Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: deletemyaccount on February 01, 2011, 07:20:48 am
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Hello boys and girls.... I've just wanted to hear your opinions on these two carb sources and your experience with them. I've been experimenting with a lot of raw starches for a while now and I find these two to be excellent digestion wise compared to other raw carbs.
I only eat carbs before bed to help with serotonin production and these two seem to work the best for me lately with 5-10 raw eggs about an hour before retiring to bed.
Just want to hear your experience or opinions about these two bad boys which are tasty and ensure corpse like sleep :-) Good or bad?
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They are great as long as they are ripe. Plantains skin should be black when you eat them.
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They are great as long as they are ripe. Plantains skin should be black when you eat them.
Yeah they taste sweeter when they're black but I ate raw green ones as well :-) Kinda sharp but no problems digesting them unripe.
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I loathe the taste of plantains.
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don't plantains still have seeds?.. that makes me think they are a better choice, but idk.
i used to love plantains!.. i'd let them get black, put them in the freezer, and then through the juicer for vanilla ice cream.. so good!
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I liked plantains more than cavendish bananas. I didn't feel as hypoglycemic with plantains but that's probably because it's more starchy.
I don't eat sugary food at all. I drink a glass of water with some drops of magnesium and it makes me relaxed.
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I've never eaten plantains, but eat bananas almost daily - about 10-12 depending on their size! Find them very digestible and soothing for digestive tract. Never had any problems from them as long as they are properly ripe. But I only eat them as part of a fruit meal mid-morning, have meat meal later mid-afternoon. Find I sleep much better if I haven't eaten too close to bedtime. When I was still LFRV, went through a stage of eating a couple of bananas after teaching yoga in the evening, just before bed. But didn't find they did anything to improve my sleep.
Guess we all have to find what works for us as individuals! But hearing others' experiences always helps, cos gives new possibilities to try out!
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Further to my previous post, I have to admit since joining this forum a few weeks ago whether it is wise or not to be eating so many bananas at all! Feels fine now, but down the line.....? So I look forward to following the posts in this thread to hear others' opinions and experiences on plantains and bananas..........
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Further to my previous post, I have to admit since joining this forum a few weeks ago whether it is wise or not to be eating so many bananas at all! Feels fine now, but down the line.....? So I look forward to following the posts in this thread to hear others' opinions and experiences on plantains and bananas..........
What went wrong!
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What went wrong!
Well, that's entirely my dilemma - nothing seems to be wrong now that I am back to just one fruit meal a day, with 10-12 bananas. But my month's experience just before going raw paleo, and from all the reading I have done re non-benefit of high fruit sugar / high carb diets, has really put confusion in my mind.
Just before changing to raw paleo at beginning of this year, I decided to give the LFRV (811-style) another go, and did no overt fats at all for over a month, and two fruit-plus-greens meals a day, or sometimes second one with non-sweet fruits, more salad-style.
Two main problems with this:
Had to eat VOLUMES to feel satisfied and I just can't be doing with that full feeling, and,
If I ate two fruit meals a day, would inevitably include bananas in both and way overeat. And then would have restless sleep cos still feeling full, even tho had taught class before bed. But also suspect carb-fruit sugar overlaod making my mind overactive. So no physical problems as far as health is concerned, but mentally I think the overlaod was affecting me.
So playing on my mind now whether I should really give the bananas a break and see if something actually changes or improves.......can one become 'addicted' to bananas do you think? the thought of stopping bananas is more scary than the thought of eating raw meat was when I went raw paleo? have no idea how or what I will eat then to make up for calories!!
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Just want to hear your experience or opinions about these two bad boys which are tasty and ensure corpse like sleep :-) Good or bad?
Bananas and plantains are sugar bombs. If you are on a high fat diet it's not advisable to eat them, IMO.
If you eat plantains, make sure that they are ripe. They must be completely black, it needs usually at least 1-2 weeks after buying...
Löwenherz
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If you eat plantains, make sure that they are ripe. They must be completely black, it needs usually at least 1-2 weeks after buying...
Löwenherz
Ah, that explains it.
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So playing on my mind now whether I should really give the bananas a break and see if something actually changes or improves.......can one become 'addicted' to bananas do you think? the thought of stopping bananas is more scary than the thought of eating raw meat was when I went raw paleo? have no idea how or what I will eat then to make up for calories!!
Ah, don’t go from an extreme to the other! I don’t think bananas are addictive, we normally feel when we have enough of it. 10 or 12 everyday is much, but you should be fed up with it one day. Anyway, I think it would be good for you to broaden you carb sources so that it does not depend on bananas only, and once a day would be more than enough. Try sweet potatoes, overripe plantains (much more wild and nurishing than cavendish), sugar cane, coconut germs, other fruits.
Cheers
Francois
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Ah, don’t go from an extreme to the other! I don’t think bananas are addictive, we normally feel when we have enough of it. 10 or 12 everyday is much, but you should be fed up with it one day. Anyway, I think it would be good for you to broaden you carb sources so that it does not depend on bananas only, and once a day would be more than enough. Try sweet potatoes, overripe plantains (much more wild and nurishing than cavendish), sugar cane, coconut germs, other fruits.
Cheers
Francois
Thanks Francois - a wise suggestion, to broaden my carb sources. Thanks for the ideas. We only get the white sweet potatoes in South Africa (they are local). I don't think they are as nourishing as the orange ones. I tried some raw the other day - very starchy. Will increase ration of other fruits, maybe source some plantains in the meantime.
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You can be 'addicted' to anything at all coffee, crack, masturbation -d , sunsets, beach, blondes, billiars and....bananas! haha but it's not whatever one is addicted to that is the real problem, it's what is going on in your mind that is allowing you to let go of self control.
As for fruits, or any sugar concentrating food must be eaten in moderate quantities only, and this will vary from person to person. The important thing is to learn to really listen to your body because it is always telling you what it wants and needs and what it doesn't. Even if you're not perceiving the signals, or recognizing them, they're still there.
I also think Bronwen, that it's sooo cool that you are that open to changing your outlook and are following after truth. It's so rare.
Someone above said that if you're on a high fat diet your wouldn't want to eat lots of sugar or fruits but I would disagree, I'd say that would be the best time to do so. Fat is there to, among other things, protect and insulate the body from toxins and it probably slows down the absorption of sugar in to the blood, moderating the body's need to produce insulin.
Also when trying to determine how much sugar to intake you can consider how much exercise you get.
In any case it's almost certainly risky to bomb your system with sugar. Mainstream medicine says 50 grams of sugar per day per person is a good limit, but mainstream medicine is whacked so it's best to be even more conservative if possible. Above all, listen very carefully to the body.
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Thanks Citrushigh - some good points to keep in mind, probably the main one being where the MIND is at in the whole thing!!
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Well, that's entirely my dilemma - nothing seems to be wrong now that I am back to just one fruit meal a day, with 10-12 bananas. But my month's experience just before going raw paleo, and from all the reading I have done re non-benefit of high fruit sugar / high carb diets, has really put confusion in my mind.
Just before changing to raw paleo at beginning of this year, I decided to give the LFRV (811-style) another go, and did no overt fats at all for over a month, and two fruit-plus-greens meals a day, or sometimes second one with non-sweet fruits, more salad-style.
Two main problems with this:
Had to eat VOLUMES to feel satisfied and I just can't be doing with that full feeling, and,
If I ate two fruit meals a day, would inevitably include bananas in both and way overeat. And then would have restless sleep cos still feeling full, even tho had taught class before bed. But also suspect carb-fruit sugar overlaod making my mind overactive. So no physical problems as far as health is concerned, but mentally I think the overlaod was affecting me.
So playing on my mind now whether I should really give the bananas a break and see if something actually changes or improves.......can one become 'addicted' to bananas do you think? the thought of stopping bananas is more scary than the thought of eating raw meat was when I went raw paleo? have no idea how or what I will eat then to make up for calories!!
Carbs are addictive, period. I know that RV eaters might disagree, but when I ate SAD I gravitated towards near 100% carbs, as in doughnuts, cake, pasta, bread, bagels. I wasn't even interested in meat, fruit or vegetables. If I bought those things they would often end up rotting in my fridge, I couldn't seem to fit them into any meals.
I eat fruits now but they are so low in carbs compared to the stuff I used to eat I don't have to worry too much, though the more I eat the more I want to eat. I would prefer to eat closer to ZC but I cannot afford it right now... so I supplement my diet with a little fruit and dairy, olive oil, coconut oil, butter, etc.
Ryan
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Hi,
Plantains do look quite similar to green bananas, but when they ripen, they actually turn black and then can be used as a vegetable to cook. I have eaten both and must say that both taste quite the same i.e. sweet, though plantain has starchy flavor. It's the only thing that I can update you about.
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Plantains (...) can be used as a vegetable to cook.
This forum is about raw paleo nutrition. We eat everything raw, including plantains.
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Depending on the variety, plaintains are generally fully edible and tasty when the skin is yellow with perhaps a hint of brown, but before it turns black. A few black spots here and there are ok. If you have any doubts, press lightly on it with your fingers, it should have a little give all throughout the plaintain (sometimes certain parts ripen faster than others). In this state it will be sweet and soft enough to eat, but it will still contain plenty of raw edible starch. This is the ideal way to consume them in my opinion, and is roughly equivalent to most green unripe banana varieties, except the flavor is much better.
If you wait until plantains are entirely black in the skin, with the variety I've most often come across, you'll get the sugar bomb, which is what we're trying to avoid.
If there are hard spots or if the skin is green, inside you will find something that is way too hard and way too starchy to be palatable. It's worse than a raw wild potato. It can however be edible if you blend it with other foods, but in this case you would just be using it as a starch supplement, because there'll be almost no flavor in it.
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What do you mean by "sugar bomb"? You're trying to avoid it, not me. I eat them either still yellow as you say, or overripe and black: very tasty in both states and very sweet in the last.
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That amount of sugar in a fruit is not natural. There is no way our paleo ancestors would've had access to fruit that was so sweet. Through selective breeding and other farming practices, we've turned most of our fruits into candy that grows in a tree. So we have to be careful with them.
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Cempedaks, jackfruits, various sapote, arbutus (for example) and many other wild and extremely ancient fruits are naturally very sweet, full of sugars.
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Cempedaks, jackfruits, various sapote, arbutus (for example) and many other wild and extremely ancient fruits are naturally very sweet, full of sugars.
Yes, but most of us cannot get hold of such fruits where we are. I had one lucky source of very rare fruits, medlars, while in the UK, but over here it's hopeless. Orkos seems too expensive, if that is what you were going to suggest....
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I didn't think about Orkos, I just meant that at least some of our ancestors had access to sweet wild fruits and in South East Asia or in Amazonia we can still gorge on it. Even in Europe, we have sweet wild medlars, arbutus, figs, etc.
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Even so, these are a very small number of fruits that grow in a small number of geographic locations, are not very prolific, and are generally only available for a short period of time. And some are not even that sweet, such as wild figs. Also, in the wild, other animals such as birds, monkeys, chipmunks, boars, etc, tend to get them before humans can.
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I think just as important, those early peoples, if they did find a tree with such fruit, most likely would have spent many calories just hiking to get to the tree, and climbing it, not to mention that they were moving throughout the day burning up calories ( relieving any excess blood sugar ) and not sitting at a computer. Those who seem to fair the longest on high sugar diets are those running marathons, etc.. very active physically.
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Years ago, some friends of mine went into a primary forest in Sumatra without any food provisions, planning to eat whatever they would find and hoping to make contact with orangutans. I asked one of them what they ate and he replied they ate only fruits of various kinds mostly unknown found high in the trees, which they managed to climb. He said it was ok because their expedition lasted one week only.
Other friends, a whole family, lived a year or two into Amazonia in French Guaiana and one of the sons told me there was about 50 different edible fruits available, also high in the trees.
Writing that, I remember having already written it somewhere on this forum, apparently to no avail!
Don't forget there's co-evolution. Fruits such as cempedaks and durians are only found in the wild in the primary forest where orangutans or other apes and monkeys spread their seeds. Since humans started to grow grains and domesticated cattle for dairy, they destroyed the primary forest and they were no longer spreading the seeds of numerous fruits they consumed before. Thus we have no idea of what were the forests where hominids lived and what grew in during the paleolithic era before the use of fire and agriculture.
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http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/21/6/892 (http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/21/6/892)
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Iguana,
It's a different thing to survive for a week in the tropics on only fruits, than to survive and thrive year-round, year after year, in the much harsher climates of this Earth. And I wonder how many of those 50 different edible fruits were as sweet as a regular domesticated overripe plaintain or banana or grape or apple or mango. Probably none of them.
Also, humans are not tree-dwellers. There's a reason we walk up straight and why our legs are 10 times as strong as our arms, whereas other apes who spend a significant amount of time up in the trees walk mostly on all fours and have arms almost as strong as their legs. We left the jungles and forests long before ever becoming humans, and opted instead mostly for the plains, savannah, tundra and other mostly open field areas where large grass and shrub eating game was available for hunting. Yes we can still do ok in the jungle and in the forest, but the main staple of our diet has mostly been meat. We did destroy some of the forests and jungles, but to believe that the whole Earth (or our natural living environment) consisted largely of these, is simply mistaken. The reason we destroyed what forests and jungles we did is because we don't thrive in those environments, whether as farmers or as hunter-gatherers.
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Btw, elephants will often destroy trees with no apparent immediate purpose. Some biologists think it's because they know trees block the sunlight and destroying the trees makes more way for grasses to grow, which are the main staple of their diet.
The theory sounds a little outlandish when you first hear it, but elephants do have amazing memory and long lifespans. One can only guess if this is the reason they're doing it, or if it's something else.
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Iguana,
It's a different thing to survive for a week in the tropics on only fruits, than to survive and thrive year-round, year after year, in the much harsher climates of this Earth.
I never said the contrary!
And I wonder how many of those 50 different edible fruits were as sweet as a regular domesticated overripe plaintain or banana or grape or apple or mango. Probably none of them.
Cempedaks, rambutans or arbutus are very sweet, for example.
Also, humans are not tree-dwellers. There's a reason we walk up straight and why our legs are 10 times as strong as our arms, whereas other apes who spend a significant amount of time up in the trees walk mostly on all fours and have arms almost as strong as their legs. We left the jungles and forests long before ever becoming humans, and opted instead mostly for the plains, savannah, tundra and other mostly open field areas where large grass and shrub eating game was available for hunting. Yes we can still do ok in the jungle and in the forest, but the main staple of our diet has mostly been meat. We did destroy some of the forests and jungles, but to believe that the whole Earth (or our natural living environment) consisted largely of these, is simply mistaken. The reason we destroyed what forests and jungles we did is because we don't thrive in those environments, whether as farmers or as hunter-gatherers.
Well, you know it.
I don’t know. I think the reality is more complex than that.
Neanderthal dental tartar reveals plant-based diet – and drugs (https://www.theguardian.com/science/2017/mar/08/neanderthal-dental-tartar-reveals-plant-based-diet-and-drugs)
Plant foods and the dietary ecology of Neanderthals and early modern humans (https://repository.si.edu/bitstream/handle/10088/22027/stri_Piperno_JHumanEvo_2014_1-s2.0-S0047248414000189-main.pdf)
Evidence for the Paleoethnobotany of the Neanderthal: A Review of the Literature (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5098096/)
But the above references concern a relatively recent era and we certainly have to look even further back in time because Neanderthals seem to have not been well adapted to their diet (which included cooked foods) and maybe to their environment also.