here but I still eat some of that.
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I buy fresh wild sea fish, cut it open, throw the innards and the head before eating the rest
Really? Are not they good to eat?
sometimes I even eat bones if they are small enough to be crushed.
Mmm, still gotta try this one..
BTW, I like to wash my fish in sea water after having cleaned it.
May I ask you why? I thought of two possible reasons you do that.
Thanks!
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Really? Are not they good to eat?
Innards smell and taste awful to me, very bitter. There's not much to eat in the head and I'm strongly repealed by the thought of eating the eyes. This is certainly a cultural blockage, but I can't help it.
I like to wash the fish with seawater because the fishmongers handle it along farmed salmon and other farmed fish, ice made with chlorinated tap water and also wash it with tap water. Also I don't know how that fish had been handled before; it may have fallen on dirt or other chemical such as detergents on the boat desk, etc. It's more important to me if it is an already cut part or fillet from a big fish which could have been cut with the same knife which had just cut farmed salmon. I observed that they often don't bother to wash neither their knife nor the shelf in between and anyway if they do it is with tap water.
Spirit Bear, yes, what happen at Fukushima is terrible and it’s not over at all, but the Pacific is so vast that dilution is enormous. The pollution with plastics and other pollutants is equally concerning, but I would eat Pacific fish anyway. If you’re that worried about radioactivity, you can have your fish tested with a Geiger meter. It would be interesting to know the results for different species of fish and we should be able to find info on the web too.
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Hi Viking,
Welcome to the forum!
I see that you appear to have some misconceptions. Here`s a link with a lot of posts where I explain more details about this diet:-
http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/important-info-for-newbies/ (http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/important-info-for-newbies/)
First of all, "sushi-grade" fish is a complete waste of time. It is hideously expensive and is usually prefrozen, which is not good. I will accept prefrozen grassfed beef and the like if I have to, but would not consider buying prefrozen fish/shellfish unless I am starving and have no other option, as freezing really destroys the taste of raw seafood.
Also, avoid all farmed seafood like the plague! No matter how "organic" they may claim to be, such farms almost always feed their fish on processed supplements like grains or other rubbish, so that their fish are unhealthier by far than wildcaught seafood. Always buy wildcaught raw seafood. That is, I have only once come across a fish-farm which was genuinely of high-quality, mentioned by someone here on rawpaleoforum.
Ignore Fukushima etc. concerns. Like Iguana said, the ocean is way too diluted for radioactivity etc. to matter. Incidentally, did you know that the human body contains a microscopic amount of uranium in its body- in other words, microscopic amounts of uranium in the world`s oceans isn`t going to be a problem.
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Innards smell and taste awful to me, very bitter. There's not much to eat in the head and I'm strongly repealed by the thought of eating the eyes. This is certainly a cultural blockage, but I can't help it.
Yeah, me too.. Remember last time I told you I ate the all fish, except the eye and some parts of the head.. ;D
I like to wash the fish with seawater because the fishmongers handle it along farmed salmon and other farmed fish, ice made with chlorinated tap water and also wash it with tap water. Also I don't know how that fish had been handled before; it may have fallen on dirt or other chemical such as detergents on the boat desk, etc. It's more important to me if it is an already cut part or fillet from a big fish which could have been cut with the same knife which had just cut farmed salmon. I observed that they often don't bother to wash neither their knife nor the shelf in between and anyway if they do it is with tap water.
Good. I ll start doing that too.
Actually, I had the same concerns of yours but tried not to get too much paranoid and until now I only washed the skin under spring water from the tap and then ate the skin..
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Hi Viking,
Welcome to the forum!
I see that you appear to have some misconceptions. Here`s a link with a lot of posts where I explain more details about this diet:-
http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/important-info-for-newbies/ (http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/important-info-for-newbies/)
First of all, "sushi-grade" fish is a complete waste of time. It is hideously expensive and is usually prefrozen, which is not good. I will accept prefrozen grassfed beef and the like if I have to, but would not consider buying prefrozen fish/sllefish unless I am starving and have no other option, as freezing really destroys the taste of raw seafood.
Also, avoid all farmed seafood like the plague! No matter how "organic" they may claim to be, such farms almost always feed their fish on processed supplements like grains or other rubbish, so that their fish are unhealthier by far than wildcaught seafood. Always buy wildcaught raw seafood. That is, I have only once come across a fish-farm which was genuinely of high-quality, mentioned by someone here on rawpaleoforum.
Ignore Fukushima etc. concerns. Like Iguana said, the ocean is way too diluted for radioactivity etc. to matter. Incidentally, did you know that the human body contains a microscopic amount of uranium in its body- in other words, microscopic amounts of uranium in the world`s oceans isn`t going to be a problem.
I read all the freezing foods info, however, I just cannot eat raw seafood that has not been prefrozen, I have dealt with parasites before and I DO NOT, DO NOT want to deal with that ever again. millions of Japaense and east asian people eat pre frozen fish every day, so I just cant see the harm in eating pre froze fish.
so I think were getting off topic here, am I going to be ok eating pre frozen wild caught fish preparing it myself in my house, keeping it in my fridge for 3 days at a time?
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The sashimi in restaurants here is the same fish that I can buy in a retail store that sells fish for sashimi. The market buys the fish from the same wholesale distributor that the restaurant buys from. I live in the San Francisco Bay area, and I would imagine that the same is true in SoCal. I also eat salmon that my son catches, and I consider it okay to eat if the flesh is firm and not mushy. According to a friend who owns a sushi restaurant in Monterrey County, this is the proper criteria for safe salmon.
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The sashimi in restaurants here is the same fish that I can buy in a retail store that sells fish for sashimi. The market buys the fish from the same wholesale distributor that the restaurant buys from. I live in the San Francisco Bay area, and I would imagine that the same is true in SoCal. I also eat salmon that my son catches, and I consider it okay to eat if the flesh is firm and not mushy. According to a friend who owns a sushi restaurant in Monterrey County, this is the proper criteria for safe salmon.
Firm, not fleshy, ill remember that. Thanks.
How often do you eat the pre frozen fish from the market
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...I have dealt with parasites before...
If you don't want to eat raw fish, don't do it. It's your choice.
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I have eaten raw wild caught ahi tuna never frozen not sushi grade before with no problems at all.
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I have eaten raw wild caught ahi tuna never frozen not sushi grade before with no problems at all.
As have hundreds of millions of people, many many times over, including me and many/most members of the forum. The topic-starter isn't interested in the actual amount of risk, though. They're having an emotional reaction, and facts aren't first and foremost in their mind. :)
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Viking, eating (pre)frozen wild-caught fish is fine. But like Tyler said, once thawed out the texture and taste is usually terrible compared to fish that has never been frozen. For this reason, if i eat pre-frozen fish i eat before it thaws out, so it is still almost frozen solid. The taste and texture is much better this way in my opinion. The inuit and nenet people of Siberia, for example, often eat frozen fish in this way.
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Viking, eating (pre)frozen wild-caught fish is fine. But like Tyler said, once thawed out the texture and taste is usually terrible compared to fish that has never been frozen. For this reason, if i eat pre-frozen fish i eat before it thaws out, so it is still almost frozen solid. The taste and texture is much better this way in my opinion. The inuit and nenet people of Siberia, for example, often eat frozen fish in this way.
Very interesting. It confirms that cells damage occurs when thawing. I never tried that, because I don’t like to eat extremely cold food and I fear that it may damage tooth enamel.
But GC Burger said the they experimented it on them, and also by letting their own pigs to eat fallen apples which had frozen and subsequently thawed on the ground: they became a bit disturbed by some troubles (he didn’t specify exactly what or how). But when the apples and other foods were eaten frozen without having thawed, they didn’t observe any troubles. Thus he assumes that it could be ok to eat frozen food if thawing occurs in the mouth.
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Today I had freshly caught wild sea urchins and algaes for breakfast.
Delicious.
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The only info on the internet, at least back when i did the research a couple years ago, tells us that there is only one parasite we can get from ocean fish. it will make some humans sick for no more than four days before they die of starvation
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The only info on the internet, at least back when i did the research a couple years ago, tells us that there is only one parasite we can get from ocean fish. it will make some humans sick for no more than four days before they die of starvation
I don't think that's quite accurate.
The main parasite that you can get from raw ocean fish is anisakis, and it is usually pretty much harmless. Seriously illness from it is extremely rare.
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frozen fish is disgusting. Ud be asting your time with it.
Just eat it unfrozen and stop being a baby. Nothing will happen to you.
Parasites are actually beneficial and only cause major discomfort in an already highly toxic body. The parasites are the janitors of your body just like bacteria. If you do experience parasite detox you will better off for it in the end as parasits only feed on unhealthy tissue and leave you with only the healthy stuff.
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Very interesting. It confirms that cells damage occurs when thawing. I never tried that, because I don’t like to eat extremely cold food and I fear that it may damage tooth enamel.
Well, yesterday I had the opportunity to try! I had bought some very fresh fish in the morning and because the temperature in my fridge was too high, I set it to a lower temperature and I put those fish nearest to the freezing compartment — which I never use.
When I took out the fish for my dinner, their upper sides were frozen! >D As we had just talked about that, I undertook to eat the frozen part of the biggest fish before it thawed. The taste was bland and the feeling quite strange, reminding me the taste of ice-cream rather than a fish, but nothing else happened. :D
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Freshly caught from the fisherman usually tastes awesome on the spot.
More fun if you were the fisherman. :)
Also look into squid, oysters, clams.
I started with restaurants... until I found out the same fish is 1/10 the price from the wet market.
I trust myself now more than restaurants.
you can't get fish eyes, and fish brains, or fish spinal fluid from restaurants.
for sashimi they even cut off the dark meat... i like that dark meat part.
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Last time i had raw squid i found it too slimy and gross. Maybe ill try it again.
How do you get to the spinal fluid of the fish?
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How do you get to the spinal fluid of the fish?
If the fish is big enough, tuna for example, press a sharp knife in the joints of the vertebrae, then cut and split it.
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Last time i had raw squid i found it too slimy and gross. Maybe ill try it again.
Squid ink is good. I don't enjoy squid very much, other than the ink, though. They're not fatty enough for me.
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can all the organs/insides of the fish be eaten? how many of you actually eat the WHOLE fish(head, organs etc.)?
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can all the organs/insides of the fish be eaten? how many of you actually eat the WHOLE fish(head, organs etc.)?
Inger eats fish head smoothies a lot. I do not, but I eat a lot of shellfish. I do worry about mercury in the organs of large predatory fish.
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can all the organs/insides of the fish be eaten? how many of you actually eat the WHOLE fish(head, organs etc.)?
I used a googled fish anatomy chart to figure out what's what in fish and shellfish. In a fish, I don't eat the gills, for example, but the other little bits are okay to eat. Not much to it in a small fish. They have all the organs, but itty-bitty ones.
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can all the organs/insides of the fish be eaten? how many of you actually eat the WHOLE fish(head, organs etc.)?
If the fish is small enough, the whole fish. If it's bigger than a sardine, then I avoid the head and some innards.
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Squid ink is good. I don't enjoy squid very much, other than the ink, though. They're not fatty enough for me.
It's also apparently healthful:
How black squid ink may help fight cancer and tumor cells: Glycosis happens
http://www.naturalnews.com/043074_squid_ink_health_food_disease_prevention.html (http://www.naturalnews.com/043074_squid_ink_health_food_disease_prevention.html)
And squid ink is not the only beneficial natural pigment:
Functions of natural pigments on gastric ulcer and cancer
http://tissuescience-regenerativemedicine.conferenceseries.com/abstract/2015/functions-of-natural-pigments-on-gastric-ulcer-and-cancer#sthash.WXyTE00S.dpuf (http://tissuescience-regenerativemedicine.conferenceseries.com/abstract/2015/functions-of-natural-pigments-on-gastric-ulcer-and-cancer#sthash.WXyTE00S.dpuf)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-476366/Brightly-coloured-fruits-hold-key-fighting-cancer.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-476366/Brightly-coloured-fruits-hold-key-fighting-cancer.html)
"Mitochondria: The 'power supplies' of cells. I believe, they also represent pulsating near infrared light sources because they contain the vast majority of porphyrin (heme-)containing proteins in tissue cells, namely the cytochromes." - Prof. Guenter Albrecht-Buehler, http://www.basic.northwestern.edu/g-buehler/htmltxt.htm (http://www.basic.northwestern.edu/g-buehler/htmltxt.htm)
Light-harvesting chlorophyll pigments enable mammalian mitochondria to capture photonic energy and produce ATP
http://jcs.biologists.org/content/127/2/388.full (http://jcs.biologists.org/content/127/2/388.full)
Nonphotosynthetic Pigments as Potential Biosignatures (http://arxiv.org/abs/1505.04752)
Flavonoids and Melanins: A Common Strategy across Two Kingdoms (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4261200)
PLOS ONE: Ionizing Radiation Changes the Electronic Properties of Melanin and Enhances the Growth of Melanized Fungi (http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0000457)
Methylene blue is a photosensitizer: A transcriptional response to singlet oxygen, a toxic byproduct of photosynthesis. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15855269)
Methylene Blue: Revisited (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3087269/)
Prashant R. Ginimuge and S.D. Jyothi
J Anaesthesiol Clin Pharmacol. 2010 Oct-Dec; 26(4): 517–520.
"Recent research suggests that Methylene Blue and other redox cyclers induce selective cancer cell apoptosis by NAD (P) H: quinine oxidoreductase (NQO1)-dependent bioreductive generation of cellular oxidative stress. Hence Methylene Blue is being investigated for the photodynamic treatment of cancer."
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Much to look through, there.
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Squid ink.
Yes i eat whole tiny squid.
Muat look for that again.
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mackerel?
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mercury in raw fish actually detoxes toxic mercury in your body. Not only is it harmless but it is in fact very healthy and natural.