Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Hot Topics => Topic started by: riy freeman on January 06, 2011, 08:44:09 pm
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I'm looking for any books that explain the lipid hypothesis clearly and and also why saturated fats and cholesterol are good. I prefer them to contain scientific evidence to back up theory and any biochemistry explaining involved wouldn't hurt either. Would anyone know of such books?
Some books I've already found are:
Eat Fat Lose Fat by Mary Enig
Know Your Fats by Mary Enig
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I am afraid that the notion that (cooked) saturated fat is good for one, is shot full of holes given all the vast numbers of studies damning foods high in cooked saturated fats. It is, however, true that it is not the saturated fat per se that is the problem, but the masses of heat-created glycotoxins that are formed in those saturated-fat-heavy foods once they are cooked.
I suppose you could read Taubes as he is also on the bandwaggon like Enig. He, like Enig, has some ridiculous arguments in favour of the theory that cooked saturated fats are good for one. However, he has fortunately been severely criticised for using the very same kind of nasty tactics that he has claimed the anti-saturated fat-crowd use:-
http://reason.com/archives/2003/03/01/big-fat-fake
http://reason.com/archives/2003/03/01/an-exercise-in-vitriol-rather
http://reason.com/archives/2003/03/01/gary-taubes-tries-to-overwhelm
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So cooking fat in general is bad, and I understand this, but would cooked saturated fat still at least be the least worst? People nowadays are cooking in highly polyunsaturated vegetable oil which probably has something to do with the rise in these chronic diseases. People cooked before this century primarily with animal based fat and didn't have as much disease as today.
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Harris blog is pretty good and it has all the science behind it.
http://www.paleonu.com/
Hyperlipid is good too
http://high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com/
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So cooking fat in general is bad, and I understand this, but would cooked saturated fat still at least be the least worst? People nowadays are cooking in highly polyunsaturated vegetable oil which probably has something to do with the rise in these chronic diseases. People cooked before this century primarily with animal based fat and didn't have as much disease as today.
Well, the scientific studies generally damn cooked animal foods, especially cooked animal fats, as being the ones with the biggest load of heat-created toxins in them. The issue with cooked, polyunsaturated fats is, I think, much more to do with the fact that such PUFA-ridden foods are, in addition, very highly processed. Way back when, the only cooking that was done was home-cooking for the most part, with focus on boiling and steaming to a great extent - whereas nowadays frying, microwaving, barbecuing etc. are more in evidence.
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Tyler, I'm curious where did you learn most of your info on "heat-created glycotoxins"?
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Well, the scientific studies generally damn cooked animal foods, especially cooked animal fats, as being the ones with the biggest load of heat-created toxins in them. The issue with cooked, polyunsaturated fats is, I think, much more to do with the fact that such PUFA-ridden foods are, in addition, very highly processed. Way back when, the only cooking that was done was home-cooking for the most part, with focus on boiling and steaming to a great extent - whereas nowadays frying, microwaving, barbecuing etc. are more in evidence.
If saturated fats are more stable molecules, why would they form more heat-created toxins than polyunsaturated fats? ???
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Tyler, I'm curious where did you learn most of your info on "heat-created glycotoxins"?
Well, Aajonus mentioned just 1 or 2 specific studies, ages ago. I then started googling under" effects of cooking" etc. until I came across a treasure-trove of scientific studies on the various different types of heat-created toxins on pubmed and similiar scientific websites.
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If saturated fats are more stable molecules, why would they form more heat-created toxins than polyunsaturated fats? ???
Not more, but still quite a lot.
They are chemically very stable, but animal fats consist of both SFA and MUFA, 50/50 on average.
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If saturated fats are more stable molecules, why would they form more heat-created toxins than polyunsaturated fats? ???
The way I see it, the much-touted stability of saturated fats by Taubes cannot therefore be correct, in view of the greater load of toxins present in saturated-fat-heavy foods like pasteurised butter.
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The way I see it, the much-touted stability of saturated fats by Taubes cannot therefore be correct, in view of the greater load of toxins present in saturated-fat-heavy foods like pasteurised butter.
But why are there more toxins in saturated fat heavy foods? It just seems counter-intuitive. Can you give a link to the data showing the greater loads? I'm curious about this subject.
Sometimes I wish I had a high-tech lab of my own to try to answer these questions myself because I can't help but feel that most of the scientific literature on diet and nutrition is bullshit. -\
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CHK,
i think you are getting close. What is "Science"? I read somewhere that this word perhaps did not exist couple of centuries ago. Its derived from a much more ancient system "Philosophy".
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CHK,
i think you are getting close. What is "Science"? I read somewhere that this word perhaps did not exist couple of centuries ago. Its derived from a much more ancient system "Philosophy".
I'm getting close?? ??? What do you mean?
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I can't help but feel that most of the scientific literature on diet and nutrition is bullshit. -\
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But why are there more toxins in saturated fat heavy foods? It just seems counter-intuitive. Can you give a link to the data showing the greater loads? I'm curious about this subject.
Study stating cooked animal foods as being the worst re heat-created toxins:-
http://www.adajournal.org/article/S0002-8223(10)00238-5/abstract
List of foods and AGEs-values re toxins:-
http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.com/2009/09/age-content-of-foods.html
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My family was is not eating raw-meat, but they seem to be doing much better with cooked-meat than they did with just cooked-carbs(vegetarians).
it seems the cooked meat also contains nutrients - missing from the diet previously.
i m in no way recommending cooked-meat. This is just an observation, as we were vegans/vegetarian untill recently.
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My family was is not eating raw-meat, but they seem to be doing much better with cooked-meat than they did with just cooked-carbs(vegetarians).
it seems the cooked meat also contains nutrients - missing from the diet previously.
i m in no way recommending cooked-meat. This is just an observation, as we were vegans/vegetarian untill recently.
Naturally - after all an all-plant foods diet has no "complete" foods in it, providing all possible nutrients that a human body needs.So, in the long-term, a cooked vegan diet is worse; however, in the short-term, it's better as there are lower amounts of heat-created toxins in such a diet.
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hands down "The Great Cholesterol Con" by Malcolm Kendrick. This man has the most recent research on cholesterol and the BEST statistics around the world. His research is much better than the biased original 22 country study done by that con biochemist Ancel Keys.