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Messages - paper_clips43

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Hmm yah I need to find better quality than Millers. Even though I have never had any parasite issue that I am aware of I still like to eat the highest quality. Its more of a moral thing because I like supporting the animal having a good life. I heard about a farm with hogs fed on gf-milk, kelp, alfalfa, and acorns only one month out of the year. I might check them out. I wonder how wild Javelina would taste.

Well Im convinced. After over a year of Raw Paleo I think its time I try some raw pork. Anyone familiar with Miller Organics Pork? Is it good quality?

General Discussion / Re: What rawpalaeo foods are you eating right now?
« on: October 18, 2013, 10:12:30 pm »
I also heard they can stick to your throat. Another thing I heard was if you squeeze the grasshopper from the middle to the back as you hold its wings you can squeeze the poop out of it. This may help digestion because grasshoppers can eat sometimes poisonous plants that might upset the stomach a little bit.

General Discussion / Re: What rawpalaeo foods are you eating right now?
« on: October 17, 2013, 11:32:10 am »
For dinner:
lamb marrow bones sitting out for a couple days.
and a lamb foot. (I skipped the whole soaking in acid deal and found that after letting a foot sit out for a day I could just scrape away the collagen jerky and have myself quite a delicious meal) ;D

heres the aftermath ;)

General Discussion / Re: What rawpalaeo foods are you eating right now?
« on: October 17, 2013, 06:16:30 am »
I finally got a connection for fresh oysters! I had 20 of them in one sitting. Feel soooo good  ;D 8)

General Discussion / Re: The Taste of Bone Marrow.
« on: October 15, 2013, 01:40:46 am »
All the meat I order is from North Star Bison and it is the only grass fed meat I have access too currently. I take it you have never had the issue of dry gritty marrow? Then I suspect the animal quality might be the culprit.

I have noticed similar digestion issues if I eat marrow with meat and I have been eating it only with the collagen on my lamb knuckles which seems to digest fine. Also with liver occasionally. When I eat it with meat I can hear my tummy rumbling for about an hour. I am going to try your method soon and see if this helps. The sound of warm marrow makes me salivate even though I just ate 6 bones for breakfast!  ;D I do notice that marrow tends to taste better if I leave the bones out for at least 24 hours and even 48 hours or longer.

Also something I noticed after I just finished my breakfast was the marrow I scooped out of a lamb knuckle I had soaking in lime juice was really moist and delicious. I think I am going to experiment with soaking the gross looking marrow bones in an acid base to potentially soften them up as well.

General Discussion / The Taste of Bone Marrow.
« on: October 14, 2013, 10:01:07 pm »
So I find myself instinctually craving bone marrow and I pretty much eat it every day. It also digests the best of any other raw fat I consume. Only about one out of every five bones I eat the marrow out of actually tastes good though. Most of the time its this dry gritty taste with spots of blood that make it taste horrible to me and I have to cover my nose. Then once in a while I get that perfect bone with very fatty and greasy marrow that tastes sweet and delicious. I feel like I could eat buckets of that stuff.

My question is that even though most marrow tastes bad does that actually mean I should not consume it even though I instinctually crave it?

I ordered sheep butter from Millers a while back and it was the most delicious butter I have ever tasted. It was not salted either.

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 09, 2013, 10:47:49 pm »
Haai posted this in another thread and it basically says the reason we have bigger brains is due to bones and brains we were able to gather from the kills of other animals.

Journals / Re: PaleoPhil's Journal
« on: October 09, 2013, 04:01:47 am »
ok good. I have one at that stage.

Journals / Re: PaleoPhil's Journal
« on: October 09, 2013, 01:37:19 am »
At what stage of ripeness do you eat your plantains?

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 08, 2013, 04:40:12 am »
I have found that authors who write about unconventional fermentation (as opposed to mainstream products like sauerkraut, kimchi, idli, etc.) can be vague when compared to modern recipe writing. I don't think this is a deliberate attempt to be unclear; rather, the process of fermentation is very forgiving and can be achieved in many different ways.

Katz's reference was to a vat of whey was from a woman in Iceland:
Another example of fermentation affecting bones in Katz's book is Japanese narezushi:

Do they mention if it is refrigerated or not?

Hot Topics / Re: Anomaly
« on: October 06, 2013, 12:07:24 pm »
an update on the medicinal weed.
There is a new trend in the cannabis community of medical strains. These have low thc and high cbd/cbn counts which relieve many specific pains.

I have trid some of these and while they do have less of a trippy effect due to lower thc I often get even higher on thsoe strains as the cannabinoids make my body feel very nice while leaving my mind less high.

So although the medicinal strains do have a different effect, dont assume that they make you any less high.

Harlequin was one of these with high CBD. Very very good bud.

My uncle is a Naturopathic doctor who has never smoked weed. He takes a CBD tincture every day and has for the past few months. Im going to have to ask him what effects he's noticed.

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 06, 2013, 12:00:40 pm »
Yes my first broth was slightly thick and this was at room temperature. I also couldn’t drink all of it making me think it had a decent amount of protein. Looking back on it I feel like it tasted a lot less sour then I would expect water with two limes in it to taste. Maybe it was partially fermented. I enjoyed it though and am absolutely going to keep making it and drinking it. If anything it was hydrating and the limes are good for digestion. Its also a lot easier than I thought it would be. I just now bought some  grass fed cow knuckles (frozen) from the health food store and have them now soaking in water with just one lime this time.

Also, the lamb knuckles after soaking a few days in the acid broth had pockets of clear gelatin in the raw hanging off it that were so delicious.
I am probably going to have to buy the book "The art of fermentation" in the very near future. I shouldn’t right now though due to all the money I just spent on a ferriers file, a flint knife, and a large order of bones to arrive on Thursday. Maybe someone can post the directions and recipes if they own a copy.

I have access to 100%grass fed whey (locally) and am going to try lacto-fermenting the bones as soon as I can. I wonder if Sandor mentions the bones being refrigerated that whole year or left at room temperature. I am also curios if submerging the bones in liquid is going to promote harmful anaerobic bacteria.

Thats incredible information about the fats. I hadn’t made that connection. Who classifies these things anyway? Is it the FDA?

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 06, 2013, 03:07:07 am »
Well I only know from experience. And very recent experience at that. I have to continue to experiment and see what works. I drank the broth today of some lime juice and a splash of ACV that had two lamb knuckles soaking in it for about 3 days and it was very satiating. I don’t know of any research on the subject although I have plans to do my own. Eating the knuckles for breakfast the past few days definitely felt nourishing.

One idea I had so far was to see how much protein the broth is extracting would be to boil a batch down at some point into pure gelatin and see how much you get.

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 05, 2013, 04:24:22 am »
Sandor Ellix Katz describes fermentation of bones in whey in his book The Art of Fermentation. His description includes very long (like a year) soaking of bones in whey. Your process reminds me of no-heat bone broth made by soaking bones in water with a smidgeon of acid (like lime juice or vinegar). I made a batch as soon as I read your post. I'll eat it this weekend.

You only use a small amount of acid in order to be able to drink the water afterwards? Thats smart. Im going to try that next. I was hoping to soften the cartilage more with more acid.

All are totally non essential.

Great point. Heres a theory

So non essential means non essential because the body creates itself. Maybe these amino acids are so important to our body's that the body  creates them itself. Where as essential amino acids are ok to go a day or two with out. In fact they me be prove beneficial to fast from.

General Discussion / Re: Raw coconut
« on: October 05, 2013, 12:29:01 am »
This lady claims all her coconut products are RAW and if you read her story she talks about following advice from Aajonus.

Have not yet tried her products though...

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 05, 2013, 12:22:23 am »
@Paleo Phil

The first link was broken and I was not able to access it. I am very interested in fermenting the bone and before I start that experiment I would like to see if I could use something other than sorghum. I wonder if fermenting them in whey would prove beneficial...

General Discussion / Re: How to eat cartilage, tendons, and collagen raw.
« on: October 05, 2013, 12:17:28 am »
"What's there in cartilage so essential to go through so much trouble?

I think there is none.  Cartilage gets broken down to the same amino acids as more digestible meat. In very lean times it surely adds extra nutrients.  In other times I think it is totally not necessary."

Actually thats absolutely wrong.

Cartilage has 0% tryptophan which muscle meat is full off. Cartilage is also full of glycine, proline, hydroxyproline which are scarce if at all present in muscle meat. So as you can see just from the amino acid content cartilage is the opposite of muscle meat.

Is it really that hard to think about how our paleo ancestors more than likely spent days only consuming old bones and know muscle meat until they got a fresh kill. Or you really think they just had a plethora of muscle meat at all times and only consume organs and muscles and threw the bones away?

When I find more relating to minerals and vitamins I can post a link as I am sure the composition is different as well.

I just ordered a wish bone tendon, and an achilles tendon from northstar bison and am going to post pics and experiences when I get them. Today I consumed another lamb foot and lots of lamb marrow with a little bit of lamb neck meat and fat. I was surprised at how much energy I had from yesterdays cartilage breakfast and am wondering how ill feel today.

Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« on: September 24, 2013, 12:04:34 am »
Thats great you eat your gelatin and connective tissue raw Lex. I do as well just not as much as I would like, hence the broth. I hope to move entirely back to raw and believe the broths are going to help me transition.

Do you have any links to raw methods of gelatin extraction paleophil? And are you saying, or theorizing, that because people are depleting their iron levels with dairy and tea that bone broth is more needed due to high iron levels?

Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« on: September 21, 2013, 10:33:04 pm »
Praying for a speedy and healthy recovery for your Lex. That was quite a lot to deal with man and congratulations on getting the catheter removed. I had a catheter in for 3 days when I was hospitalized after rupturing my spleen. It was more annoying and painful than the injury and I had to make them remove it on the third day.

I noticed how many supplements, remedies, diets, and cures you have tried and am wondering how bone broth never made it on your list? You even have experienced the Rife Machine which I was “this” close to buying one but stopped because of your experience with them. Or at least decided to hold off...

Still though I have to ask. Would you consider supplementing with bone broth/collagen/gelatin for a period of time and see if it helps at all?

I am three weeks into about 30-40 grams of collagen protein a day now and still seeing improvements. I understand it could takes years to notice real changes although so far I hope to continually have it in my diet for a long time.

Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« on: September 12, 2013, 09:50:34 pm »
That I can not answer.

The number one reason I brought this up is because after reading this forum for over a year I have to value the opinion and experience of Lex and a few others. I like to debate my beliefs with those I who respect in order to either strengthen them or disprove them and walk away learning something new.

The second reason I brought this up is because after reading a lot of Lex’s history through his journal I noticed, bone broth, was something that was not mentioned that much, or at least I didn’t read it, and figured it was worth mentioning.

The third reason I brought this up is because it is currently a belief of mine that bone broth is good for me. I have been contemplating how cultures may have eaten nothing but bones for days until killing a fresh animal. The fact that it supplies high levels of gylcine, glutamine, proline, and hydroxyproline and none of which are in meat amazes me and inspires me to continue research it. I bet there is information out there connecting these amino acids to prostate health although I have yet to stumble upon it.

Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« on: September 10, 2013, 11:29:04 pm »
I understand that bone broth is not considered paleo by this rawpaleodietforum standards. Although I have been pondering and I would bet that back in paleo times they would go without animal meat for awhile and resort to spending all day crushing bones into powder and eating that. They probably had much stronger teeth and could actually eat the whole bone. Also I bet wolves eat the whole bone or at least as much as they can.

Its possible that the first non paleo food consumed was bone broth. I bet when fire was discovered the first thing they used it for was bones.

An animal consists of %50 protein from meat and %50 protein from collagen. So potentially we should be consuming the same ratio...

Thats great to hear you you eat lots of bones and bone marrow. Have you ever gone long periods of time where you believe your collagen consumption was equal to your meat consumption?

Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« on: September 10, 2013, 01:45:20 am »
I completely agree that its going to take years to notice the effects of something diet related. Even though I consider myself more sensitive than most I am by no means and exception to this rule.

All that aside can you really deny the fact that the long living cultures around the world, Himalayans, Vilacabamba, and Georgia Russia all have bone broth as a main staple in their diet. It also provides the opposite side of the Amino Acid Spectrum that you can absolutely not get from muscle meat or organs. Collagen and Gelatin have been shown to very healing.

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