Author Topic: Herbal medicine issue  (Read 9111 times)

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Offline TylerDurden

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Herbal medicine issue
« on: April 23, 2009, 11:31:23 pm »
I discussed the issue of herbal medicine in the palaeolithic with  1 member, and he suggested I make a thread re this. I did point to 1 scientific study that proved beyond doubt that herbs were used c.60,000 years ago. I also pointed to references re wild animals(even carnivores) using herbs to self-medicate themselves. I think, therefore, it's reasonable to assume that using herbs is indeed Palaeo, given herbal use by nonsentient animals.

I still think that all supplements are bad and not appropriate for the RAF world except as a last resort, in case a quick fix is needed, and, undoubtedly, most herbal suppplements are highly processed, filled with artificial chemicals/preservatives etc., but using wild herbs from the countryside is fine.

Can't show those references right now as I'm pressed for time, but in the next 2 days I should be able to provide a few more references to back my points, in addition to the ones I've looked at laready.
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2009, 01:50:25 am »
OK, here's the link re the claim re Neanderthals frequently using herbs as medicine c.60,000 years ago in the Upper Palaeolithic period:-

http://www.archtext.co.uk/onlinetexts/britian_and_europe/chapter03.htm

Then there's plenty of evidence of wild animals(including carnivores) self-medicating themselves with herbs, such as chimpanzees, gorillas organ-utangs etc.(and these 3 are after all primates, like us):-

http://www.tigerhomes.org/animal/animal-self-medication.cfm

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v25/n13/curt01_.html

Here's a study showing that the australopithecine apemen Palaeo ancestors ate  aquatic "herbaceous" vegetation. Australopithecines were present in Africa from 3.9 to 3.0 million years ago.

In short, it is clear that herbal medicine was practised by our hominid ancestors throughtout history and prehistory including the whole of the Palaeolithic. It would be extremely unlikely for our apemen ancestors, before they emerged from being just animals,to suddenly give up using herbal medicine only for our human cavemen ancestors to then take it up again c.60,000 years BC.

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Offline lex_rooker

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2009, 11:17:41 am »
Hmmmmm, a few readers but not much action.  I'm surprised.

I personally don't think Herbal remedies have much place in the paleo landscape.  Even the resources provided by the links admit that the evidence is rather "thin" to use their words.  I'm not against Herbal remedies per se, they have there place.  I just think it is a bit of a stretch to promote them as part of a paleo lifestyle.  Since this forum started with a foundation built around RAW foods, even cooking is not really promoted and our efforts are to help people transition off of cooked fare rather than to promote cooking as healthful.  I feel the same way about recommending supplements and herbal remedies.  If we are eating proper foods in their proper raw state, we shouldn't need supplements or herbal medications to remedy conditions brought on by poor nutritional choices.  Changing to a proper diet should be sufficient.

Recommending supplements or herbal remedies outside of correcting a nutritional deficiency would be to attempt to affect a "cure" for a "diseased state" which is tantamount to offering medical advice.  I don't think this has any place on a forum dedicated to a Raw Paleo lifestyle and could potentially cause legal problems.

There may be indications that plant materials were used by early humans for various purposes, however, we have no way of knowing what plants were used to achieve what end.  What was found in graves 60,000 years ago might well have been for religious or ceremonial purposes - wishing the dead Godspeed as it were.  We offer plants and flowers (herbs?) at gravesite services today.  I don't think anyone would suggest that flowers are thrown on the casket as it is lowered into the ground because of their medicinal nature.  It is an offering of love and respect.

My 2 cents on the subject.

Lex

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2009, 06:40:28 pm »
First off, the fact that wild animals routinely self-medicate themselves with herbs even though they are on a natural , perfect diet(except for a very few exceptions such as carnivorous pandas who, of all things, eat bamboo) means that diet alone isn't necessarily the answer to everything. There are a multitude of other things one needs to do such as heavy exercise(I've noticed that if I stop doing exercise and rely only on diet, I'm healthy but not anywhere near optimum).

Simply, we as a forum are supposed to roughly emulate animals in the wild re diet/exercise so we should adopt  practices such as herbal medicine which wild animals also practise.

Another obvious point is that most of us come to raw animal food diets because they are in very poor health as a result of cooked diets so they may need herbs to alleviate symptoms etc. I'm not in favour of promoting processed supplements, but it's quite a different thing to frown upon using  wild herbs grabbed from the roadside etc. Plus, we already advocate (cooked) pemmican in extremis such as when travelling with no access to raw foods, so it would be a double-standard to ban herbal teas, which is another (2nd-rate) compromise.

As regards the neanderthal burial issues, it might interest you to know that flowers also have medicinal properties(eg:- marigold) and it's stretching one's imagination too far to claim that humans weren't aware of such properties or didn't use them - indeed, many herbs and flowers became associated with religious festivals etc. precisely because of their  widespread medicinal use, not just because they looked pretty. And there is no logic behind the notion that our apemen ancestors suddenly gave up using herbal medicine when they became sentient and then restarted it late into the Palaeolithic era.

« Last Edit: April 28, 2009, 09:55:15 pm by TylerDurden »
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Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2009, 07:29:05 pm »
I know 2 popular herbal concoctions where the maker followed the healing pattern of the animal.

With the American Hoxsey Formula, it was grand daddy Hoxsey who followed the eating pattern of his sick old HORSE who nursed itself back to health.

With the Filipino Herbalist Ka Rey Herrera who was uneducated, he merely followed the eating pattern of his GOAT.  He stumbled onto Rey Herbal and this concoction he sold takes the guess work out of juicing.  See www.reyherbal.com , we made their website... a small plug for my web design business.  ;D  I was glad to have made it for them because it's pretty useful in the realm of nutritional healing, it works.

We know quite a good number of regular plants, herbs, bark, flowers, seeds, etc that are used for healing.  When I was absolutely sick in 2005, my first healer was a herbalist who gathered herbs by herself and made them from scratch. 

By experience though and what my new teacher made clear to me is that nutrition must be the foundation of all healing... (RPD yay!) ... then you can do your manipulation... (herbs, detox, etc.)
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Offline lex_rooker

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2009, 01:23:26 am »
Another obvious point is that most of us come raw animal food diets because they are in very poor health as a result of cooked diets so they may need herbs to alleviate symptoms etc. I'm not in favour of promoting processed supplements, but it's quite a different thing to frown upon using wild herbs grabbed from the roadside etc. Plus, we already advocate (cooked) pemmican in extremes such as when travelling with no access to raw foods, so it would be a double-standard to ban herbal teas, which is another (2nd-rate) compromise.

Not sure things are as obvious to me as they are to you.  I've never seen a wild animal medicate itself.  Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, just that it's not rampant enough that I've ever noticed it.  I also have no way of knowing what the animal is medicating itself for.  Does it have a headache? Stomach flu? Diarrhea?  Seems a bit far fetched to me.

I wouldn't want to recommend roadside plants.  Many dangerous alkaloids in those puppies and it took me a good bit of time with someone who knew what he was doing to show me what plants were edible in the foothills of California.  Many lookalikes that can make you really sick - and kill you if you eat too much.

As regards the neanderthal burial issues, it might interest you to know that flowers also have medicinal properties(eg:- marigold) and it's stretching ones imagination too far to claim that humans weren't aware of such properties or didn't use them - indeed, many herbs and flowers became associated with religious festivals etc. precisely because of their widespread medicinal use, not just because they looked pretty. And there is no logic behind the notion that our apemen ancestors suddenly gave up using herbal medicine when they became sentient and then restarted it late into the Palaeolithic era.

I think it is stretching the imagination quite a bit to assume that there was wide use of specific herbs to address specific medical issues.  First, we have no idea what the herbs were, and second we have no idea what medical issue they were attempting to address.   I don't think our "apemen ancestors suddenly gave up using herbal medicine when they became sentient".  I'm not at all convinced that they ever used herbal medicine to any real extent to begin with. The amount of identified beneficial alkaloids in growing plants is often so small that it would take eating a bushel basket of flowers, leaves, or bark to get any measurable benefit.  Again, the evidence is rather "thin".  In my case, the need for medicine, herbal or other wise, went away when I adapted a better diet.

I know 2 popular herbal concoctions where the maker followed the healing pattern of the animal.
With the American Hoxsey Formula, it was grand daddy Hoxsey who followed the eating pattern of his sick old HORSE who nursed itself back to health.
With the Filipino Herbalist Ka Rey Herrera who was uneducated, he merely followed the eating pattern of his GOAT.  He stumbled onto Rey Herbal and this concoction he sold takes the guess work out of juicing.  See www.reyherbal.com , we made their website... a small plug for my web design business.  ;D  I was glad to have made it for them because it's pretty useful in the realm of nutritional healing, it works.
We know quite a good number of regular plants, herbs, bark, flowers, seeds, etc that are used for healing.  When I was absolutely sick in 2005, my first healer was a herbalist who gathered herbs by herself and made them from scratch. 
By experience though and what my new teacher made clear to me is that nutrition must be the foundation of all healing... (RPD yay!) ... then you can do your manipulation... (herbs, detox, etc.)

None of this is even remotely related to a Paleo time period or lifestyle.  I followed the teachings of Ann Wigmore (of wheat grass fame) who supposedly got her inspiration from watching animals as well.  All I ever got for my trouble was indigestion and runny, smelly stools.  I've done the herbal thing and in my experience it is pretty much hokum.  Lot's of unsubstantiated mumbo jumbo with little real benefit other than the placebo effect of the enamored patient influenced by a self proclaimed guru's supposed "wisdom of the ancients".  Pure drivel.

Lex

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2009, 10:10:00 pm »
Not sure things are as obvious to me as they are to you.  I've never seen a wild animal medicate itself.  Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, just that it's not rampant enough that I've ever noticed it.  I also have no way of knowing what the animal is medicating itself for.  Does it have a headache? Stomach flu? Diarrhea?  Seems a bit far fetched to me.


The fact that animals routinely self-medicate themselves is simply common knowledge in scientific circles(about the onlyspecies who don't would be things like bacteria). What I'd suggest is that you read this book which gives plenty more examples:-

http://www.lovehealth.org/books/animal-healing.htm

Also, there are many nature documentaries which feature such routine animal self-medication. An example among many are the parrots in south america, featured in david attenborough's wildlife documentaries, who eat kale(clay-rich soil) in order to absorb the toxins from the poisonous plants they eat. Then there are many animals like the chimpanzees who eat plants so as to get rid of parasites:-

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2009/03/10/woolly-bear-heal-thyself/
Quote
I wouldn't want to recommend roadside plants.  Many dangerous alkaloids in those puppies and it took me a good bit of time with someone who knew what he was doing to show me what plants were edible in the foothills of California.  Many lookalikes that can make you really sick - and kill you if you eat too much.

The whole point of these plants is that small quantities of some of these plants' substances(which may or may not be toxic in high doses) are beneficial to various species. Marigold, for example, is helpful re healing wounds etc.

It's true that many lookalikes make one sick. An example is the field mushroom which is edible but looks very similiar to amanita phalloides(deathcap mushroom) which is super-deadly.However, there were plenty of herbal witch-doctors/withes in every tribe(in the Palaeolithic and beyond) who would have been brought up on huge amounts of lore gathered from dozens of past generations and would have been easily able to tell apart any species, based on that knowledge. So that's not an issue.

Quote
I think it is stretching the imagination quite a bit to assume that there was wide use of specific herbs to address specific medical issues.  First, we have no idea what the herbs were, and second we have no idea what medical issue they were attempting to address.   I don't think our "apemen ancestors suddenly gave up using herbal medicine when they became sentient".  I'm not at all convinced that they ever used herbal medicine to any real extent to begin with. The amount of identified beneficial alkaloids in growing plants is often so small that it would take eating a bushel basket of flowers, leaves, or bark to get any measurable benefit.  Again, the evidence is rather "thin".  In my case, the need for medicine, herbal or other wise, went away when I adapted a better diet.

Again, my point is that the various primates(chimps/gorillas etc.) are all known to practise herbal medicine as a routine part of their lives(which means that our apemen ancestors must also have been practising herbal medicineat least up until the time they split from the apes, genewise). Therefore, given the evidence, the best you can claim is that our apemen ancestors, later on, gave up herbal medicine use and then restarted it later on.

Quote
None of this is even remotely related to a Paleo time period or lifestyle.  I followed the teachings of Ann Wigmore (of wheat grass fame) who supposedly got her inspiration from watching animals as well.  All I ever got for my trouble was indigestion and runny, smelly stools.  I've done the herbal thing and in my experience it is pretty much hokum.  Lot's of unsubstantiated mumbo jumbo with little real benefit other than the placebo effect of the enamored patient influenced by a self proclaimed guru's supposed "wisdom of the ancients".  Pure drivel.

Lex

Well, that's your opinion. But, IMO, the fact that carnivores in the wild also use herbs to cure illness , even though they don't routinely eat plants, is a sign that diet isn't the only clue to health. And since the whole point of being palaeo is going back to nature, herbal medicine seems OK. Plus, evidence re palaeo times is increasing so I wouldn't be surprised if mroe evidence re herbal medicine comes up.
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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2009, 12:15:52 am »

Again, my point is that the various primates(chimps/gorillas etc.) are all known to practise herbal medicine as a routine part of their lives(which means that our apemen ancestors must also have been practising herbal medicineat least up until the time they split from the apes, genewise). Therefore, given the evidence, the best you can claim is that our apemen ancestors, later on, gave up herbal medicine use and then restarted it later on.


Sorry to disturb your debate with Lex, but this is faulty logic, Tyler.  You cannot look at what primates do today and then claim our common ancestors did it.  It simply does not follow any more than saying because we humans smoke tobacco, our common ancestors did so.  It doesn't work that way.  You'd have to go back and find evidence of it.  We don't find evidence of plant foods in human settlement sites.

I can appreciate that herbs may have a place in the human diet.  What I do not care for is the type of New Age "superfood" and "cleanse" talk found sometimes here, but mainly in raw vegan circles.  Aajonus does not impress me one iota.  I have to agree with Lex that if people would improve their diet by eating animal foods, all of this other nonsense would fall by the wayside.

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2009, 02:21:21 am »
Tyler,
I'm familiar with Cindy Engel's work and consider it new age nonsense.  Essential oils and aroma therapy for wild beasts.  We have an animal advocate on the radio here in Los Angeles that blathers similar junk.  Interestingly he warns people not to feed their dogs and cats raw food as this is also dangerous for them.  I consider Engel's and other similar tripe a total waste of paper, public airwaves, or harddrive space.

Native Americans had tobacco, Southwestern US Indians used plant hallucinogens, Pygmies are known to be heavy users of Marijuana, and South American Natives chew coca leaves all day long for "strength".  All of these substances are highly addictive and provide zero medicinal benefit.  However, all these groups feel that these substances are absolutely critical for health.  I'm also sure that these substances were discovered many thousands of years ago and might be considered paleo.  An addicted group might well consider these plants important to include in burials as the deceased would assuredly need them in the other world to avoid illness - withdrawal symptoms.  I suppose that this could be construed as "self medication", and I see it as a far more likely scenario than the rosy view of ancient medical wisdom that the new age set would have us believe.

Aromatic oils, herbal remedies, light therapy, irridology, reflexology, and all the other new age silliness are just designed to transfer money from the pockets of the gullable to the new age healers.  Because it's fashionable and some bright person discovered that the same people that fall for herbal remedies for themselves would gladly pay money for the same remedies for their pets just shows that PT Barnum was right - "There's a sucker born every minute".

Lex
« Last Edit: April 29, 2009, 04:54:08 am by lex_rooker »

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2009, 06:09:40 am »
Maybe they did herbs to get high?

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2009, 08:07:09 am »
Well using herbs is a broad thing.  Just some examples:

There are herbs used to disinfect wounds.
There are herbs used to stop bleeding of large wounds.
There are herbs that can make finger digit grow back.
There are herbs used to combat poisoning or herbs that cause poison.
There are herbs used to people recover from heart attacks, strokes and breathing difficulties.
Sweet potato leaf tops are vegetables that are more potent when juiced and drank that routinely help people against dengue fever.  Some people might think they are herbs.

Of course regarding health, raw animal foods are the super foods the vegans have always been in search of.  Food is the best medicine.  But there are times when herbs are needed and they work, I just give them credit when it is due. 

Herbs can never substitute as food.
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Offline akaikumo

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2009, 09:08:31 am »
There are herbs that can make finger digit grow back.

I've never heard of that. I know they found out a few years ago you can use the powdered lining of pig's bladder, but herbs?
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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2009, 03:25:03 pm »
I've seen wheatgrass help.    

I've never heard of that. I know they found out a few years ago you can use the powdered lining of pig's bladder, but herbs?
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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2009, 08:06:12 pm »
I've never heard of that. I know they found out a few years ago you can use the powdered lining of pig's bladder, but herbs?

Here is our massage therapist who grew her finger digit after she chopped it off accidentally.
I'm the one who did the interview, took the pictures and wrote this report.
http://www.curelibrary.com/blog/health-notes/finger-digit-cure-how-to-regrow-a-chopped-finger-digit/
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2009, 03:43:03 am »
Sorry to disturb your debate with Lex, but this is faulty logic, Tyler.  You cannot look at what primates do today and then claim our common ancestors did it.  It simply does not follow any more than saying because we humans smoke tobacco, our common ancestors did so.  It doesn't work that way.  You'd have to go back and find evidence of it.  We don't find evidence of plant foods in human settlement sites.

I can appreciate that herbs may have a place in the human diet.  What I do not care for is the type of New Age "superfood" and "cleanse" talk found sometimes here, but mainly in raw vegan circles.  Aajonus does not impress me one iota.  I have to agree with Lex that if people would improve their diet by eating animal foods, all of this other nonsense would fall by the wayside.

Both you and Lex are making false assumptions. I did NOT say that because modern humans practise herbal medicine that Palaeo humans must have also. One can make a reasonably good case that it is highly likely that Palaeo humans also practised herbal medicine because Palaeo-like hunter-gatherer societies pre-civilisation(ie Neolithic)  practised herbal medicine. However, that is by no means an absolute  certainty as such Neolithic-era tribes also sometimes practised things not found in the Palaeolithic(eg:- consuming raw dairy etc.)

What I ACTUALLY was saying is that there is incontrovertible proof that WILD animals self-medicate themselves with herbs as a matter of routine whether as a means to heal wounds or kill parasites or whatever. This is simply a statement of fact. I am not referring to human methods of healing domestic pets, despite Lex's claims, I am referring to wild animals' preference for using herbs as a means of healing(that includes carnivores, of course).

Now, it is also a fact that the primates(ie gorillas/chimps etc.) also practise herbal medicine  as a routine part of their lives. Now we only split from the primates c. 5(?) million years ago so , given that the primates use herbs for health purposes, it is logical to assume that our ape ancestors up to 5 million years ago also used herbal medicine like any other primate. Now, one can make a very vague, absurdly
 unlikely claim that as soon as our hominid ancestors split from the apes 5 million years ago, that they suddenly gave up all use of herbal medicine(despite  no common-sense explanation being there for such a change) and then supposedly restarted the use of herbal medicine with the Neanderthals, c.60,000 years ago.

The remarks Lex makes re herbs and tobacco are meaningless in a Palaeo context. After all, wild animals do not merely use wild herbs to "get high" but to heal themselves from all sorts of health-problems, much like what witch-doctors did with tribal members in Palaeo times. Come to think of it, there is evidence of shamans/medicine-men  in Palaeo times given cave-paintings etc.Oh, and since even carnivores in the wild routinely use herbal medicines in order to get well, it's a bit silly to claim that a raw, zero-carb diet alone can solve all problems.

To cut a long story short, though, if we become overly fanatical and condemn all non-diet-related issues then all we have is either  raw animal food diet or modern medicine. Now, diet alone cannot heal every condition and most people come to RAF diets precisely because modern medicine has completely failed them in numerous ways so that they choose a RAF diet as a last resort. Plus, the whole of modern medicine is wholly dependent on the past science of herbal medicine. For example, many pain-killers and other drugs
used to prevent people from dying in war-time etc, have been directly derived from herbal medicine(eg:- aspirin from white willow bark). Now, of course, such drugs are often too synthetic and concentrate the active ingredient too much etc., but the wild herbs they are derived from are perfectly healthy in moderation and, indeed, more effective.

In short, to equate herbal medicine, which has had thousands of generations of expertise behind it, with more dubious more recent
 fields such as crystal gazing etc., is just not reasonable. The evidence re herbal medicine in the Middle Palaeolithic(300,000 to 50,000 years ago)
lithic is solid, and as more evidence appears as palaeoanthropologists keep on discovering more sites, more evidence will appear. The alternative is to assume that our hominid ancestors suddenly gave up herbal medicine when they split from the chimps and then restarted it in the Upper Palaeolithic, which makes no sense at all, whatsoever.





« Last Edit: May 02, 2009, 05:32:57 pm by TylerDurden »
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2009, 01:15:17 am »
I agree but don't see it as a major subject to promote in raw paleo. It's like a cast for a broken arm, yes that would be better than just eating raw paleo to heal it straight and there is probably evidence of paleo people using splints and other such techniques but it isn't a central part of the lifestyle.

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2009, 01:30:41 am »

Now, it is also a fact that the primates(ie gorillas/chimps etc.) also practise herbal medicine  as a routine part of their lives. Now we only split from the primates c. 5(?) million years ago so , given that the primates use herbs for health purposes, it is logical to assume that our ape ancestors up to 5 million years ago also used herbal medicine like any other primate. Now, one can make a very vague, absurdly
 unlikely claim that as soon as our hominid ancestors split from the apes 5 million years ago, that they suddenly gave up all use of herbal medicine(despite  no common-sense explanation being there for such a change) and then supposedly restarted the use of herbal medicine with the Neanderthals, c.60,000 years ago.


No, you cannot make the jump from modern primates that practice herbalism and say that early primates that are common to both us and apes also practiced herbal medicine.  It is a non sequitur and is exactly the same as saying that since humans use tools in modern times, our common Australopithicine ancestors did too.  No no no!  All you can do is find evidence from way back.  It's called evolution, and it means species change over time.  You cannot attribute a phenomenon observed now to an earlier period without evidence.  It's fallacious reasoning.

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2009, 03:41:14 am »
No, you cannot make the jump from modern primates that practice herbalism and say that early primates that are common to both us and apes also practiced herbal medicine.  It is a non sequitur and is exactly the same as saying that since humans use tools in modern times, our common Australopithicine ancestors did too.  No no no!  All you can do is find evidence from way back.  It's called evolution, and it means species change over time.  You cannot attribute a phenomenon observed now to an earlier period without evidence.  It's fallacious reasoning.

I'm afraid the above is simply illogical. The fact that wild animals , all across the board, practise herbal medicine, including, most importantly, the primates, is an excellent reason to claim that our ancient apemen ancestors also practised herbal medicine as well, before they gained sentience. To assume that our apemen ancestors didn't is such an absurdly long stretch - after all, before our apemen ancestors gained sentience and diverged, genetically, from other primates re genes, there's no reason whatsoever to assume that they were any different from the other primates in any respect. At best, one can claim that as soon as they diverged from the apes, that some highly unusual quirk led to them abandoning herbal medicine and then returning to the practice in the Middle Palaeolithic, but that's it - and it's a ridiculous notion, on the face of it.

About the only thing you could do to disprove my point is to give an example of a primate which gave up the use of herbal medicine  a million years ago, say, even if only for a few hundred thousand years. Rather unlikely to come across such an example, IMO, as herbal medicine of a sort is practised by wild animals as a routine part of their lives, with no reason to doubt that they ever gave up the practice at any stage.

Note:- "Cindy Engel, a biology lecturer at the Open University and author of a 2002 book on animal self-medication, Wild Health, says that [all] animals have to self-medicate to survive. She gives examples of caterpillars that, when infected with parasites, start consuming plants that are toxic to those parasites. " taken from:-

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/technology/news/article.cfm?c_id=5&objectid=10339384

Aside from that, one has to bear in mind that humans in the Palaeolithic era had no access to doctors of any kind. So, herbal medicine would have been  a last resort for them., there being no other possibility to explore at the time.
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2009, 03:48:16 am »
Interesting. I asked a palaeoanthropology expert  on allexperts.com re this issue and he said my logic was impeccable.
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Offline phatdave

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #19 on: June 09, 2009, 05:53:28 am »
Which specific herb/plants would you prepose as to having a significant place in the history of man Mr Durden? (as of course in the supplemental form as suggested)

....if one could suggest any specifics that is.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Herbal medicine issue
« Reply #20 on: June 09, 2009, 05:49:26 pm »
Which specific herb/plants would you prepose as to having a significant place in the history of man Mr Durden? (as of course in the supplemental form as suggested)

....if one could suggest any specifics that is.

I'm afraid there are so many 100s of different herbs for a multitude of different conditions that it's impossible to say. What I would suggest is searching online for the kind of herbs that help improve whatever health-problem you wish to solve. Bear in mind, however, that the previous discussion centred around the use of wild herbs, not herbal supplements. IMO, the vast mjaority of herbal supplements are so highly processed, with trans-fats etc. used as fillers and the like, that they are not worth a damn. Wild herbs found on the roadside and in the wild are fine, though.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

 

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