Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Hot Topics => Topic started by: Chris on July 26, 2012, 02:37:06 am
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Have You guy's heard of the a product put out by Blue Hill Bay? It's a pickled herring product that is cured with vinegar, or a combination of vinegar and wine. I found them at Whole Foods in the section of the smoked fish products. My question: Is this product considered "raw"? The package doesn't say it has been smoked. I'm assuming, or I thought it was a raw product cured in Vinegar/wine spices. Anyone familiar with this product or brand? What are your thoughts?
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Just about anything in a can or jar is going to be highly heated these days. You'd have to contact the company directly to ask them the highest temperature the product reaches in production.
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I though I'd pass on this bit of info to you all. The company (Blue Hill Bay) emailed me, and this is what they had to say regarding their Pickled Herring product:
Dear Chris: Thank you for your question. We receive Herring in a concentrated 11% salt brine. We then desalt the fish and cure in vinegar and salt brine. There is no pasteurization.
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Just because there is no pasteurization, doesn't mean it isn't heated. Did you ask specifically if the product was heated?
I would LOVE to find a pickled herring that has not been heated.
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Just because there is no pasteurization, doesn't mean it isn't heated. Did you ask specifically if the product was heated?
I would LOVE to find a pickled herring that has not been heated.
That will be my next question. Stay tuned. I'll find out!
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Just because there is no pasteurization, doesn't mean it isn't heated. Did you ask specifically if the product was heated?
I would LOVE to find a pickled herring that has not been heated.
Dorothy, looks like your wish just came true. This is what the company just emailed me:
Chris: The Herring is cured (Marinated) and not heated and is ready to eat.
They use vinegar and salt with spices in they're curing process (some have wine added also). It's not RACV though. I found it over @ Whole Foods if your curious, in the refrigerated smoked fish section. It's a clean product, unless your allergic to fish that is.
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Oh Boy! wOOt!!! Thank you Chris. O0
I love easy things like this to keep around. Let's hope Whole Foods near me carries it too.
I recently made crackers out of flax seeds and sunflower seeds. I can't wait to try the herring on them.
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Oh Boy! wOOt!!! Thank you Chris. O0
I love easy things like this to keep around. Let's hope Whole Foods near me carries it too.
I recently made crackers out of flax seeds and sunflower seeds. I can't wait to try the herring on them.
Your Welcome Dorothy. I hope you enjoy them. Another option for fish. Options are GOOD!
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I bought this about a month ago when my local healthfood market first got some and was finally inspired by this thread to try it. I've kept my eye out for decent herring, as herring is highly nutritious but difficult to come by in these parts, and I've never seen fresh herring for sale. This seems to be the best herring product I've tried so far. I'm not a fan of vinegar, but the white vinegar in this was not overpowering like with many vinegared foods. For any raw Paleo purists who are curious, the white vinegar may be grain-based and heated.
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Such herring is very typical in north Europe, it's not heated only kept in brine for some time, but usually it's sold fresh, not canned/pickled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matjes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matjes)
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I bought this about a month ago when my local healthfood market first got some and was finally inspired by this thread to try it. I've kept my eye out for decent herring, as herring is highly nutritious but difficult to come by in these parts, and I've never seen fresh herring for sale. This seems to be the best herring product I've tried so far. I'm not a fan of vinegar, but the white vinegar in this was not overpowering like with many vinegared foods. For any raw Paleo purists who are curious, the white vinegar may be grain-based and heated.
That's a great observation PaleoPhil regarding the vinegar. I'm not to familiar about how vinegar is made? Sounds like back to google to do a little research. You could also let the fish soak in some water for a period of time before you eat it? Just a suggestion if the vinegar is too much for you. It doesn't bother me at all to be honest. I'm glad you liked the product. It's a nice option to have for fish. Very convenient.
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Such herring is very typical in north Europe, it's not heated only kept in brine for some time, but usually it's sold fresh, not canned/pickled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matjes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matjes)
I wish we could get that over here! I started to use brine to preserve fresh fish I pick up at the market. It keeps the fish well preserved for an extended period of time. Plus, you don't have to eat it right away. As we all know fish isn't like wine, it doesn't get better with age.
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You could also let the fish soak in some water for a period of time before you eat it? Just a suggestion if the vinegar is too much for you.
Yup, that was the plan. I was just curious to see what it tasted like out of the jar. The other bottled herring I'd tried was too vinegar-saturated to make it worth the bother, but this one seems like it might do.
The brine preservation idea is a good one, thanks.
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The Blue Hill Bay herring soaking experiment did not work out as hoped. A night and a day of soaking in water with some fresh lemon juice added only managed to remove most of the onion flavor while leaving the vinegar flavor largely untouched. As a result, it tasted even more vinegary after soaking, rather than less. I'll probably try adding additional spice, to see if that helps.
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The Blue Hill Bay herring soaking experiment did not work out as hoped. A night and a day of soaking in water with some fresh lemon juice added only managed to remove most of the onion flavor while leaving the vinegar flavor largely untouched. As a result, it tasted even more vinegary after soaking, rather than less. I'll probably try adding additional spice, to see if that helps.
Your like a Madd Scientist PaleoPhil (your avatar fits you). Keep us posted on your experiments. I think that's a good idea, adding different spices to the water. Like garlic, cumin, cayenne, black pepper ect. Looking forward to your next post.
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Your like a Madd Scientist PaleoPhil (your avatar fits you).
Thanks! >D ;D
Keep us posted on your experiments. I think that's a good idea, adding different spices to the water. Like garlic, cumin, cayenne, black pepper ect. Looking forward to your next post.
The usual sorts of spices like garlic, cumin, black pepper (three of my favorites, by the way) and additional onion weren't enough to offset the strong vinegar taste, but I found that horseradish and wasabi mustard pretty much do the trick, and I suspect that cayenne would too.
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I tried the rollmops herring of Blue Hill Bay and for some reason I seem to prefer it to their standard pickled herring, or maybe I'm just getting used to it. Just watch out to not bite into the toothpicks. ;D It allegedly makes for a good Katerfrühstück.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/62/Rollmops_01_retouched.jpg/220px-Rollmops_01_retouched.jpg)
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The rollmops are one of my favorite foods now and I've gotten more used to the vinegar. Knowing that mackerel was one of the few foods rich in vitamin D, I had kept my eye out for a good source. Now my problem is that I can't stop eating them, as they're somewhat expensive, so I limit how much I buy. If Ray Peat is right that fatty fish are toxic, then Mother Nature is twisted indeed to make them so tasty. Yum, yum, yum! Chris and Inger are so right about the splendors of macker. God, how I love them! LOL
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Mackerel expensive? I paid 4 pounds sterling a kilo for raw mackerel in London. By UK standards, that's amazing. Only sprats and sardines were cheaper.
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Silly me, I meant herring, not mackerel. -[ I think 4 pounds sterling per kilo converts to over $14/.lb, which is much more than what I pay for grassfed meats, organs and fats. While the herring rollmops are only a bit under $10/.lb here, it's still significantly more per .lb than the grassfed meats/fats/organs, which is what I meant by expensive. However, the cost per vitamin D and other important nutrients is probably low compared to most foods, it's not the most expensive food per .lb I buy and it is super-tasty, so it is currently on my regular shopping list.
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Yes, that's right. The US benefits from larger economies of scale so that food-prices are much lower than in the UK.
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The rollmops are one of my favorite foods now and I've gotten more used to the vinegar. Knowing that mackerel was one of the few foods rich in vitamin D, I had kept my eye out for a good source. Now my problem is that I can't stop eating them, as they're somewhat expensive, so I limit how much I buy. If Ray Peat is right that fatty fish are toxic, then Mother Nature is twisted indeed to make them so tasty. Yum, yum, yum! Chris and Inger are so right about the splendors of macker. God, how I love them! LOL
Look Phil,
I recently read an article in Finnish searching about the toxicity of fish from Baltic sea and the sea around Finland, it being the most radioactive sea in the world. Very polluted too (Russia dumping wastes etc...). They have done research on it and what come out? The fishermen in Finland that eat lots of the polluted fish are among the healthiest!!! They showed elevated mercury levels etc in older age but they were very healthy despite that, in old age too! Now I am not a bit concerned anymore. I mix up my seafood sources anyway.
Check out this link by Chris Kessler too;
http://chriskresser.com/the-truth-about-toxic-mercury-in-fish?inf_contact_key=41f7677bcf837c8fdeee37e6ca363f6f5561ea605b1b98222e7fa2ded90147b6 (http://chriskresser.com/the-truth-about-toxic-mercury-in-fish?inf_contact_key=41f7677bcf837c8fdeee37e6ca363f6f5561ea605b1b98222e7fa2ded90147b6)
It is very possible to live cheap on seafood if one buys what is cheapest at the moment, buy whole fish as it is cheapest and use everything on it. I do that.. and once in a while something more expensive. I am pureeing raw herring heads with seaweeds for my fish head smoothie and other smallish fishheads too. The seaweeds makes it even more optimal, and makes it go down smoother too ;).
Yesterday I got 13 oysters.. I ate only 4 saving a part for today. They was amazing they were so fresh and juicy...!!
If I had the money I would live solely on oysters that's for sure.... food of the Gods. :-*
PS. Iodine protects against radioactivity that is why the Japanese did't suffered more from radioactive pollution they have very good protection traditionally eating so much seaweeds.
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I tried the rollmops herring of Blue Hill Bay and for some reason I seem to prefer it to their standard pickled herring, or maybe I'm just getting used to it. Just watch out to not bite into the toothpicks. ;D It allegedly makes for a good Katerfrühstück.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/62/Rollmops_01_retouched.jpg/220px-Rollmops_01_retouched.jpg)
I love these too but I feel not so well from the ones from the shop so I make them myself all the time now! Very easy! I just use raw organic applecider vinegar / organic white wine vinegar / lime juice, raw wild honey, Celtic seasalt, dill or other herbs / spices if you want to. Everything to taste. Let it marinate over night - enjoy! I can tell you they are even more delicious self made...:)
Super practical to take to work for lunch too!
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Raw herring fillets (no heads, etc) are 10eur/kg in Germany, it's comparable (and even cheaper) to grass-fed beef. Whole herring is 7-8eur.
100g raw herring has 1628IU Vitamin D (407% RDA)?! Never thought you can get so much from food.
A nice page with history and details on this fish: http://germanfood.about.com/od/germanfoodglossary/a/Herring.htm (http://germanfood.about.com/od/germanfoodglossary/a/Herring.htm)
Inger, this seems like just the right festival for you to visit :) http://goscandinavia.about.com/od/annualeventsinfinland/qt/balticherringmarket.htm (http://goscandinavia.about.com/od/annualeventsinfinland/qt/balticherringmarket.htm)
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Thanks for the info, folks. Inger, I've seen similar reports about Asian and Pacific Islander peoples consuming high amounts of mercury from wild seafood and being healthier than most people.
I live far from the ocean, so grassfed beef, fat and organs are generally much cheaper here than quality wild ocean fish, which has to be trucked hundreds of miles to get here. By buying the cheapest grassfed land animal sources, I would generally pay less than the cheapest wild seafood. Sometimes cheaper, smaller wild fish are sold and I do try them when they become available, but so far I find them to taste simply awful, and to not feel as good after eating them, which may help explain why they are cheaper. Freshwater fish that's sold is mostly farmed and low quality. I continue to try various cheaper fish, to see if any will work for me.
I've yet to see any unpickled raw herring filets here. There so far has been pickled and smoked/salted only and they both cost about twice what aLptHW4k4y pays. The smoked/salted stuff tastes awful and gives me a stomachache.
Interestingly, it turns out that different sources disagree over whether herring, mackerel, salmon, or tuna contain the highest vitamin D levels, so maybe I was already eating the richest sources before trying herring (here's a source that ranks other fish higher in vitamin D than herring: http://spryliving.com/articles/top-11-foods-highest-in-vitamin-d (http://spryliving.com/articles/top-11-foods-highest-in-vitamin-d)). The levels probably vary greatly depending on the source, the season, etc.
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I just made them like Inger, marinated overnight in apple cider vinegar and a bit of honey and salt. Served with some egg yolk and a bit of honey on top. Best thing ever, I ate almost half a kg of herring today :D It's nothing like the pickled ones you can buy, which have a like a 100x stronger vinegary taste and are barely edible (for me).
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I just made them like Inger, marinated overnight in apple cider vinegar and a bit of honey and salt. Served with some egg yolk and a bit of honey on top. Best thing ever, I ate almost half a kg of herring today :D It's nothing like the pickled ones you can buy, which have a like a 100x stronger vinegary taste and are barely edible (for me).
I have just got frozen Herring (butterfly) fillet for 4.59 Euro per 800 gm packing from Kaufland (germany).
Previously, I often ate the Bismarck Herring, but never liked the vinegar taste.
Now I think, tomorrow I will be really thankful to you and Inger after eating my self marinated Herring fillet.
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I ate, I agree it was the best thing I ate....
Inger, could you please tell me how long could we preserve it in apple cider vinegar?