Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Personals => Topic started by: Sully on July 27, 2010, 06:38:00 am
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Anyone here interested in that? Do you do it yourself or know of anyone close to you that does?
I am interested in raising livestock eventually in my life. I am going to school this fall and I am thinking about being a persona trainer for a while and then eventually raising meat to sell. I would think many people from this forum would like to buy from me. Especially for the quality, and the ability to order any part of the animal from me.
It is just a thought now, but I am seriously want to look into it. Maybe even start a small community and raise livestock together.
Any thoughts?
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I live in Wisconsin and I was thinking more towards only raising Native Animals. In Wisconsin that would be bison, turkey, elk, deer, duck etc.
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I live in Wisconsin and I was thinking more towards only raising Native Animals. In Wisconsin that would be bison, turkey, elk, deer, duck etc.
What part of Wisconsin. I know someone else interested in raising animals naturally in Wisconsin and eating raw. Maybe you two could talk.
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What part of Wisconsin. I know someone else interested in raising animals naturally in Wisconsin and eating raw. Maybe you two could talk.
I am located in Milwaukee. Yeah, that would be nice, let me know what's up!
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Anyone here interested in that? Do you do it yourself or know of anyone close to you that does?
I am interested in raising livestock eventually in my life. I am going to school this fall and I am thinking about being a persona trainer for a while and then eventually raising meat to sell. I would think many people from this forum would like to buy from me. Especially for the quality, and the ability to order any part of the animal from me.
It is just a thought now, but I am seriously want to look into it. Maybe even start a small community and raise livestock together.
Any thoughts?
Sully, I've been wanting to have my own dairy goats... even if just for me. Partly because I think little baby goats are one of the cutest things in the whole entire universe. And partly because I feel like there isn't enough supply and there could potentially be a lot of demand. I know of only two natural (not "certified organic") companies (Redwood Hill Farm and Meyenberg) and all the products I've come across are pasteurized. There may be smaller scale dairy goat farms with raw products, but I haven't found any locally yet. I've never had raw goat's milk (feeling only slightly deprived) and I feel that I would do really well on it in moderation - and ayurvedically, it suits my constitution.
In addition, I could make truly raw goat cheese, super natural goat milk soaps, and in general (or "best of all!"), just have the cutest little kids bucking around! ;D
Your idea is very cool. It could possibly be a self-sustaining community farm/ranch and we could all be "weird"/natural/normal/primal together.
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Cinna
Your idea about goats sounds good, especially for money, since I think many people do better on goats products than cows. I have had the same thought though, you know, even if I don't sell it, I will raise it for myself.
Oh, I am sure new born deer are cute too, and native! But I guess domesticated animals would be better for milk. ;)
It is like a dream for me, we can make a bigger change in the world coming together. People might even want to make documentaries on us. Even I could make the documentaries, because I have experience editing and filming. Imagine what impact we could make while still being able to live comfortably and feed ourselves.
SO you stay in California?
The only question would be where would people want to live coming from different places on earth. Perhaps we can have multiple farm communities that are tied together all over the USA. I myself want to stay in temperate climate. I don't like desert dry heat places like Arizona and some places in California. If I can't walk around in the sun for two hours without getting burnt, I am not meant to live there. I almost never get burnt here in Wisconsin.
I stayed in Jordan for 2 months, I know.....
It's not just me rambling... It will happen. mark my words! ;)
We should have a poll on the forum, it would be like
Are you interesting in living in a farm/livestock raising community?
Where would you like it to be? Temperate zone? Desert/desert mountainous? Etc etc
What would you like to raise? Native animals? Dairy animals?
Do you want to grow plants? What kind?
I want to do this, but it would be much easier with more people.
Even if I get a farm and start inviting people to come live on it. It will happen.
I am going to college for 4 years at University Wisconsin Milwaukee (my mom is poor, getting lots of benefits!) starting this fall. Maybe they will have a course that would be beneficial for this task.
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I wanted to bring up farms in multiple areas on the globe because if I was 100% African, I wouldn't want to live in Wisconsin.
I am sure I would feel more suited to a warmer climate. You know. If I was full blooded Arabic, maybe I would prefer a Mediterranean climate like some places in California. Temperate zone is my favorite, and I can say that because I experienced the other climates. If I was somewhere in Arizona, I would want to be in the mountains where they get snow. But I still would get burnt in the summer.
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So, people who live in this community.. Will they get everything there? Meaning, they will be able to live on the site, work the farm, eat the food produced from the farm etc..? Because that sounds good to me.
I'd go for somewhere where you could be outside all year round without insulation, and get chilled at the coldest points, but not need to put more on or go inside(though you may want to, you wouldn't feel it was necessary - you could take it if you wanted to, and just be cold). It'd be nice if there was nearby wilderness, so that people could go for spells out in the wild if they wanted, and just to be surrounded by a nice environment and clean air. The place should have plenty of plant-life, varied terrain, water. The site should not impose on the landscape or the environment. If it were to, then it should instead be built nearer the cities...
If it could be unimposing, then I might suggest somewhere like Montana... But if it would be, then I think you should not ruin some nice wild place, and instead build it in the countryside near a city or something... It also depends: Of course if you want to be exporting, and taking visitors and stuff, then it'd need to be near'ish a city, maybe California or something..
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Sorry to hear you have no access to raw goat milk Cinna! After much searching here in the UK, I've had 3 or 4 good sources of high quality raw goat milk. I used to make my own kefir with it and experimented with cheese. Even though I don't currently consume any dairy, it's still a dream of mine to raise goats, chickens, fruit/veg etc. Maybe the WAPF real milk campaign/website could help you find a source of raw goat milk?
The community you guys are talking about would be superb. I hope it is something you do manage to organise Sully. For a little experience, have you ever heard of WWOOF (Willing Workers On Organic Farms) or the book 'Diggers & Dreamers'? Albeit non yet paleo oriented but the world sure has it's fair share of such communities already. On my travels across England, Scotland, France, Italy, Germany and Canada I've done voluntary work on some of these places. WWOOF and similar organisations contain lists of all the 'hosts' across the world. One of the best I've stayed is a place in South-West England called Tinkers Bubble. Basically, it's around 50 acres of woodland and meadow in one of the most beautiful parts of the country owned by a co-operative of about 30 or so adults and children. I stayed there for a few weeks. Members build their own house in a clearing in the woods (strawbale, yurts, timber-frame etc), grow and trade their own food, share meals around the open fire (not raw!) etc. They have goats, fruit/veg, even an occasional pig! There are many similar set-ups around and I'd recommend trying the lifestyle for size before you commit to starting your own.
On the subject of raising livestock, it's certainly something I have ambitions towards eventually. Unfortunately, the price of land in the UK is crazy now so I'm planning on moving elsewhere for such a venture eventually unless I suddenly come into some serious money! I have a few friends also keen on the idea so am hopeful it will happen. I think it'd be a wonderful way of life and the quality of food & health it would bring would be phenomenal. There seems to be a hell of a lot to learn to raise livestock in the normal fashion but to be a 'grass-farmer' I don't envisage as being too difficult. Remineralisation of the soil is the key of course. I highly recommend you research the work of William A. Albrech, Dr Elaine Ingham, Dr Arden Anderson, along with particular books including Bread from Stones, The Survival of Civilisation and Mainline Farming for Century 21. The US organisation 'Acres USA' is also a source of great information.
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Miles,
Yeah that is my thought, all food will be provided from the farm/land. But no one said we can't hunt too. Imagine everyone with a hunting license, that's a lot of deer rabbits, etc!!!!!!!!!!! And we could hunt on are own land!
Hmmmm, I am not down with hot all year round myself. But anywhere you go you would need protection. South America lots of rain, desert gets freezing at night. Wisconsin and other temperate places gives you a taste of everything.
Ahh and yes, I was thinking the same. On the outskirts of a city. Not too close, but not too far. So we could ship meat and other stuff to local food coops. There is the Outpost Food CO-OP here in Milwaukee, they have three stores. There is also Sendiks and Health Hut they ahve multiple stores also. Near a city with many health food stores would be ideal.
Michael,
Yeah I have heard of WOOFING, that's what some call it right?
It would be nice to live with some grass fed bison farmers to see how they do it. I want bison because they are native to America, and there used to be millions. I don't like the idea of raising highly domesticated non native cows. (maybe 1-2 dairy animals for people who wish to have milk)
I don't know if there is much to learn from woofing that I will need to know. I would like to see how some grass fed farmers do it though. They say you can't get close to bison!! Big and mean and wild, just the way I like it.
land here in Wisconsin is cheap from what I know. It seems easy to me.
It could start off small...first raise turkeys (something small), then work are way up to deer and or bison, deer are smaller and docile. Most of the meat would be sold instead of eaten at first of course. WE would have plenty of food from hunting too, 10 dear can last all year round.
We need land and a house on the land. It could start off as 10-30 people in one house (depending on the size of the house). Start off small. In the beginning we could have fruits and vegetables and something small like turkey. I have it all mapped out at least for wisconsin here.
There is the Outpost Food CO-OP, Sendiks and Health Hut grocers they have multiple stores. Not too mention farmers markets here too. Whole Foods grocery also. People on the forum could buy from us too.
BTW I skinned animals before and I am not squeamish one bit. I know what to expect and what to see. Nothing is eye opening to me.
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To add, fruit would be a big thing for money (here there would be, strawberries, watermelon, cantaloupe, apples, pears, currants, mulberries, raspberries, cherries etc.), to think, we don't need much money, gas vehicles, shipping stuff, equipment. Taxes every year is cheap. Water cost (water would be cheap if it is coming from lake Michigan).
just got to network with people who are legit and are seriously interested. I got a facebook page if anyone wants to add me. If you see my face book page, videos photos etc. You'll pretty much know me without even meeting me.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=100000035678641
highlight the whoel thing and paste it, for some reason only part of it is clickable
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In the future I'll be buying from you :D
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In the future I'll be buying from you :D
Hah thanks!
I can see my self screaming in a market! I got EYBALLS! WHO WANTS EYEBALLS? TESTES! ANYONE NEED TESTES? Haha just kidding.
But yeah when I raise animals, I will allow my costumers to have anything they want! Everyone should be able to have anything from the animal.
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Sorry to hear you have no access to raw goat milk Cinna! After much searching here in the UK, I've had 3 or 4 good sources of high quality raw goat milk. I used to make my own kefir with it and experimented with cheese. Even though I don't currently consume any dairy, it's still a dream of mine to raise goats, chickens, fruit/veg etc. Maybe the WAPF real milk campaign/website could help you find a source of raw goat milk?
Hey Michael, when I looked at the WAPF site a long time ago, I must admit that I was pretty lazy about looking up the location of every goat dairy farm... If I hadn't heard of the city/town, I assumed it was too far and I just wanted my local HFS to carry the milk for my convenience. Some of the farms are a few hours away, but I may have found one that is maybe an hour and a half away! I really just need to do more investigating... I swear, I bet there is an organic, pastured dairy goat within a 15-mile radius... I live in the suburbs, but there are many rural-ly pockets in this area - I just know there is some raw goat milk around, just not advertised and maybe not for sale. I'll have to ask my sis... she has visited clients who had farm animals. So thank you for reminding me to look at the WAPF site again. :)
The community you guys are talking about would be superb. I hope it is something you do manage to organise Sully. For a little experience, have you ever heard of WWOOF (Willing Workers On Organic Farms) or the book 'Diggers & Dreamers'? Albeit non yet paleo oriented but the world sure has it's fair share of such communities already. On my travels across England, Scotland, France, Italy, Germany and Canada I've done voluntary work on some of these places. WWOOF and similar organisations contain lists of all the 'hosts' across the world. One of the best I've stayed is a place in South-West England called Tinkers Bubble.
I had never heard of WWOOF - very cool! And Tinkers Bubble is, like, the most amazing name ever. I think a baby goat should be named Tinkers Bubble. ;D Thanks for the great info... so much to look into.
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Ill buy from you to. Im an hour and a half away from milwaukee. Maybe eventually I can get some fresh non-frozen healthy meats!
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Cinna
Your idea about goats sounds good, especially for money, since I think many people do better on goats products than cows. I have had the same thought though, you know, even if I don't sell it, I will raise it for myself.
Oh, I am sure new born deer are cute too, and native! But I guess domesticated animals would be better for milk. ;)
Yes, I do think all baby animals are cute. When I saw two little baby goats scampering around in a village in Nepal, I was beside myself. I didn't know that something so tiny, so cute, and so nimble could exist. I wanted to take them home... my Polly Pocket goats.
It is like a dream for me, we can make a bigger change in the world coming together. People might even want to make documentaries on us. Even I could make the documentaries, because I have experience editing and filming. Imagine what impact we could make while still being able to live comfortably and feed ourselves.
You could be a great teacher... you could make instructional hunter-gatherer videos. Teach workshops. :)
SO you stay in California?
The only question would be where would people want to live coming from different places on earth. Perhaps we can have multiple farm communities that are tied together all over the USA. I myself want to stay in temperate climate. I don't like desert dry heat places like Arizona and some places in California. If I can't walk around in the sun for two hours without getting burnt, I am not meant to live there. I almost never get burnt here in Wisconsin.
I stayed in Jordan for 2 months, I know.....
I am going to college for 4 years at University Wisconsin Milwaukee (my mom is poor, getting lots of benefits!) starting this fall. Maybe they will have a course that would be beneficial for this task.
Yes, I think multiple farm communities, tied together eventually, would be cool. Yes, start small in your area, the place you know. I'll visit. :) I think a place in California would be ideal - not just because I'm already here, but California has a lot to offer and I think enough open (at first I typed "crazy," but I'll just say "open") people who would be down for cool stuff like this. And if there aren't enough "open" people here right now, California attracts plenty of open people on a regular basis. :D
I encourage you to take whatever classes interest you that could prepare you for making this a reality. I know you will make your truest dreams come true. I'd like to help in ways that I can, but just FYI, I'm still part So Cal princess (quite low-maintenance for So Cal standards) so I prefer to do anything light and girly. I would milk goats and keep house. I'm open to learning how to hunt (and possibly butcher animals? hm...) and I loved fishing when I was little, but at the moment, I'm not like dying to build a house... I do dream of living in a log cabin, like the one Betty Ross lived in in the "Hulk" movie.
Also, something clothing optional would be awesome too. :o
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Hah thanks!
I can see my self screaming in a market! I got EYBALLS! WHO WANTS EYEBALLS? TESTES! ANYONE NEED TESTES? Haha just kidding.
But yeah when I raise animals, I will allow my costumers to have anything they want! Everyone should be able to have anything from the animal.
sully, U R AWESOME and so does your topic ! this is so interesting that recently i'm buying my products from an amish farmer from PA and i pay huge bills for eyeballs, testes, ovaries, glands, stomach, brain...etc. you just name it. i get them twice a month supply. comparing to buy from internet, this is the best. raising livestock also my life long dream. i see my entire family in back home does that. recently i've bought a country property to raise my own goat, sheep, deer, cow, roosters, ducks, turtles...etc. if there's a chance that we can do something together, i'm very interested to join with you. all the best!
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Raw,
Nice, I only got eyeballs and testes form wild animals.
Got you own property now. Did you get any of the animals you mentioned?
I am interesting in joining anyone who shares similar goals of mine! ;)
But, you know, what if I bought some land. And started a small community that got most of there food from hunting instead of farming? That would be illegal I guess (can't hunt all year round. Only Certain times and license is needed for legal activity)
But yeah, hooking up and raising animals would be nice. Perhaps you wouldn't even have to sell meat solely for income. Petting zoo? No feeder pellets, just give them some dandelion greens like I did at a farm. People were giving these already bloated goats pellets, and I gave em some dandelion greens :)
Or even have somewhat of a school to teach people about animals or something. Kids could take school field trips to the farm. Have people come and pick apples or other fruit. they pick what they want, and i'll just sell it buy the pound.
I don't want to turn into this big company. With thousands of animals. Just a small piece of land and be at peace with "enough money" TO LIVE HAPPY.
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Raw,
Nice, I only got eyeballs and testes form wild animals.
Got you own property now. Did you get any of the animals you mentioned?
I am interesting in joining anyone who shares similar goals of mine! ;)
But, you know, what if I bought some land. And started a small community that got most of there food from hunting instead of farming? That would be illegal I guess (can't hunt all year round. Only Certain times and license is needed for legal activity)
But yeah, hooking up and raising animals would be nice. Perhaps you wouldn't even have to sell meat solely for income. Petting zoo? No feeder pellets, just give them some dandelion greens like I did at a farm. People were giving these already bloated goats pellets, and I gave em some dandelion greens :)
Or even have somewhat of a school to teach people about animals or something. Kids could take school field trips to the farm. Have people come and pick apples or other fruit. they pick what they want, and i'll just sell it buy the pound.
I don't want to turn into this big company. With thousands of animals. Just a small piece of land and be at peace with "enough money" TO LIVE HAPPY.
Get a good paying job or better start your own business...wisely invest then buy your own farm. I've looked into it and I can afford a farm outright but I don't know about the loneliness factor. I would rather have a place in the city and a farm owned outright. Live 50/50.
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Some of the farms are a few hours away, but I may have found one that is maybe an hour and a half away! I really just need to do more investigating... I swear, I bet there is an organic, pastured dairy goat within a 15-mile radius... I live in the suburbs, but there are many rural-ly pockets in this area - I just know there is some raw goat milk around, just not advertised and maybe not for sale. I'll have to ask my sis... she has visited clients who had farm animals. So thank you for reminding me to look at the WAPF site again. :)
Great news Cinna! You could soon be enjoying your very own local raw goat milk. I also highly recommend obtaining some kefir grains and using the milk to make raw goat kefir. Glad I was able to help in some small way.
You know, it's amazing. I bet you'll end up finding a supplier of raw goat milk close-by to where you live, that has been there for years and of which you've always been completely oblivious. After years of buying mine from 300 miles away, I ended up finding TWO sources no more than 30-40min drive away from my home! It really adds to the whole experience too when you get to meet and play with the goats, share tea and raw goat cheese with the owners etc! :)
I had never heard of WWOOF - very cool! And Tinkers Bubble is, like, the most amazing name ever. I think a baby goat should be named Tinkers Bubble. ;D Thanks for the great info... so much to look into.
Great idea! I agree that it'd be a wonderful name for a goat. I'll try to remember that for when I finally manage to get my own little goats. :) Good luck with the investigations. Let me know if there's anything I can help you with.
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Michael,
Yeah I have heard of WOOFING, that's what some call it right?
It would be nice to live with some grass fed bison farmers to see how they do it. I want bison because they are native to America, and there used to be millions. I don't like the idea of raising highly domesticated non native cows. (maybe 1-2 dairy animals for people who wish to have milk)
I don't know if there is much to learn from woofing that I will need to know. I would like to see how some grass fed farmers do it though. They say you can't get close to bison!! Big and mean and wild, just the way I like it.
It'd certainly be useful to learn from a variety of different grass-fed farmers and learn from their individual methods and experiences. I think the WWOOFing (as they do indeed call it!) experiences would also be useful if you get to stay on some existing communities. You may actually find that the way of life doesn't appeal to you in reality as it's not all quite as perfect as it may seem in theory. Having said that, you do strike me as someone who would thrive in such an environment.
I agree with others that being close to a City and supplies would be preferable if possible as isolation is not necessarily a positive thing in many respects. I do find I'm personally inclined towards a hermit existence but I'm not sure it's a natural or healthy way to live. Sharing a community life with like-minded people whilst being able to dip in and out of 'normal society' certainly seems to offer a wonderful compromise.
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kurite
Nice, when my dream does happen, I will kill the animal right in front of you, for some super fresh meat!
Cina
I like to teach people as long as they want to learn what I am teaching them. Hah
I was thinking about getting some land with a house (and a barn) already instead of building a house. (perhaps build something in the future)
Clothing optional? Being naked when I choose is another dream of mine.
wodgina
That is what I was thinking, save money with a good job until I am about 30 or even younger. Then invest it in a farmland.
Michael
I am sure how some farmers live will not be appealing to me. But I am sure how I do things will be a bit different :)
Yeah, how some people act nowadays being a hermit doesn't sound that bad. I have very few good friends. Maybe less than five.
If there were to be a whole community of people living on some land. A close bond between 20 or under people would be better than a so-so bond with hundreds. But there could be other farms/communities that are like partners you know.
For anyone interested in a community farm, we could talk on Skype. Skype is free to download. Instant chat, video chat, and mic chat. Easier to chat and share ideas quicker.
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Raw,
Nice, I only got eyeballs and testes form wild animals.
Got you own property now. Did you get any of the animals you mentioned?
I am interesting in joining anyone who shares similar goals of mine! ;)
But, you know, what if I bought some land. And started a small community that got most of there food from hunting instead of farming? That would be illegal I guess (can't hunt all year round. Only Certain times and license is needed for legal activity)
But yeah, hooking up and raising animals would be nice. Perhaps you wouldn't even have to sell meat solely for income. Petting zoo? No feeder pellets, just give them some dandelion greens like I did at a farm. People were giving these already bloated goats pellets, and I gave em some dandelion greens :)
Or even have somewhat of a school to teach people about animals or something. Kids could take school field trips to the farm. Have people come and pick apples or other fruit. they pick what they want, and i'll just sell it buy the pound.
I don't want to turn into this big company. With thousands of animals. Just a small piece of land and be at peace with "enough money" TO LIVE HAPPY.
sully, same way i think too. for me farming is only which is a hobby farm where me and my toddler will enjoy animals as they are our pets. to eat them, i better prefer to go in wild and hunt them (even though i never done that before). in new jersey, you can hunt animals all year round from your property. in new york you can do that too, but i don't know the rules in other place else. i've just bought my country home and renovating this now. but i do see bunch of wild turkeys and deers all around my property. we (raw paleolithic diet) definitely need to build up our own community. when i go out with my toddler, it's not normal for him seeing other toddlers eating all those unhealthy foods when he only knows raw meat as his staple food. i mean it's really hard to see that entire civilized society on a wrong diet. ???
for real, i am interested to do that. we all should contribute labors or money or both to build up a small community. if the land is huge and we are just a small group living in jungle, who'll know that! in Hawaii, some people living like that too (they are raw foodist, but not raw meat eaters). :D
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I was thinking about getting some land with a house (and a barn) already instead of building a house. (perhaps build something in the future)
This makes sense I think Sully. It's another dream of mine to build my own timber frame home but starting with an existing building is very wise. I've known close friends and family who lived too many cold winters in caravans on site whilst building their dream homes and it doesn't appeal!
That is what I was thinking, save money with a good job until I am about 30 or even younger. Then invest it in a farmland.
If you can find work which pays very well then, yes, this is probably the best way to go about doing it. I'm at this crossroads myself. I've previously had a lucrative software development career but, finding it unrewarding, spent the last 10 years working in social work with vulnerable adults including substance misuse, mental health, offenders etc. The pay wasn't good and I now have to decide whether to try getting back into IT to fund my self-sufficiency/farm/community dream or do it the hard(er) way.
I am sure how some farmers live will not be appealing to me. But I am sure how I do things will be a bit different :)
I get that impression! :) It was more the living in a community setting that I thought may be worth trying first. Although, in my experience, there's a big difference between joining an existing community and living with people you wouldn't, perhaps, necessarily choose to live with to setting up your own with others of your own choice.
I've tried on a number of occasions, on a small scale, to get like-minded people together to start a small eco-community. I probably wasn't determined enough but found it a very difficult thing to do.
Yeah, how some people act nowadays being a hermit doesn't sound that bad. I have very few good friends. Maybe less than five.
Yes, my sentiments exactly. I find there are very few people in the world that I'd be interested in being very good friends with. Likewise, I have probably around 5 very close friends. But, I guess everyone's like that. It's all about our social circles - close friends, other friends, acquaintances etc.
For anyone interested in a community farm, we could talk on Skype. Skype is free to download. Instant chat, video chat, and mic chat. Easier to chat and share ideas quicker.
I've never really got on with Skype to be honest. I think, living quite rurally, my internet connection is just not up to it.
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Raw
It's good you have a kid, it's the best way to pass down information (especially raw meat eating etc.) I want to have kids as soon as I meet a woman on a raw meat diet.
Yeah a community for raw paleo dieters would be ideal especially for raising children. Community farm seems like a haven. A place of peace.
We need a good group of educated people. We could be are own doctors for stitches and broken bones. I know how to use a gun, skin a animal, skilled in martial arts everyone will bring different skills to the table. Carpenters, electricians etc.
I heard pf the group in Hawaii. I wouldn't be into that weather though. Tsunami, hurricane etc. Any place with little threat to a natural disaster sounds good. I am willing to relocate, just think my body is more suited for a temperate climate.to a place that gets snow in the year.
michael
Yeah, I don't want to join a already existing group that doesn't really fit me. It's better to start a community from scratch with people (15-20 perhaps.) that actually can coexist like family. When living with someone, you got to have minds in harmony and debate without conflict.
skype is a simple program easy to run, networking sites like facebook however have instant chat as well.
(anyone interested in a instant chat about a communality farm just send me a private message here through the forum)
I want to be part of a community of raw paleo/primal/raf within 8 years. I think the biggest issue would be people willing to relocate.
If you think starting a community of raw animal foods is hard. Look what he accomplished, makes you feel like you have no excuses for not doing what you want.
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I share the dream of one day owning my own farm as well and making a small business out of it. I'm a recent college graduate with a crap load of student loans unfortunately, so I need to find a job that will pay them back before I can move onto a farm that has nothing to do with what I studied...though college was still definitely worth it.
I would seriously consider going in on running our own farm somewhere in the US (preferably on one of the coasts) or perhaps Canada (British Columbia) because land is a lot cheaper. It's hard to find raw paleo eaters out there outside of this forum, thus, we need to come together and start something up. A farm dedicated to raw paleo...we can definitely make this a reality if we work on it together.
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There is Pangaia and Kieba's body temple boot camp, both in hawaii , but they are expensive.
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Just paid off my student debt, 10 years on...
I think there will be a 'new colonialism' of Australia when the oil,coal and gas runs out (20 years) I would like to get on board now and convince some interested parties to join myself to buy up fertile land here in OZ.
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Just paid off my student debt, 10 years on...
I think there will be a 'new colonialism' of Australia when the oil,coal and gas runs out (20 years) I would like to get on board now and convince some interested parties to join myself to buy up fertile land here in OZ.
How is Australia weather? Don't you hate the heat?!
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It's a big country with many different climates but mostly it's hot.
The longer I'm RPD the more I like heat. I have a very high tolerance to heat and coldnow but love the heat. Hot summer nights when everyones out, girls are out. I open up my house and you can smell the ocean, there's a warm breeze...it's seriously invigorating and everyone seems happier.
I really don't understand you guys liking the cold...It means you have to wear heaps of clothing yuk. It's hard to get things done,you get stuck inside, you need heating, hot water, gloves, beanies.
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Well, I would hate to live in Alaska, but I would hate to live in a place hot all year round too. I like the in between. Get a taste of everything. We have a few of months humid summer, sometimes its dry but usually before rains kick in, mostly hot and humid in summer. Winter is good, fall is amazing with the leaves. Not too mention I live close to lake Michigan. It's like being next to a mini ocean. I have yet to visit a place where I enjoy the climate more than Wisconsin.
I have been to Arizona and was in Jordan for 2 months. Jordan dry arid heat doesn't go well with me. I don't like it. I burn too without cloths. In Wisconsin the moisture in the air prevents burns to my skin. I can walk around during the hottest times of the day with no shirt and be burn free because it has moisture in the air.
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Hey Sully, I forgot to say thanks for posting that video link 'Look at yourself...'. What an amazing guy! I must confess that I watched it twice (a second time when showing my partner) and had tears in my eyes both times!! :) A true inspiration!
Andrew, congratulations on clearing the debt! I know from experience how liberating removing such chains from one's neck can be!
Tyler, I really like the look of that Pangaia place. Perhaps it's the raw veggie still in me!! :) It would be amazing to have a similar kind of setup but based around paleo principles.
Climate wise, I'm with you Sully. Contrasting seasons such as we have here in England keep things interesting and, as many countries around the world have demonstrated in recent years, extreme climate conditions can have devastating consequences!
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Tyler, I really like the look of that Pangaia place. Perhaps it's the raw veggie still in me!! :) It would be amazing to have a similar kind of setup but based around paleo principles.
The Pangaia place is mainly raw-vegan-oriented, but, amazingly enough, they do, apparently, cater for raw animal foodists, it's just that you have to book in advance, mentioning your situation. There's also Kieba's raw food Body Temple in Hawaii, which caters for anyone on RVAF diets, whether the primal diet or raw, zero-carb etc.
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The Pangaia place is mainly raw-vegan-oriented, but, amazingly enough, they do, apparently, cater for raw animal foodists
Really?! I wonder how that would work? I don't expect I'll ever visit but I do like the setup and would like to emulate it on a paleo scale. I didn't like the look of the other place. I'm sure it's only a matter of time before we start seeing a few similar communities springing up around the world catering specifically to the paleo lifestyle.
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Oh, here is a promotional youtube video of the body temple boot camp:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk2BStME9bQ
Here's part 1 of 5 about the raw food lifestyle at Pangaia:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8ILZfJrOx0
Haven't seen the whole video, I presume they focus only on raw plant foods in the video as it is a mainly raw vegan camp nowadays.
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Kieba spends half the video talking about eating raw meat/eggs.
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Kieba spends half the video talking about eating raw meat/eggs.
I was talking about the 2nd video which started off talking about raw vegan diets.
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Thanks for the video links Tyler. That's confirmed my lack of interest in Kieba's Boot Camp!! :) Incidentally, I seem to recall seeing a picture of her somewhere on the internet sitting on Aajonus' lap. I think she's into the whole Primal Diet thing.
I'll watch the Pangaia videos when I get a moment.
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Caotue and I have been talking about starting up a farm quite a bit lately. We kind of decided a good place would be near the great lakes.
We need some more people.
Let me know anybody. ;) send me a pm
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Caotue and I have been talking about starting up a farm quite a bit lately. We kind of decided a good place would be near the great lakes.
We need some more people.
Let me know anybody. ;) send me a pm
why not in new york? our international friends also can donate something to build up or purchase and when they'll visit USA, they will live in that land to enjoy hunthing. l)
my husband is a well established and successful person in Wall St. it's out of my hand to ask him to move out from New York.
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why not in new york? our international friends also can donate something to build up or purchase and when they'll visit USA, they will live in that land to enjoy hunthing. l)
my husband is a well established and successful person in Wall St. it's out of my hand to ask him to move out from New York.
i wouldn't mind new york state, i think, i dislike chicago, so i think i would hate new york city,
so you live in the city or state?, does your husband eat raw?
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Well I'm from northern NJ area and I definitely wouldn't be opposed to NY myself. But in the end, I'm open.
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I'm in NY.
I can also give a lot of guidance if/when you guys looks for land up this way. ;)
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I'm referring the place in new york state. Recently I've purchased a property in new york state (I also own a home in Brooklyn, NY and in new jersey). I lived in Georgia in my past. but, new york is the best. city has it's own charm and it is very diverse. When you live in new york country, it's beautiful (especially the land is so fertile and so much wild lives existed). I can arrange to buy 75 acres of plain land with creek, old apple orchard and plenty of wild berries, frogs, wild turkeys, rabbits...etc and another 22 acres extra land next to my country home. it's less than 80 miles from new york city. Total of 97 acres of completely rural land. I also can get a better deal, 'cause these lands belong to the same farmer family who sold me the house. My husband does eat raw meat often, but he follows cooked paleo diet. My child is 100% raw paleo. I'll Post some pictures and I will look for more properties like that. If we all contributes some (locally and internationally), we can definitely make anything possible.
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I'm referring the place in new york state. Recently I've purchased a property in new york state (I also own a home in Brooklyn, NY and in new jersey). I lived in Georgia in my past. but, new york is the best. city has it's own charm and it is very diverse. When you live in new york country, it's beautiful (especially the land is so fertile and so much wild lives existed). I can arrange to buy 75 acres of plain land with creek, old apple orchard and plenty of wild berries, frogs, wild turkeys, rabbits...etc and another 22 acres extra land next to my country home. it's less than 80 miles from new york city. Total of 97 acres of completely rural land. I also can get a better deal, 'cause these lands belong to the same farmer family who sold me the house. My husband does eat raw meat often, but he follows cooked paleo diet. My child is 100% raw paleo. I'll Post some pictures and I will look for more properties like that. If we all contributes some (locally and internationally), we can definitely make anything possible.
I'm down for NY state... New York country sounds amazing. (If I didn't relocate, I would visit at least.) Funny enough, I don't consider myself a city girl, but I lived in Spanish Harlem for a spell last year and was surprised to discover that I was actually loving NYC.
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I'm referring the place in new york state. Recently I've purchased a property in new york state (I also own a home in Brooklyn, NY and in new jersey). I lived in Georgia in my past. but, new york is the best. city has it's own charm and it is very diverse. When you live in new york country, it's beautiful (especially the land is so fertile and so much wild lives existed). I can arrange to buy 75 acres of plain land with creek, old apple orchard and plenty of wild berries, frogs, wild turkeys, rabbits...etc and another 22 acres extra land next to my country home. it's less than 80 miles from new york city. Total of 97 acres of completely rural land. I also can get a better deal, 'cause these lands belong to the same farmer family who sold me the house. My husband does eat raw meat often, but he follows cooked paleo diet. My child is 100% raw paleo. I'll Post some pictures and I will look for more properties like that. If we all contributes some (locally and internationally), we can definitely make anything possible.
How did you come to be so wealthy?
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Wow, yeah, you must be rich. I am poor, but am knowledgeable. That's all I would have to offer for now, is my intelligence and ability to work hard.
Only thing in my way now is, I have an application for University of Milwaukee Wisconsin being reviewed.(I am going for a tour on Tuesday) If I don't get accepted I will prob go to a 2 year college. I will find out what's going to happen within the next 2 weeks.
I would relocate, but I am poor. I buy food with digital foods stamps... So I think it would be wise for me to get some kind of degree.
But that's my current situation.
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I'm in NY. I've been dreaming of farm life/communal living as well. I know there's plenty of cheap land in PA. Would you guys be interested in growing native fruit trees and shrubs on the farm? They take little to no effort because they're suited to the area and they are way more nutritional than domesticated varieties. Plus it'll help support local ecosystems.
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I'm in NY. I've been dreaming of farm life/communal living as well. I know there's plenty of cheap land in PA. Would you guys be interested in growing native fruit trees and shrubs on the farm? They take little to no effort because they're suited to the area and they are way more nutritional than domesticated varieties. Plus it'll help support local ecosystems.
I think it'd be a great idea to plant/relocate some native fruit trees/shrubbery.
BTW, I just saw you're in Orange County. Whereabouts? I live in Putnam County but work up in Dutchess County (Beacon). :)
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yeah I have six raspberry bushes growing like crazy in my backyard.
awesome, my brother and I want to meet fellow paleo's as we're only a month into eating raw meat and feel a bit at odds with the rest of society. I live in Monroe, about an hour away from the city. this is getting off topic haha but could you recommend some good farms in the area that sell bulk?
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I had lately been thinking of raising my own chickens once I moved out, but this thread goes way beyond my little dream of owning myself a few chickens.
I know I had also always wanted to grow a bunch of fruit trees/bushes/plants in the backyard of my house once I owned my own, because I do so love fresh fruit.
But living on an estate with a bunch of other raw paleo dieters sounds pretty cool, too. It'd be a lot easier and cheaper to get fresher and guaranteed natural meats. And I wouldn't have to worry about eating in front of other people.
I don't know what I'd be able to bring to the community though, I'm not rich by any means and I don't have much talents other than being able to make a few decent doodles of stuff or other few artistic things. I would love to become a hunter though, but I'm not very strong. I don't know, I'd at least be interested in buying fresh meats from one of your farms, if you did happen to have one established in southern california.
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yeah relocating wild plants sounds cool, wild plum trees, black raspberries etc, maybe even sell them
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I have the idea of eventually buying some land in a tropical or sub tropical place and starting a farm there. Some place relatively cheap and fertile. Yesterday I had the opportunity to be shown a bit of one of the farms that is part of my co op, so I got a little taste of the farming life. This December I might have the opportunity to go to my former coworkers farm in Nicaragua for a few days. I'm trying to check it out and see if it's something that I would like to do.
Unfortunately because of food economic policy around the world it's more something I would do after having made money in some other field. I don't think farming is a viable means towards making much money these days, like I said because of monetary policy.
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I agree...unfortunately you can't make enough money in farming. We would hope to at least break even. Raising livestock and growing certain vegetation is definitely a good idea.
It seems we're all in similar financial situations that would require jobs on the side, but I still hope we can get something together for the near future.
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well if we are talking about a commune kind of situation I'm sure it can be done. It would require a great deal of time planning it all out of course so things start smoothly.
http://www.amazon.com/Creating-Life-Together-Ecovillages-Intentional/dp/0865714711/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1283825449&sr=8-1 (http://www.amazon.com/Creating-Life-Together-Ecovillages-Intentional/dp/0865714711/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1283825449&sr=8-1)
according to this book 90% of communes fail because the leaders jump right into things without much forethought. but the other 10% thrive even when the rest of society is in economic decline.
and while farming is hardly ever a ludicrous business, a lot of small farms are doing well because they are targeting to specific markets, selling specialty items and strengthening the local community.
http://www.amazon.com/One-Straw-Revolution-Introduction-Natural-Classics/dp/1590173139/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1283832803&sr=8-1 (http://www.amazon.com/One-Straw-Revolution-Introduction-Natural-Classics/dp/1590173139/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1283832803&sr=8-1)
also here the most sustainable (unlike organic farming, which often causes plenty of environmental destruction), cheapest and easiest farming method ever made by man. its called "do nothing" farming because nature does most of the work and the plants come out perfect. keep in mind the author is a vegetarian, so try to ignore the anti-meat slant. In fact he was one of the people who inspired Frances Moore Lappe to write "Diet For A Small Planet"! I still stand behind the man however, no matter how much havoc his words did wreak in the wrong hands. I suppose the method would not be cheap raising livestock, as there most natural state is roaming miles upon miles of prairie land.
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Here's another idea... would work for those with less income
a bunch of people.
-buy a big house on the outskirts of a city with a decent amount of land
food...
-raise a few animals only for self consumption...wink cough wink errhm (lets just say brains aint illegal anymore guys, ha just kidding)
-everyone get a license and hunt in every season (deer, duck, rabbit, goose etc.)
work and money...
-everyone will prob only need a part time ordinary job
Everything will be cheap, everyone will be happy and healthy.
Can't get any simpler and cheaper than that in modern times. Anyone from any level of income can be apart of it.
I am not at all concerned about the land just being mine. Shoot, in a million years humans as whole may be gone (or the earth as it is now extinct), and one day were going to die.
So, I am just saying, I don't care about this is mine and that is mine (as far as land etc.). I just want to live simple and healthy with other people and spread the good word.
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I think the best chance you have to make something happening quick is to run an add in your local area to all people interested in joining for a co-op.
You can tout the health benefits of organic farming, but do not mention raw paleo (until maybe later) as that could scare most people away.
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I think the best chance you have to make something happening quick is to run an add in your local area to all people interested in joining for a co-op.
You can tout the health benefits of organic farming, but do not mention raw paleo (until maybe later) as that could scare most people away.
i'm sorry to say that, Sully will live only with paleolithic people. from now through the next couple of years is a good to get a home like that. cash deal will be the best. but if all of us contributes little money from our pockets and get all these freedom, that all we want. simple life, stress free life... for me it's more important,'cause i've a child to raise.
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All sounds good Sully. There are plenty of communities/co-operatives doing exactly the thing you describe right now! The only difference is the RPD aspect. I have a wonderful community an hour drive from my home. About 40 adults and children live in a huge country manor house (previously a monastery I believe) with somewhere in the region of 40-50 acres. They are totally self-sufficient in fruit and veg as well as supplying quantities of meats and grains(!!) for breads etc.
The difficulty with our paleo slant would be having sufficient land for raising grass-fed animals as, i believe, the acreage required per animal is quite extensive. It may be beyond the budget or availability of a 'big house on the outskirts of a city'.
So, I am just saying, I don't care about this is mine and that is mine (as far as land etc.). I just want to live simple and healthy with other people and spread the good word.
That's always the beautiful intention and I share it absolutely. Sadly, such matters of ownership and finances do indeed become roots of general discontent as other issues and disagreements arise at such communities in my experience. The reality is that the most successful set-ups seem to be the ones which have it all worked out and written down from the beginning and move way beyond the 'love and peace' mindset.
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I agree...unfortunately you can't make enough money in farming. We would hope to at least break even. Raising livestock and growing certain vegetation is definitely a good idea.
It seems we're all in similar financial situations that would require jobs on the side, but I still hope we can get something together for the near future.
hi, i live in nothern nj too. i'm also interested for paleo farming buying up something in upstate ny. i can't afford by my own to do this alone. so, if we get enough people, that will do the job. i own a home in upstate ny, where rawzi and djr want to meet me over there. in the future sometimes, i wish you can join with us there too. we can also search some farming properties together. thanks.
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this is definitely the same thing i am working on myself, its inspiring to see you are thinking the same Sully, and to hear of everyones ideas and experiences:)
i have worked on a few farms and just got off one last week..ill be headed out to another next month for the season. although these are for profit and mostly produce farms(they are for farmers markets and Community supported agriculture) the only way to learn about farming, ranching, and living sustainable is to actually do it. I would suggest finding a farm through ATTRA internships, looking up ranches in your area on eatwild.org and inquiring about jobs etc...as well as finding legit communities that focus on sustainability, permaculture and even biodynamic and french intensive practices and farming(and learning as much about these areas in regards to farming and ranching on your own!)....there are a lot of farms dedicated to conservation, and sustainability where you can learn how to live with the land and animals in a mutually beneficial relationship...many quaker farms use native forage for their herds, however the seeds for this grass is rediculously expensive and as michael said earlier, it does require a LOT of acerage to feed herds and unless you have a trust its almost impossible without harming your land, i would suggest also thinking about rehabilitating already pastured land with cover crops(a lot of them are native), the poo from your animals and time as well as learning to hunt...
there are soo many more factors that go into determining the right location, herds, crops, what each individuals idea of sustainability is, its pretty much becomes one life to gain the knowledge and experience and a commitment to hard work to create something that is actually successful, it requires a lot of sacrifice...that said, there is no more fulfilling work of life that to actually be growing and maintaining your own on the most basic of levels.......i love the ideas of more and more communities growing and gaining support and knowledge from each other...its a nice enough dream for me that some day everyone could walk a few miles down the path and trade knowledge and meat! with my neighbor ...i have had this opportunity here in this lifetime and feel really blessed and happy to think its possible
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Just to revive this thread:
Before I began a RAF diet, I was determined to farm in Japan in a simple traditional style. I have spent time farming in Japan and would love to return to farm. I initially wanted to create a homestead, raising vegetables and grains and also raising animals for food and manure as a way to create a closed nutrient loop.
I am still very interested in farming, but now I feel my goals have slightly changed; now I would like to create a similar homestead but place more emphasis on raising a greater variety of animals in an area where hunting is also possible. I don't think I can do this in Japan (although fishing becomes a great trade off).
I may be forced to make a difficult decision, but I'm certain that I want to include raw animal foods into my diet permanently and if people are talking about creating a cooperative farm that is RAF friendly here in American, I would support it.
Is this a pipe dream or is there a possibility?
I may have to change my near future plans, as I planned to leave for Japan in the autumn. Maybe I'll go and come back (any experience is valuable in farming) to use my experience towards establishing this RAF community.
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I could use some help here on our farm. I'm working towards permascaping it. We have 3 heritage all grass fed milk cows, more on the way. Free range goats and chickens and a host of other birds. We've got the land but not enough time in the day to produce to our potential. You could focus on whatever animals you want, we have the space you would just have to make sure they are raised according to their genetic diet. We also have a spare room. If you, or anyone reading this is interested private message me for more details and discussion. The farm is located in stockholm, WI, which is right up against the mississippi in western wisconsin. Breathtakingly beautiful area, nice folk and plenty outdoor stuff to do! Most of our land has been resting for many years except for the last year of intensively managed grazing by yours truly. Thanks!
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I'm curious, are you also open to a cooperative of some sort which is RAF friendly?
I noticed that on Slanker's website the RAF diet is promoted.
http://www.texasgrassfedbeef.com/the_real_diet_of_man.htm (http://www.texasgrassfedbeef.com/the_real_diet_of_man.htm)
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Absolutely, I'm open to anything, but I'm fast learning how important community is and I want to build it while rebuilding the soil and producing nutrient dense, real food, efficiently and in congruence with the laws of nature.
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This is too good to be true!
What do you say we all pool together and begin planning something? This could be big and well worth it!
How exciting! :D
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My friend Forerunner on this site (homesteading today) welcomes people to come stay with him! He can teach everyone LOTS and LOTS and LOTS. He is off grid and loves to teach everyone to live this lifestyle.
I have been learning a LOT from visiting his farm. I raise rabbits, cows (both beef and dairy), chickens, goats (both beef and dairy), pigs, turkeys, and some peacocks. We eat about all of our own meat and grow our own garden as well.
We are in IL.
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I forgot to add his link on EXTREME composting! :) Well, everything about him is EXTREME, LOL!
http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=342651 (http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=342651)
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Tthats my dream too but with one exception.
I dont want to be in a community that lives together on a farm owned by one person.
Rather than that I want to have my own farm with my own land and be surrounded by other likeminded people with their own land as well. I dont like the idea of communal living but as far as if I were to do that, it would have to be with other raw animal eaters because what I find is that people start to hate you for being different especially with food which people get very emotional about.
an alliance of people like us all on our properties in the same area would be best in my opinion.
Sharing is just not an optimal situation in my opinion.
If people do this thuogh I would definitly buy some property adjecent to everyone else.
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(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/539060_10151401428383753_1215357758_n.jpg)
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beautiful cows