Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: TheWayCreatesTheWarrior on May 28, 2008, 01:53:52 pm
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whats your typical breakfast?
do you even eat breakfast?
i feel best with a light, late breakfast of berries or none at all. heavier breakfast make me alittle sluggish throughout the beginning of the day.
i havent read the book, but what ive read of The Warrior Diet makes some sense to me, just snacking throughout the day with a large dinner. digestion just doesnt seem to get along with activity to well.
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Usually skipped. I break my fast with green juice a little after rising, depending on when that is.
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whats your typical breakfast?
do you even eat breakfast?
i feel best with a light, late breakfast of berries or none at all. heavier breakfast make me alittle sluggish throughout the beginning of the day.
i havent read the book, but what ive read of The Warrior Diet makes some sense to me, just snacking throughout the day with a large dinner. digestion just doesnt seem to get along with activity to well.
Usually I skip. Or it is usually light like yours. This morning after a 4 mile jog I had 4 strawberries and some thin raw beef slices (1 oz maybe). As I have more workout to do later today, I will not eat much until tonight.
The Warrior Diet is not a bad book, and it's not a new idea. Harvey Diamond, who writes the foreword to the book, came up with a very similar plan called Fit for Life years ago. The only thing about WD is the overeating - I don't gorge myself at night. It's not a raw diet necessarily, except in the undereating stage, but you could make it all raw no problem.
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I usually only eat one meal per day in the afternoon or evening.
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Right now, I down three beef meals. Breakfast, lunch and dinner; totaling about 2 1/2- 3lbs of meat a day.
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Right now, I down three beef meals. Breakfast, lunch and dinner; totaling about 2 1/2- 3lbs of meat a day.
Justin, how much do you weigh? Quantity of eating has actually become the current conundrum for me as it relates to others. I could NEVER get three pounds of beef in me in a day!
Thanks,
Craig
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Food amounts and bodyweight is certainly a mystery. I've seen people who outweigh me by a lot who eat a lot less. Crazyness.
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Food amounts and bodyweight is certainly a mystery. I've seen people who outweigh me by a lot who eat a lot less. Crazyness.
I've seen the opposite too, all to often! Skinny people eating a lot no matter what their energy expenditure!
How much do you eat for the day and how much do you and Justin weigh... Just for curiosity's sake?
Craig
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Breakfast has never been a meal I liked, even in pre-raw days. I usually skip it as otherwise I feel bodged for the rest of the day.
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I've seen the opposite too, all to often! Skinny people eating a lot no matter what their energy expenditure!
How much do you eat for the day and how much do you and Justin weigh... Just for curiosity's sake?
Craig
I haven't been perfectly consistent recently but I'd say minimum 1 lb of meat with other odds and ends (sometimes pineapple or salsa and other such stuff with it). And then either 4 or 8 ounces of butter. Lots of calories there. Also eggs with the butter, and honey.
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I do eat a lot of suet so that may be one reason I don't seem to need as much in quantity of food.
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I only eat one meal per day, and like Craig, it is in the late afternoon between 3pm and 5pm. I eat between 1 3/4 and 2 lbs of raw grass fed beef.
If I am doing a lot of heavy physical labor (digging sprinkler trenches, taking out a tree stump etc) , then I find I get hungry earlier in the day - say around 1pm, and I eat my normal ration at that time. Then I'll have another 1 lb or so around 5 or 6 pm.
I can't eat more than 2 lbs at one sitting - just can't get any more down.
Lex
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I usually have 2 different breakfasts.
RAW: 5 raw egg yolks, 1TBS coconut oil, 16oz green juice, possibly some fruit such as berries or a banana
Cooked 4 cooked eggs, 1/4lb thick bacon.
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Yes I do have a problem understanding the different ideas of (IF) food: we all fill our stomachs but for me digestion is more than that.
It seems to me just like salt; different ideas - some with carmps others with out!
Nicola
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Food amounts and bodyweight is certainly a mystery. I've seen people who outweigh me by a lot who eat a lot less. Crazyness.
i agree,
ive spent weeks at a time eating 1500cal(sometimes only 1000cal)a day, and didnt drop below 170lbs(5'8"). ive also eaten close to 3,000 cals a day for weeks and didnt break 180-182lbs. exercise, relatively, stayed the same.
i also, thank god, build muscle and lose fat quicker and easier than most. genetics are definitely a factor, i believe.
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Justin, how much do you weigh? Quantity of eating has actually become the current conundrum for me as it relates to others. I could NEVER get three pounds of beef in me in a day!
Thanks,
Craig
Hey Craig,
I do a lot of heavy lifting and anaerobic exercise so I eat quite a bit otherwise, if I were to take a break, I would probably be consuming 2lbs of meat a day. Right now I weigh 160 at 5'10.
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My body has probably become more efficient as a result of starving at the cellular level. I do notice that when I eat even rare meat, I have to eat more of it to feel satisfied. There's something about it that fails to signal when to stop eating.
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raw milk kefir smoothie: with spirulina, blueberries, and coconut
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I'm still having a hard time with breakfast.
This has gotten better since I cut out a lot of high-glycemic foods; I don't wake up all wacked out of balance.
I'm afraid to eat just fruit for fear of a blood sugar spike. I feel nauseous on raw meat or fat first thing in the morning.
I have to have something or I don't feel so well.
Raw Kyle: are you still doing green juice and then a later raw meat meal? Maybe if I make the juice fairly low-fructose it will satisfy for a few hours. How much juice are you drinking in the AM?
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I've read a lot of posts of people feeling sluggish after eating and so waiting until later in the day for that main meal.
I've always found food to be stimulating, and still do. I like eating breakfast, but only after a workout or some kind of activity. I don't wake up hungry per se, but wake up and feel like doing something. If I don't eat soon after that I just constantly think about food all day and feel lethargic. A small meal even and my energy is back to normal pretty quickly and I don't have that feeling like I'm forcing my eyes to stay open.
I've been trying to convert myself to the heavy meal in the evening, to see if I can and how that would feel. It does seem to make sense and is definitely convenient. I'm having trouble though for the reasons above.
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Interesting to resurrect this old thread livingthelife. I wonder how other's breakfast habits have changed over the last year?
Personally, I've always enjoyed breakfast. In my early RAF days, when following an AV-style primal diet, I would have raw goat kefir with butter, berries, honey, coconut oil etc. I sometimes enjoyed this poured over homemade granola (soaked/dehydrated nuts, seeds, dried fruit etc) which was a hangover from my raw vegan days.
Ever since moving away from the primal diet and eating mainly paleo foods I've tended to eat 3 large raw meat meals per day - including breakfast. Now vlc/zc paleo, I'm eating 2 meals per day. I have beef or lamb with suet for breakfast at around 7am and the same again as an evening meal around 6pm. My blood sugars are no longer a problem and, as I don't eat late, I'm usually hungry in the morning after 13 hours or so of intermittent fasting.
I am now noticing that ANY high-carb food has almost instant negative effects. The other day I ate a raw 'energy ball' when out with my partner at an organic vegetarian cafe. It consisted of coconut, nuts and dried fruit. My blood sugar absolutely crashed within, perhaps, half an hour! I had a headache, dizziness and fogginess for hours afterwards. Similarly, although not quite as extreme, I tried eating a handful of organic blueberries after my evening meal tonight. Again, my blood sugar noticeably crashed and my brain went fuzzy. I'm only now recovering almost 2 hours later. I'm going to be sticking to my vlc/zc paleo foods!
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I don't eat first thing in the morning but almost always eat my first meal by 11am. I get a bit nauseous at ~10am if I haven't eaten anything and have been active. If I eat my stomach settles right down. :)
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headache, dizziness and fogginess
I get these symptoms almost daily as I'm slowly cutting back the carbs. I didn't notice it before when I was eating cards all the time, but now that I've upped the RAF I am in these awful cycles. I didn't intend to cut carbs, I was just trying to make sure I got more quality RAF and when full on that I wouldn't eat carbs as much.
Morning is worst.
I'm not going ZC, I believe in greens :D but I need to get this leveled out.
djr_81, are you drinking anything in the morning? Water, juice, tea/coffee... ?
Wow, RAF for breakfast - don't know if I'm man enough for that !!
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djr_81, are you drinking anything in the morning? Water, juice, tea/coffee... ?
Usually a glass or two of water. I don't ever drink anything other than water. :)
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I usually have some kind of hydrating fruit in season in the morning.
Plus some raw duck eggs, how many depends on my expected level of activity.
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Wow, RAF for breakfast - don't know if I'm man enough for that !!
ha, ha :) Maybe it'll make you a man?! ;)
I'm not going ZC, I believe in greens :D but I need to get this leveled out.
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Which 'greens' are you consuming? I would be more accurately described as low carb really. I do eat fresh herbs with my meats along with a little red onion and, occasionally, red pepper. It's mainly cutting out all fruits and high carb vegetables that makes the difference to me (everything else, such as honey, dairy, dried fruit etc I'd cut out already of course). I'm wondering if I have some kind of carbohydrate metabolism disorder?! I've suffered for years with the blood sugar problems. My current diet is the first time EVER that I've overcome this and I'm absolutely thrilled at the impact this is having on my life. I'm not advising you to 'eat as I do and all will be fine' livingthelife but just know that you can 'keep your greens' AND potentially improve the symptoms you've mentioned.
Have you ever considered that you may suffer from candida problems? I think this is a big issue for me and has always been so. I'd recommend the work of Bee Wilder for good information on that subject. The dizziness, fogginess etc can be attributed to yeast die-off with the sudden reduction in carbs.
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I'm not going ZC, I believe in greens :D but I need to get this leveled out.
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Wow, RAF for breakfast - don't know if I'm man enough for that !!
I usually have a mixture of raw grass grazed butter, raw pastured eggs, unheated honey and a little green fruit for breakfast, or I'll have raw fatty meat for breafast, depends what's available.
I'm consciously upping my greens somehow now. I didn't feel well yesterday, so I forced myself to have a little green juice even though I don't like the taste anymore, then I had a small salad. Today I had a medium blended salad, and one and a half unblended salads. I feel better now. Also got a massage, that definitely helped. I suspect I might need more greens. I had celery, green bell pepper, spinach, romaine, cucumber and mung sprouts today and last night.
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I think I have had candida problems. I had wet itching ears for many years. Since I went raw I don't get it that often any more & when I do some gargling and the sauna clears it up. Of course, sugars don't help, I'm sure. Thanks for the recommendation.
I use the dark leafy greens - mostly kale, spinach, parsley, arugula - they are readily available. I usually juice them, I don't really like "salads." I love the taste of green juice! Maybe that will return for you, Rawzi. I also eat seaweed.
You are probably right, Michael, about your blood sugar. I've had a great sensitivity all my life too. Perhaps I'm an undiagnosed diabetic or something; I didn't eat properly for years and years. Last year when I first tried cutting carbs (drastically) I got really sick - diabetic-style sick. It seems now, gradually, I've inadvertently discovered that I can actually feel a lot better by not eating them. That was suggested to me last year & I didn't "get it;" I thought I "needed" them - and I did, like an addict.
I went through the kitchen just now and decided to cut out the dates, kombucha, honey, wine :( and anything else that is very high in sugar. In addition to feeling better, I will save a boatload of $ because these are all quite expensive.
GoodSamaritan: What do you classify as a hydrating fruit? High-enzyme, like papaya, pineapple?
I'll have to experiment with the breakfast situation. All good advice here, thank you.
And maybe I'll go get myself a massage ;)
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I use the dark leafy greens - mostly kale, spinach, parsley, arugula - they are readily available. I usually juice them, I don't really like "salads." I love the taste of green juice! Maybe that will return for you, Rawzi. I also eat seaweed.
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GoodSamaritan: What do you classify as a hydrating fruit? High-enzyme, like papaya, pineapple?
I have found papaya to be lubricating, lemon too.
I like kale juice while vegetarian. Otherwise I really can't stand it. The only cruciferous vegetable I can stand right now is a little raw cabbage. I knew I ate a few other greens today/last night, one of the others was seaweed. Thank you for reminding me, albeit inadvertantly.
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Organic papaya is what we have lately (from Palawan)
Also melons are coming into season.
Watermelon sometimes.
I ban pineapples for breakfast for my family, too powerful enzymes on an empty stomach.
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my toddler eats 1)home grown green wheatgrass juice with romaine lettuce juice, followed by freshly made carrot juice and 3 raw egg yolks followed by 1tbs cod liver oil for the breakfast.
i eat only pure wheatgrass juice (5 to 6 oz) or
any green smoothie/carrot smoothie followed by two egg yolks and 1 tbs cod liver oil.
i was raw vegan and i can tell you 3 things that best for my body and can't leave without them... 1)wheat grass, because of grass crisis, i'm enjoying myself as being grass fed human being, 2)carrots, i believe they are divine , best for so many things and pick up very young carrots only...the old carrots has load of sugars, 3)celery, my organic salt for the body (i grow them year round and they're the best).
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Michael, avoid the dried fruit like the plague, it's full of toxins/sulphur etc.
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Michael, avoid the dried fruit like the plague, it's full of toxins/sulphur etc.
Thanks Tyler. Yes, I do avoid them now. The 'energy ball' episode was a real one-off - kind of an experiment really. I have always enjoyed dried fruits but have always ensured they're organic so toxins/sulphur dioxide wasn't an issue. However, all that concentrated fructose IS an issue and seems even more of an issue now. I no longer touch them.
You are probably right, Michael, about your blood sugar. I've had a great sensitivity all my life too. Perhaps I'm an undiagnosed diabetic or something; I didn't eat properly for years and years. Last year when I first tried cutting carbs (drastically) I got really sick - diabetic-style sick. It seems now, gradually, I've inadvertently discovered that I can actually feel a lot better by not eating them. That was suggested to me last year & I didn't "get it;" I thought I "needed" them - and I did, like an addict.
I went through the kitchen just now and decided to cut out the dates, kombucha, honey, wine :( and anything else that is very high in sugar. In addition to feeling better, I will save a boatload of $ because these are all quite expensive.
I can relate to concerns of being diabetic. I actually got to the point where I bought a blood sugar monitor years ago and did an 8hr glucose tolerance test. It was a revealing experience and made me realise that I was actually suffering from hyperglycemia - which some believe is a pre-cursor to diabetes. Allergies, endocrine disorders and, of course, insulin responses were all factors. It's funny but I read Sugar Blues in 1999 and gave up sugar instantly - that is, I gave up sucrose. Somehow I justified to myself that fresh fruits, dried fruits, raw honey etc were all ok as they were 'natural'. The power of intellect justifying our addictions eh?! :)
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I generally eat 2 meals/day. I try to eat 2-4 raw eggs and 1/2 lb of bison or venison with suet or low-melted tallow for breakfast/lunch. I have a bigger helping of bison/venison (1 lb or more) and suet/tallow for supper and maybe another 2-4 raw eggs or some raw liver or high meat.
In my experience, the people who have the hardest time with breakfast are those who are addicted to eating some sort of cooked carb for breakfast, like processed cold cereals with milk, bagels with cream cheese, donuts, muffins, toast, pancakes, waffles, etc. They usually ask me what to "replace" the carb with and I tell them to stop thinking in terms of replacing carbs and starches with other carbs and starches and instead think more in terms of foods like eggs and meat with fat (akin to an eggs and sausage breakfast) or berries, but they are often unable to do so. The cooked carbs breakfast has really become ingrained into a lot of my friends' and relatives' psyches. Some have recognized that the wheat foods were harming them and gave them up, but it's difficult for any of them to give up all cooked carbs, and I'm not into pushing anyone.
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I got my blood sugar under control already. I didn't have confidence that it was possible; my endocrine system has been taxed over the years.
I eliminated all nutritionally poor foods. Most were high-glycemic (wine, dates, honey, breads, beans, etc). Though I wasn't consuming many of these at all, apparently it was still too much. I'm using 1 slice of Ezekiel bread (sprouted, low-glycemic) per day to accompany 1T of ghee, after trying unsuccessfully to eat ghee in other ways.
I stocked the house with a wide variety of nutritionally dense foods with varying fat contents, including more raw cheese. I am now careful every meal to consume a variety of foods, 50% plant, 50% animal. All meals now "look" about the same, such as:
avocado
tomato
cheese
raw brunschweiger
or
green juice
banana
Ezekiel toast
ghee
cod liver oil
turkey
or
bell peppers
cauliflower
sunflower seeds
beef sashimi
marrow
...which is what I'm eating right now - yum!
I also quit coffee so that I can feel my hunger or thirst and respond appropriately.
At first I had to eat a cracker, a date, or grapes between meals because of fatigue and lethargy. Also irritability. Those props have become unnecessary already. I feel much better. :)
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Hey livingthelife,
That's wonderful news! Well done. I suspected you would reap similar benefits to myself by dropping those high-carb foods. It's good that you can still get away with some of the foods you mentioned - although I suspect you'd gain even more amazing control over your blood sugar were you to slowly drop these too! ;)
Isn't it a great feeling?! :)
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I generally eat 2 meals/day. I try to eat 2-4 raw eggs and 1/2 lb of bison or venison with suet or low-melted tallow for breakfast/lunch. I have a bigger helping of bison/venison (1 lb or more) and suet/tallow for supper and maybe another 2-4 raw eggs or some raw liver or high meat.
In my experience, the people who have the hardest time with breakfast are those who are addicted to eating some sort of cooked carb for breakfast, like processed cold cereals with milk, bagels with cream cheese, donuts, muffins, toast, pancakes, waffles, etc. They usually ask me what to "replace" the carb with and I tell them to stop thinking in terms of replacing carbs and starches with other carbs and starches and instead think more in terms of foods like eggs and meat with fat (akin to an eggs and sausage breakfast) or berries, but they are often unable to do so. The cooked carbs breakfast has really become ingrained into a lot of my friends' and relatives' psyches. Some have recognized that the wheat foods were harming them and gave them up, but it's difficult for any of them to give up all cooked carbs, and I'm not into pushing anyone.
i love the choice your meals which is super simple and nutritious. i'll try on my little boy these. thanks phil.
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Livingthelife, do try elimination diets getting rid of all grains and dairy. I've had people protesting to me for years that they were fine on a little raw dairy(eg:- raw butter) and, always, in the end, they finally admitted that, actually, their health improved measurably if they cut out all such foods altogether.
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I'm not convinced of the arguments against raw cheese. The fourth stomach of every naturally raised calf contains a cache of cheese. I think some raw cheese is a paleo food, but perhaps I'm mistaken. I don't doubt its nutritive value.
I also think that some grains in various stages of germination have a place in the paleo diet, and I'm including sprouted grains as plant foods. (Though slow-baked at low temps, essene-style breads are not paleo, it's true.) But why would we (should we - and why?) really avoid certain foods simply because of an abstract categorization - the difference between a nut, a seed, and a grain? Knowing humans as I do ;) I think we have always been opportunists, even as foragers.
I'm always open to change; I'm always changing. So we'll see what comes along next :)
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...But why would we (should we - and why?) really avoid certain foods simply because of an abstract categorization - the difference between a nut, a seed, and a grain? Knowing humans as I do ;) I think we have always been opportunists, even as foragers.
I'm always open to change; I'm always changing. So we'll see what comes along next :)
It's a common question and one I've been thinking about recently, but I ask the reverse question because I think my default position may be the opposite of yours. Your question seems based on the default position that modern foods like sprouted, slow-baked grains and raw cheese are healthy unless proven otherwise. My default position is to start with the the foods that appear to be most biologically appropriate (as per the scientific theory of evolutionary nutrition with its disease mechanism of biological discordance) and don't have any apparent negative effects on my health while meeting all my basic nutritional needs and then add foods one at a time if there is good reason to do so and the positives significantly outweigh the negatives. Foods that are obviously not Paleo, like grains and dairy products, remain on my skeptical (or cheat) list until proven healthy--or at least not unhealthy. I don't assume they are OK until proven unhealthy, because that's the sort of thinking that led to my developing numerous chronic illnesses in the first place. My view on this has nothing to do with the common criticisms like abstract categorizations, charges of Paleo-re-enactment or dietary disorders. It is instead founded on science (evolutionary/Paleolithic nutrition, evolutionary medicine, Paleoanthropology, evolutionary biology, physiology, metabolism, biochemistry, etc.) and experience (my own and others').
In other words, instead of asking "Why shouldn't I eat this modern food?" I ask myself "Why should I eat this food that was clearly not a staple food for 99+% of human existence--especially given that I seem to be doing fine without it?" In this specific case I would ask myself "Why should I eat sprouted slow-baked grains and raw dairy products?" At this time I don't have a good enough answer to eat those foods.
I skeptically analyze even foods that are considered "Paleo" by many. For example, many consider raw honey "Paleo," yet my study of traditional societies suggests that none of them ate only raw honey and never raw grubcomb (so eating just the honey would seem to be a modern practice), and raw honey causes me to break out with acne, so I consider it a "cheat" food that I only eat for pleasure (it seems less of a problem for me than most obviously modern foods, for whatever reason)--not part of my regular diet.
As always, YMMV and you're free to eat whatever you wish and I hope it works for you.
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The rigidity on this forum is ludicrous.
Cheese is a naturally occurring food product present in the stomachs of calves.
This study (http://jds.fass.org/cgi/reprint/18/4/229.pdf?ck=nck) describes the extraction of curds from live calves' stomachs. You have to use calves stomach lining to make cheese. Every suckling mammal killed would have had cheese in it.
The shunning of raw or sprouted grains is also ludicrous. A few natural seeds and nuts can be eaten but a few grains are dangerous?
I didn't say it outright before, but I think that there is a lot of obsession and disordered eating on this forum as well.
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The rigidity on this forum is ludicrous.
Cheese is a naturally occurring food product present in the stomachs of calves.
This study (http://jds.fass.org/cgi/reprint/18/4/229.pdf?ck=nck) describes the extraction of curds from live calves' stomachs. You have to use calves stomach lining to make cheese. Every suckling mammal killed would have had cheese in it.
The shunning of raw or sprouted grains is also ludicrous. A few natural seeds and nuts can be eaten but a few grains are dangerous?
I didn't say it outright before, but I think that there is a lot of obsession and disordered eating on this forum as well.
I was going to say something sarcastic to begin this post but there's no need to add fuel to a fire.
I think you need to to figure out what may be upsetting your emotional balance and right it. It might be diet based or it might be outside forces which are harder to control but you've been getting much more emotional and less grounded lately. You're in "air"/"fire" mode right now, you need to get back to "water"/"earth". ;)
I think the best part of this forum is the vast range of past diets and experience people bring to the metaphoric table. This is inevitably going to result in disagreement and discussion but that's all it needs to be. The beauty of the group of people here is the collective intelligence; we should be above stupid arguments and semantics. :)
Cheese: If it is in the fourth stomach of suckling mammals then it was probably consumed more frequently than we give credit. It doesn't mean that it was a food that would be eaten frequently; the likelihood of taking down a suckling animal was low (I'd think we'd intentionally go after older animals for larger fat deposits). Of this percentage the "cheese" would likely be divided among the group. It wouldn't be a staple of their diet, it would be a rare treat.
Grains: How about rather than shunning grains for their absence in paleolithic times (which admittedly is a little silly to me) we shun them for the intolerance most people have to them? Just because we can eat something doesn't mean we should.
I'll agree that some have an obsession with food to a detrimental level on this forum. I'll also agree some, myself included, are disordered in their eating (although I don't view this un-obsession to be an issue-we eat what makes us feel good when we desire it).
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I didn't say it outright before, but I think that there is a lot of obsession and disordered eating on this forum as well.
I think there are a lot of disordered digestion on this forum with obsession to correct it. What in the world does one have without health????... the use of your word 'obsessive' which has a negative connotation, is to me a perseverance to be commended, but anyone reading this can label as you please. I don't care... I have my health back :)
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Yes, the young would be far less likely to be hunted as the older animals have all those extra fat-layers. Plus, predators often leave out the stomach-/intestine-contents so there's no reason why those would have been eaten in the Palaeolithic, given that humans have invariably followed predator habits such as re prizing organ-meats over muscle-meats.
As regards dietary obsession, I think it's necessary to be somewhat "obsessive" re health for any particular diet, (though I think a more suitable word would be "keen"). For example, I don't suffer anywhere near as badly on grains as I do with dairy, but I still think it's important to frequently mention the dangers of grains as many others develop much nastier food-intolerances towards grains than I do. Now, of course, we all have differing food-intolerances to different foods due to our unique past health problems, plus there are those hefty social restrictions in everyday life, so there's nothing wrong whatsoever with not following a diet 100%(not possible here anyway as there's a difference in philosophy between omnivorous, rawpalaeodieters and raw, zero-carbers for example).
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If some of the comments were directed at my posts, then there appear to be several misconceptions here regarding my diet and my views. However, I don't wish to discuss it further if it's going to upset livingthelife, as it's not my purpose to upset anyone. I'll just share some info that I hope will enable folks to relax a bit: I do not adhere rigidly 100% to any diet (though I also won't criticize anyone who finds they need to due to severe sensitivities, and agree with Tyler that there are people who need to do that) and actually consumed some dairy, carbs and cooked foods at the Thanksgiving meal. I am probably less strict than many people here.