Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Hot Topics => Topic started by: Aura on September 19, 2013, 12:08:30 am
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What if all you need is already right there in front of you? In a world where media constantly sends us messages about how to look, what to wear and how to think about life, it’s going to take someone wise and wild enough to get us thinking about going back to nature as a way to harness the true power we have as a species; to revive the vitality we once had as a natural part of the planet.
http://www.bodyenlightenment.me/blog/2013/09/interview-with-daniel-vitalis-you-can-influence-your-genetic-expression-by-going-back-to-the-wild/ (http://www.bodyenlightenment.me/blog/2013/09/interview-with-daniel-vitalis-you-can-influence-your-genetic-expression-by-going-back-to-the-wild/)
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Aura, you are onto something big. Those days we really need to seek the wild to stay healthy. And avoid Cities like the plague. I live for one more month in my sisters backyard in a tent, I have choosen to do so even if I could have an apartment. But I like this tent. I need to be close to the wild. Behind me is a forest and I hear the sound of the trees every night. I sit in my tent now too, just a candle lit.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2jbqs9.jpg)
We need the magnetism... the Schumann resonanz, the earthing... the almost EMF free zone more than ever before.
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Yes, Inger! :D
Great to know more and more people are getting interested into this re wilding theme.. 8)
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That was a really great interview with Daniel Vitalis. I wish he'd write a book and stop selling cheap Chinese-made supplements.
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We need the magnetism... the Schumann resonanz, the earthing... the almost EMF free zone more than ever before.
Schumann resonances? What is the their relation with our well being?? Aren’t they there all over?
After all the discussion and explanations we had about it, are you still convinced that EMFs are such a big nuisance, bigger than air pollution in cities? What about light pollution? What about the 50 tons of plutonium stored in La Hague pools? What about Fukushima? What about dwindling natural resources, fish stock depletion, oceans pollution, overpopulation, peak oil?
Sorry, there are obviously much more worrying threats than EMFs.
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The Schumann resonance is the Earts own "radiowaves". We could not exist without, that important are they. You need to read it up if you do not know about it Francois.
They are all over... but the way stronger waves we have artificially created makes it disturbs this natural "sound" that is here to "create".
I am not thinking what is the bigger nuisance Francois... I think, what is bad for us. I do not think the way you do I guess... I try to avoid anything that destroys. Anyways I will never be able to avoid everything, so I do what I can.
EMF's are pretty easy to limit. And I do believe they have a huge effect. Depending on your state of health and diet they have more or less impact.
That is my way of living and I have great results with is healthwise. What I cannot change, I do not bother with. Many choose to worry about stuff they cannot change, but do not change what they can.
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I know you are very knowledgeable about nutrition François but please watch and learn a bit about this field. ? Resonance Beings of Frequency (Full Documentary) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E31vNK19e0A#ws)
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I checked http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schumann_resonances (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schumann_resonances) and there’s nothing on that page linking health and life in general with Schumann resonances.
Observations of Schumann resonances have been used to track global lightning activity.
Then I googled for Schumann resonances – life – health and found this:
A very important point to be aware of is that this resonated radio from lightning is a vanishingly small component of the electromagnetic spectrum to which we're all naturally exposed. The overwhelming source is the sun, blasting the Earth with infrared, visible light, and ultraviolet radiation. All natural sources from outer space, and even radioactive decay of naturally occuring elements on Earth, produce wide-spectrum radio noise. Those resonating in the Schumann cavity are only a tiny, tiny part of the spectrum.
Nevertheless, because the Schumann resonance frequencies are defined by the dimensions of the Earth, many New Age proponents and alternative medicine advocates have come to regard 7.83 Hz as some sort of Mother Earth frequency, asserting the belief that it's related to life on Earth, despite its being so tiny and lost among all the other, stronger parts of the electromagnetic spectrum. Often we find that New Age beliefs are often based more on what seems emotionally satisfying than on sound science.
The most pervasive of all the popular fictions surrounding the Schumann resonance is that it is correlated with the health of the human body. There are a huge number of products and services sold to enhance health or mood, citing the Schumann resonance as the foundational science. Before looking at some of these claims in detail, it's noteworthy that neither Schumann resonances, electromagnetic radiation, or the Earth's ionosphere are mentioned in any medical or anatomical textbooks. There is no detectable or theoretically predicted relationship between either ELF radio or the number 7.83 and the health of human body. But let's look at some of the claims.
Many marketers of jewelry that claims to provide health or sports performance benefits cite the Schumann resonance as the science behind their claim. A notable example is the Power Balance bracelets. Tom O'Dowd, formerly the Australian distributor, said that the mylar hologram resonated at 7.83 Hz. When the bracelet was placed within the body's natural energy field, the resonance would "reset" your energy field to that frequency. Well, there were a lot of problems with that claim. First of all, 7.83 Hz has a wavelength of about 38,000 kilometers. This is about the circumference of the Earth, which is why its atmospheric cavity resonates at that frequency. 38,000 kilometers is just a little bit bigger than a 1 or 2cm hologram; there's no way that something that tiny could resonate such an enormous wavelength. O'Dowd's sales pitch was implausible, by a factor of billions, to anyone who understood resonance.
This same fact also applies to the human body. Human beings are so small, relative to a radio wavelength of 38,000 kilometers, that there's no way our anatomy could detect or interact with such a radio signal in any way.
Proponents of binaural beats cite the Schumann frequency as well. These are audio recordings which combine two slightly offset frequencies to produce a third phantom beat frequency that is perceived from the interference of the two. Here is a common binaural beat recording that produces a beat frequency of 7.83 Hz:
Claims for how this benefits the body are diverse, but most either say something generally similar to what O'Dowd said, or they would claim to change your brain's encephalogram, which they say is a beneficial thing to do. Brain waves, the fluctuations of current in the brain as measured at the scalp by an electroencephalogram, can range from near zero up to about 100 Hz during normal activity, with a typical reading near the lower end of the scale. This happens to overlap 7.83 — suggesting the aforementioned pseudoscientific connection between humans and the Schumann resonance — but with a critical difference. An audio recording is audio, not radio. It's the physical oscillation of air molecules, not the propagation of electromagnetic waves. The two have virtually nothing to do with each other. Audio waves do not affect radio waves, and vice versa. So by no science that's understood would we expect an audio tone to cause a brain's activity to change its frequency to match.
…
Variations on this specific claim are fairly ubiquitous, that our bodies' energy fields need to interact with the Schumann resonance but can't because of all the interference from modern society. It's all complete and utter nonsense. Human bodies do not have an energy field, in fact there's not even any such thing as an energy field. Fields are constructs in which some direction or intensity is measured at every point: gravity, wind, magnetism, some expression of energy. Energy is just a measurement; it doesn't exist on its own as a cloud or a field or some other entity. The notion that frequencies can interact with the body's energy field is, as the saying goes, so wrong it's not even wrong.
Another really common New Age misconception about the Schumann resonance is that it is the resonant frequency of the Earth. This is also completely wrong. Take another listen to blowing across the bottle: … (see the whole text with the link http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4352 (http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4352))
So, Inger, I afraid I have nothing else to say, except that I’m pretty sure it won’t convince you. We know from a lot of previous experiences that when people embark on such unfounded beliefs, there’s nothing to be done to get them recognize their mistake.
It’s a pity because with raw paleo we have something very rational and scientific that withstand particularly well the harshest questioning and could thus convince objective and influential scientists. But mixing it with pseudoscience completely discredit it, unfortunately.
Maybe the author of the article I quote is a bit too affirmative: there could perhaps be some interactions we ignore, but anyway the other side is much more extravagant and clearly on moving sands. We'd better stay on solid grounds.
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Papangue, I'm not knowledgeable at all concerning nutrition. All I know is... that I know about nothing in view of the immense complexity of life and of the Universe.
My Internet connection is not good enough to allow me properly watch that video. Anyway, I know that keeping a cellphone close to your ear may have nasty effects and it's better to keep it at some distance, the EMFs intensity decreasing with the square of the distance.
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The same issue occurs with people touting the 432 Hz vs. 440 Hz conspiracy. Those people know nothing about the constructs of music nor how our brain perceives them. As someone who has studied music for my livelihood for the past 13 years, including music theory, as well as perfect pitch (I can sing any note you ask me to sing and be perfectly in tune) the 440 Hz choice is only standard. 432 Hz is lower and therefore more relaxing, relatively.
All that to say, pseudoscience like the Schumann resonance is taken way too unrealistically.
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I think those Schumann frequencies are important for Life itself.
Otherwise there would be no reason at all for them to exist.
Now, it does not really matter to me if they work "actively" or "passively".
There MUST be at least A reason for them to exist. We can discuss over which one(s) is.
We live in a world of vibrations, we ARE vibrating as we read this topic and animals - like for example, the extraordinary ants - use them to feed themselves and get their life organized etcetc
We are messing around with frequencies and I am not surprised people today are more confused re what to do than ever before.
Since I am barefoot all day, stepping on natural surfaces/elements (water, mud, grass, stones..) I can feel a light tickling under the soles of my feet.
Guess it is because my blood flow is more stimulated than when I wore shoes..
And this single thing surely impacts the Whole, cannot tell scientifically how.
I can only write "hippy proses" to try to express the way I feel :P
IMO we gotta keep in mind science is finite and it is relative to the "time" and the "main stream beliefs" of its era.
Since we are running more and more towards a full transhumanist era, I can already predict (well, that is an easy guess, given the present trends l)..) there will be a time when it will be "scientifically "proven that we do not need real food anymore, it is enough to swallow a tiny pill..
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Iguana, you might be interested in reading these:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17572456 (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17572456)
http://www.hindawi.com/journals/jeph/2012/291541/ (http://www.hindawi.com/journals/jeph/2012/291541/)
The first is just an abstract, but the second link is a complete article.
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Thanks Haai.
The abstract of “Fielding a current idea: exploring the public health impact of electromagnetic radiation” says it’s “about the individual and public health impact of adverse non-ionizing radiation (a-NIR) from electromagnetic field (EMF) exposure emanating from certain power, electrical and wireless devices commonly found in the home, workplace, school and community.”
This has already been extensively discussed in this page http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/journals/optimizing-my-hormones/200/ (http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/journals/optimizing-my-hormones/200/)
I even wrote:
But again, I agree that staying for long periods near a strong EMF source (cell phone close to the ear, WiFi transmitter-receiver) should be avoided as much as possible. My home computer and phones are all wired.
Your second link is about
“benefits—including better sleep and reduced pain—from walking barefoot outside or sitting, working, or sleeping indoors connected to conductive systems that transfer the Earth's electrons from the ground into the body.”
I’m a great fan of being barefoot:
I've been walking, driving cars and heavy trucks barefoot for 41 years — as much as the meteo and temperatures allows. With shoes, I'm almost never comfortable, either too warm or too cold.
But I didn’t know about the other part and wonder about it:
“In the 1920s, White, a medical doctor, investigated the practice of sleeping grounded after being informed by some individuals that they could not sleep properly unless they were on the ground or connected to the ground in some way, such as with copper wires attached to grounded-to-Earth water, gas, or radiator pipes.” What does it mean? We do not find radiator pipes and copper wires in nature. What about animals and people sleeping on trees or above the ground on wooden structures? Why do cats prefer to sleep on furniture rather than on the ground? They don’t seem to care about being “grounded”. I admit I didn’t read the whole paper as it’s very long and I’ve got other things to do, including answering here…
Back to Schumann resonances:
I think those Schumann frequencies are important for Life itself.
Otherwise there would be no reason at all for them to exist.
Now, it does not really matter to me if they work "actively" or "passively".
There MUST be at least A reason for them to exist. We can discuss over which one(s) is.
But plenty natural phenomenon and occurrences exist without being important for life. Many such as natural background radiation (cosmic rays, natural radioactivity), mercury emitted by volcanoes, etc. are even detrimental to life. We don’t even know if these Schumann resonances have an effect on life, and in the seemingly improbable case they would have some effect, it could as well be detrimental than beneficial.
IMO we gotta keep in mind science is finite and it is relative to the "time" and the "main stream beliefs" of its era.
Sure, and science itself doesn’t pretend to be the holder of the ultimate truth. On the contrary, science is a permanent questioning of previous beliefs, methodical doubt being one of the main pillars of science. But scientists are humans and are thus generally biased somehow, very often sticking to obsolete views and beliefs.
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What about animals and people sleeping on trees or above the ground on wooden structures? Why do cats prefer to sleep on furniture rather than on the ground? They don’t seem to care about being “grounded”. I admit I didn’t read the whole paper as it’s very long and I’ve got other things to do, including answering here…
Maybe it's "enough grounding" that they walk barefoot, so sleeping grounded has less effect than it has on someone walking in shoes all day? Not that I have any opinion on this grounding stuff, I tried it for a few weeks while sleeping and didn't notice any effect whatsoever.
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The floor of most houses, just like the furniture, is not grounded. But anyway, just because the phenomenon of earthing exists, does not mean that animals are aware of it, or at least the effects of it.
The advantage an animal gains from sleeping in a tree is increased safety. There are benefits to earthing, but protection from predators is not one of them.
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Sorry Iguana, I posted those links in response to the following:
After all the discussion and explanations we had about it, are you still convinced that EMFs are such a big nuisance, bigger than air pollution in cities? What about light pollution? What about the 50 tons of plutonium stored in La Hague pools? What about Fukushima? What about dwindling natural resources, fish stock depletion, oceans pollution, overpopulation, peak oil?
Sorry, there are obviously much more worrying threats than EMFs.
I believe that EMFs are a big nuisance. I wouldn't know how to compare it with air and light pollution, but i would guess that electromagnetic pollution is worse than light pollution.
By the way, water, gas and radiator pipes usually happen to be earthed. They therefore conduct the earth's electrons. So sleeping on a device whereby your body is in contact with metal that is connected to one of these pipes with a metal wire (good conductor of the earth's electrons), is as though you are sleeping on the ground outside, which did and does happen in nature.
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One more thing:
it is not only wireless devices that produce electromagnetic radiation. All electric wiring does too. I was measuring the electrical current in my body one time with a voltmeter, and it went sky high when I stood on an electrical wire. Just touching the plastic casing of my laptop causes a large increase too. But when earthed the reading was reduced dramatically, to almost zero.
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This guy is very categorical :
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/60012-Electric-razors-and-EMF (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/60012-Electric-razors-and-EMF)
Ok, as a physics student, I feel the need to shed a little light on rumors like this one. We are constantly bombarded by electro-magnetic radiation (EMR). Most of the EMR we are exposed to is completely harmless. Visible light being the prime example (yes, light is a form of radiation). Most of the radiation we are exposed to on a daily basis has a considerably lower energy than visible light. That means that radio waves, microwaves, and infrared light do not contain enough energy to break the bonds in our DNA (cause cancer). In fact, it takes radiation in the upper part of the ultraviolet spectrum to do any damage to the human body. Lesson: the light from your cellphone screen has more energy than the signals it runs on. Result: cellphones cannot cause cancer.
As for electro-magnetic fields (EMF), these do not pose any risk to humans whatsoever. EM fields work on charged particles, and the molecules in the human body are generally neutral. Also, EM fields permeate the entire universe (hence the propagation of light through a vacuum). The Earth itself has a very strong magnetic field, and that doesn't seem to have hurt us thus far.
I stumbled into these too:
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/magnetic-fields (http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/magnetic-fields)
Magnetic Field Exposure and Cancer: Questions and Answers
http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/161/2/136.full (http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/161/2/136.full)
Self-reported Electrical Appliance Use and Risk of Adult Brain Tumors
Anyway, as a precautionary measure it could perhaps be wise to limit the use of electric shavers, hair driers, and cell phones too near the head. That said, I’ve been using an electric shaver (which may well be the worst since it couldn’t be nearer to the body!) for decades!
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Back to Schumann resonances:But plenty natural phenomenon and occurrences exist without being important for life.
Personally, I do not think it is ever possible.
But anyway, could you make an example?
Many such as natural background radiation (cosmic rays, natural radioactivity), mercury emitted by volcanoes, etc. are even detrimental to life. We don’t even know if these Schumann resonances have an effect on life, and in the seemingly improbable case they would have some effect, it could as well be detrimental than beneficial.
Being "somewhat detrimental" is still part of Life. It is good for the whole.
Brahma Vishnu and Shiva alias the Creator, the Preserver and the Destroyer.
Sure, and science itself doesn’t pretend to be the holder of the ultimate truth. On the contrary, science is a permanent questioning of previous beliefs, methodical doubt being one of the main pillars of science. But scientists are humans and are thus generally biased somehow, very often sticking to obsolete views and beliefs.
Right.
8)
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The advantage an animal gains from sleeping in a tree is increased safety. There are benefits to earthing, but protection from predators is not one of them.
Well said.
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Personally, I do not think it is ever possible.
But anyway, could you make an example?
I mentioned examples of things that are detrimental to life, such as cosmic radiation, natural radioactivity and mercury. There is certainly a whole range of things from detrimental to beneficial to life on Earth, with some neutral ones in-between. Examples could be a planet orbiting a distant star, a few rocks in more or less somewhere, etc.
Being "somewhat detrimental" is still part of Life. It is good for the whole.
Brahma Vishnu and Shiva alias the Creator, the Preserver and the Destroyer.
It may be “good” for the whole but bad for you as an individual. If Schumann resonance is good for the whole universe (which is probably the case) but bad for your health, what would be your benefit in trying to being exposed to it as much as you can? Since we don’t know, I wouldn’t bother about it.
BTW, defining what is good for the whole is a perilous exercise. I would say that growing entropy is “bad” while decreasing entropy (negentropy) is “good”. That can be valid if consider organized complexity as “good”, but we are then back to the starting point!
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If the tree is alive, it's has lots of water in it's trunk and limbs, and thus can transport current from it's roots.
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"EM fields work on charged particles, and the molecules in the human body are generally neutral."
There are plenty of molecules in the body that are not neutral, for example free radicals and antioxidants.
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PS : I don't dispute the fact that staying as much as possible outdoors in an unspoiled environment is beneficial for our physical and psychical well being. But it's useless and pseudoscientific to invoke Schumann resonance for that. ;)
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There is certainly a whole range of things from detrimental to beneficial to life on Earth, with some neutral ones in-between. Examples could be a planet orbiting a distant star, a few rocks in more or less somewhere, etc.
Some events like those you just described per se could passively affecting us humans or existing things but they might "actively" impact on something else that in its turn could affect us more directly etcetc..
And sometimes we just do not see the inter-connections..
IMO, extrapolating one factor from the whole often gives a distorted perception..
It may be “good” for the whole but bad for you as an individual. If Schumann resonance is good for the whole universe (which is probably the case) but bad for your health, what would be your benefit in trying to being exposed to it as much as you can? Since we don’t know, I wouldn’t bother about it.
Right.
BTW, defining what is good for the whole is a perilous exercise. I would say that growing entropy is “bad” while decreasing entropy (negentropy) is “good”. That can be valid if consider organized complexity as “good”, but we are then back to the starting point!
ALL is good. ;)
Life is about birth (creation) , maturity (procreation) and death (disintegration).
Our current attachment to life - because of ignorant fear of death - is what s creating tragic imbalances.
We are trying to domesticate Life itself. Keeping the divine breath trapped into our bodies..
Living in a constant apnea..
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PS : I don't dispute the fact that staying as much as possible outdoors in an unspoiled environment is beneficial for our physical and psychical well being. But it's useless and pseudoscientific to invoke Schumann resonance for that. ;)
Sure, there is soooo much more to invoke out there, spirits of the Forest ;)
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Sure, there is soooo much more to invoke out there, spirits of the Forest ;)
I prefer that! ;)
You're awesome!
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I think we mean the same in the end Francois.. you just got freaked out by my tent pic where I look like death..lol I am sorry. i very much follow my instincts in this issue and not any theory, I always test and then I know. :) The theory just happends to match my own experiences. I can even "hear" the "vibration" at times when I am out in the wild - it totally fills me with joy, it has similarities to an orgasm. Call me crazy ;)
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I can even "hear" the "vibration" at times when I am out in the wild - it totally fills me with joy, it has similarities to an orgasm. Call me crazy ;)
I think I know what you are talking about!
;) ;) :-* :-*
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Aura, so glad you are familiar to this fountain of joy.... :) :) :) I wish everyone knew
@ Francois, just a cut for you what EMFs does to the BBB (blood brain barrier)
The brain is also completely protected from outside toxins by a blood brain barrier that is made up from glia cells. This astrocytic footplates play a massive role in neuronal function and neurotransmitter function as well. Recent science has shown them to be much more important than most neuroscientists have ever expected based upon the published literature. They also are the cells in the human brain where most tumors seem to form from that kill humans from primary brain tumors. Dr. Allen Frey showed this in the 1960’s in studies done for the US military that the BBB is made permeable to methylene blue when the brain is subjected to an external non native electromagnetic field. Normally, methylene blue is excluded from entering the brain by the BBB. When the field was altered, the surface of the brain was turned bluish/purple within seconds.
Electromagnetic Fields and Leakage of the Blood Brain Barrier: Dr. Leif Salford (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_WJ_aJPWIA#ws)
http://www.cellphonetaskforce.org/?page_id=594 (http://www.cellphonetaskforce.org/?page_id=594)
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Thanks, Inger. ;)