Author Topic: Hello from Estonia  (Read 17809 times)

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Offline chucky

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Hello from Estonia
« on: January 22, 2010, 11:40:04 pm »
Hey, I´m from Estonia which is one of the Baltic states in Europe. I first got interested in zero carb when reading articles by "The Bear" and then got interested in raw food. I could never thought of eating raw food as I was such a paranoid about parasites and worms and all those bacteria that could be on the meat. Even when I would have eaten one piece of raw meat, I would get worms and get sick. Well, I was wrong. I was brainwashed by the media. But don´t get me wrong, I just jumped in for this lifestyle.

For about a week and a half, I have been eating almost  zero carb cooked meat but except the milk as I somehow get depressive and negative thoughts if not consuming any dairy. But few times I have also tried raw meat and today I "drank" raw egg straight from the shell and ate about 400g of ground beef all raw. What an adventure! I liked the taste because it was sweet and tender and not tasteless and hard like the cooked meat is.

It was all good to the point of eating all of it. Later I got muscle weekness, I was tired and somewhat thirsty which never stopped. It was same with the raw egg. Is it normal to feel tired after eating raw meat as I just begun eating raw ? And could non-stoppable thirst be from detoxing like I have read from the forums ? I feel better after drinking the water but soon the thirst and tiredness returns.

I will keep testing and trying with different raw foods. And lots of good information to read from the forum. Thank you for the forum!


  Jarnapal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2010, 12:08:06 am »
Hello.

I experience thirst like what you mention after eating a lot of raw meat.  I quench my thirst with hydrating raw fruit. Try raw omnivore next time. Try raw vegetables next time.
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Offline djr_81

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2010, 12:10:03 am »
Welcome Jarnapal. :)

I personally get tired and thirsty if I'm eating too much protein and not enough fat.
As you got these symptoms when eating the egg as well (with a fat dense yolk) you might just be dealing with the typical keto-adaption people transition through when they cut back/out carbohydrate sources.
I don't recall overwhelming thirst being a problem during this transition though so it's possible it's a combination of the two.
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Offline Hannibal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2010, 12:45:30 am »
I experience thirst like what you mention after eating a lot of raw meat.  I quench my thirst with hydrating raw fruit. 
But it's not good to combine meat, that digests at very low ph levels with fruits which digest at high level.
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
Livin' off the raw grass fat of the land

Offline Stig of the Dump

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2010, 01:25:29 am »
Hi  Jarnapal
I've just started too and I get noticeably thirsty after eating raw meat.  It could be detox, or - a sudden  brainwave - maybe the meat is bloodless - it's dehydrated - days away from the way we'd have got it after a kill?

Offline Stig of the Dump

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2010, 01:47:18 am »
That brainwave has led to another.

Maybe people like warm cooked meat because that's how it was originally - hot steaming, juicy flesh coming straight out of a fresh kill.

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2010, 02:12:53 am »
Hello.

I experience thirst like what you mention after eating a lot of raw meat.  I quench my thirst with hydrating raw fruit. Try raw omnivore next time. Try raw vegetables next time.

I seem to put on weight easily when combining vegetables or fruit with lots of meat. Also, as I am so new to this, it just could be carb addiction because 400g of ground beef doesn´t seem like much. But then, when I drink glass of water I feel better but soon am thirsty again. Definitely something to monitor if the thirst lessens over time as detoxing takes place.


Welcome Jarnapal. :)

I personally get tired and thirsty if I'm eating too much protein and not enough fat.
As you got these symptoms when eating the egg as well (with a fat dense yolk) you might just be dealing with the typical keto-adaption people transition through when they cut back/out carbohydrate sources.
I don't recall overwhelming thirst being a problem during this transition though so it's possible it's a combination of the two.

Thanks djr_81.

Not eating enough fat could have been the case. I was eating only ground beef. I will check it out next time when eating it. Will boil some pork fat (for safety) as beef fat is not available here. Pork fat is sold everywhere.. :)

I have been looking for keto-adaption. I have been following almost zero carb for over a week. At the beginning I was feeling more tired but my energy is returning slowly. But I´m not sure that if eating raw egg yolk would push me into keto immediately.

I will increase my fat.

But it's not good to combine meat, that digests at very low ph levels with fruits which digest at high level.

I have also read about it that it´s not good to combine meat and fruits as different digestive juices are needed. I was following it for a while a year ago and truth is my digestion got much better. I also didn´t drink any water with the meals and when I started to drink with meals again, I felt the difference. Something like putting some pepper on food or not. Pepper helps with nutrient absorption but excessive water would dilute the digestive juices ( at least it is what I have read about. Sorry if I was wrong). But then, taking fruits on empty stomach would give a sugar rush that someone who is sugar senitive wouldn´t like.


Hi  Jarnapal
I've just started too and I get noticeably thirsty after eating raw meat.  It could be detox, or - a sudden  brainwave - maybe the meat is bloodless - it's dehydrated - days away from the way we'd have got it after a kill?

It´s so overrated subject. Everyone is talking about detoxing these days. I hope it´s true and that the detox hype is not overrated.
What I can think of my thirst (if it´s not related to low fat) is that body is ready to release toxins but asks for water to expell the toxins.

Offline Hannibal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2010, 03:10:35 am »
But then, taking fruits on empty stomach would give a sugar rush that someone who is sugar senitive wouldn´t like.
I eat fruits on empty stomach quite often. That way the're easily digested. About one hour after fruits I eat my whole meat-and-fat meal.
Read this - http://drbass.com/sequential.html
But when I eat dried fruits I eat it with raw butter 1 hour after last morsel of meat.
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
Livin' off the raw grass fat of the land

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2010, 03:49:33 am »
I eat fruits on empty stomach quite often. That way the're easily digested. About one hour after fruits I eat my whole meat-and-fat meal.
Read this - http://drbass.com/sequential.html
But when I eat dried fruits I eat it with raw butter 1 hour after last morsel of meat.

Thanks for the link Hannibal. I visited it once. Lots of good information on it.. Whats good with zerocarb is that you never ever can combine your foods wrong. But there is also a statement not to combine different protein sources with what I kindly disagree with.

Do fruits ever make you gain weight or are you strictly watching your intake of calories ?
« Last Edit: January 23, 2010, 03:55:14 am by jarnapal »

Offline Hannibal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2010, 04:03:26 am »
Do fruits ever make you gain weight or are you strictly watching your intake of calories ?
I'm not watching my intake of calories. I eat as much as I like and as it's good for my digestion.
I do not gain weight even if I eat 5 thousand calories. I'm slim.
My weight fluctuates according to seasonal changes - at the beginning of the automn it goes up and at spring it goes down.
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
Livin' off the raw grass fat of the land

Offline Hannibal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2010, 04:05:13 am »
But there is also a statement not to combine different protein sources with what I kindly disagree with.
combining cheese, egg yolks and meat with each other is indeed unhealthy
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
Livin' off the raw grass fat of the land

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2010, 04:39:37 am »
combining cheese, egg yolks and meat with each other is indeed unhealthy

 Oh sorry I was referring to meat and fish.

Offline Hannibal

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2010, 05:03:59 am »
Oh sorry I was referring to meat and fish.
I myself do not combine them.
When I eat fish I eat it first and then wait 1-1,5 hour and I commense eaing muscle-meats, organ-meats and fat.
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
Livin' off the raw grass fat of the land

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2010, 04:07:33 am »
I have upped my intake of fats and muscle weakness doesn not seem to bother me anymore. Thanks, I feel better now on this point.

But since going to zero-carb or VLC I have started to blush easily. Sometimes my face gets red whenever I want to ask something in crowded people or when I am in airless classroom, my face just goes red like it´s hot there.. I will try 1g of Vitamin C next time as I suspect that my cortisol might be high but what can I do more about this ? Or is it just a period - zero-carb adaption ?

 :)

Offline Stig of the Dump

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2010, 05:25:59 am »
Blushing is a natural reaction to emotion in some people.  Maybe your body's natural blushing reaction is starting to work properly.

(Although it might be an uncomfortable state for you, I read somewhere that there is some evidence that people who blush and seem shy are more attractive to members of the opposite sex, maybe because they are seen as honest and virtuous.

I've found a (silly) link (but it means I didn't imagine it):

http://www.javno.com/en-lifestyle/blushed-faces-seen-as-attractive_247695)

EDIT:  More simply, everything natural is beautiful.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2010, 05:31:40 am by Stig of the Dump »

Offline Kokki

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2010, 05:55:59 am »
Hi Jarnapal and greetings from the other side of the border!

Blushing is almost always a subconscious reaction. Anyhow, there`s several types of redness. Since your reactions developed after consuming better food, I would not be concerned about it. Don`t be unsure.

Do you know Aajonus? He told me that we shouldn`t worry about immune system. Medical "professionals" get benefit from your fear. So, don`t think your cortisol levels. They`ll normalize over time. Hardly any of us recommends synthetic vitamins. Vitamin C a.k.a ascorbic acid, is strongly irritating poison.

I recall that you mentioned ground beef. Whole cuts are always preferable, because they don`t oxidize as much.

Pork is never recommended, due to un-special grain-feeding.

The EU gives you all kind of problems. Use of gaseous carbon dioxide (-80) in slaughterhouses is one. Tonfish isn`t a clever choice, they`re always halfly raised. As well as other seafood like oysters, due to radiation (herbs, fruits and raw cheeses are radiated also).

Find out every potential hunter and small-scale (organic) farmer.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2010, 06:05:28 am by Kokki »

Offline roony

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2010, 06:21:40 am »
Hi Jarnapal and greetings from the other side of the border!

Blushing is almost always a subconscious reaction. Anyhow, there`s several types of redness. Since your reactions developed after consuming better food, I would not be concerned about it. Don`t be unsure.

Do you know Aajonus? He told me that we shouldn`t worry about immune system. Medical "professionals" get benefit from your fear. So, don`t think your cortisol levels. They`ll normalize over time. Hardly any of us recommends synthetic vitamins. Vitamin C a.k.a ascorbic acid, is strongly irritating poison.

I recall that you mentioned ground beef. Whole cuts are always preferable, because they don`t oxidize as much.

Pork is never recommended, due to un-special grain-feeding.

The EU gives you all kind of problems. Use of gaseous carbon dioxide (-80) in slaughterhouses is one. Tonfish isn`t a clever choice, they`re always halfly raised. As well as other seafood like oysters, due to radiation (herbs, fruits and raw cheeses are radiated also).

Find out every potential hunter and small-scale (organic) farmer.


Is there any eu or british law stating raw cheeses should be irradiated? Or is it done to preserve shelf life?

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2010, 03:27:49 pm »
Blushing is a natural reaction to emotion in some people.  Maybe your body's natural blushing reaction is starting to work properly.

(Although it might be an uncomfortable state for you, I read somewhere that there is some evidence that people who blush and seem shy are more attractive to members of the opposite sex, maybe because they are seen as honest and virtuous.

I've found a (silly) link (but it means I didn't imagine it):

http://www.javno.com/en-lifestyle/blushed-faces-seen-as-attractive_247695)

EDIT:  More simply, everything natural is beautiful.


Hey!

When some blushing might be natural and beautiful then flushing definitely is not. I think I described my face redness wrong with blushing. It´s more like face flush like seen on this picture http://images.teamsugar.com/files/users/1/12981/19_2007/Picture%201_1.png
It´s winter here and it never happens outside! :) But when in the classroom , there is much less oxygen and much warmer. I am 20 and it should not happen as I wasn´t experiencing facial redness before ;). What I found is that it could be from increased blood pressure or hormones. Hopefully it´s just temporary and disappears when I am through keto-adaption. Thanks.

Hi Jarnapal and greetings from the other side of the border!

Blushing is almost always a subconscious reaction. Anyhow, there`s several types of redness. Since your reactions developed after consuming better food, I would not be concerned about it. Don`t be unsure.

Do you know Aajonus? He told me that we shouldn`t worry about immune system. Medical "professionals" get benefit from your fear. So, don`t think your cortisol levels. They`ll normalize over time. Hardly any of us recommends synthetic vitamins. Vitamin C a.k.a ascorbic acid, is strongly irritating poison.

I recall that you mentioned ground beef. Whole cuts are always preferable, because they don`t oxidize as much.

Pork is never recommended, due to un-special grain-feeding.

The EU gives you all kind of problems. Use of gaseous carbon dioxide (-80) in slaughterhouses is one. Tonfish isn`t a clever choice, they`re always halfly raised. As well as other seafood like oysters, due to radiation (herbs, fruits and raw cheeses are radiated also).

Find out every potential hunter and small-scale (organic) farmer.

Hello Kokki! Nice to see someone closer.

Yes I might definitely agree with it being psychological but something must be increasing my bp (I have heard of body trying to cool down the blood, just like in elephants. They cool their blood by moving the ears). Or it could be increased anxiety. But like I said in the first quote I am hoping that it´s just because of increased fat and my body trying to manage it.
Well, I still might try that Vitamin C because it´s not just blushing (it´s lovely when girls blush but me Flushing.. No :) ) but whole face getting red and it´s very uncomfortable.

I haven´t bought any ground beef right now til I get answer if it´s 100% GB. It looks always too good to be true :) I would love to give up pork but our beef cuts are so lean except ground beef which is 80/20. I will try eating more fatty fish like herring which is really cheap here.

"herbs, fruits and raw cheeses are radiated also" Really ?

Thanks Kokki.

Offline Stig of the Dump

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2010, 06:50:18 pm »
... it´s not just blushing (it´s lovely when girls blush but me Flushing.. No :) ) but whole face getting red and it´s very uncomfortable.
I asked a female friend and she told me that she thinks a guy blushing is very attractive, but I'm sure, like you say, she means this http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/09_04/BlushMenREX_468x322.jpg, not this: http://nakedloon.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/red-faced-mayor-full.jpg!  :lol:

Oddly after I posted about blushing I had a bath, and when I went out into the corridors of my flats (which are kept stupidly hot, as the communal parts of the building are run by pensioners), I went bright red, a real flush, just as you described because I saw myself in the mirror in the lift.  I felt parboiled, and it was a relief to get outside.  I was redder and hotter than I ever remember experiencing.  I too am just changing over to RAF, so maybe it's a typical detox symptom, or some sort of temperature regulator is resetting.  (Or again, maybe it's just getting healthy, and a cave man would have got red and sweltering hot in my stupidly hot corridor.)

Offline Kokki

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2010, 08:39:38 pm »

Is there any eu or british law stating raw cheeses should be irradiated? Or is it done to preserve shelf life?

Hygiene (twisted concept!) and longer shelf-life are reasons for that. You have farmer markets in UK, so you don`t have to worry.

jarnapal

Organic products aren`t irradiated.

Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2010, 03:05:09 am »
I was shopping for meat today and found oxtails (beef tails) and bought some. Are those bones eatable ?

I am also happy to report that after taking 1g Vitamin C (I did also use salt and potassium chloride to increase my Na/K), I didn't experience the flushing face today which I described before. Although It's not paleo but it eliminated the social barrier that I started to experience.


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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2010, 03:11:02 am »
I was shopping for meat today and found oxtails (beef tails) and bought some. Are those bones eatable ?

    I think Jamaican people boil oxtails to make soup.  I think it gives a lot of minerals and amino acids to the broth.  I'm sure people of many cultures do this, but I think it is more common and celebrated with them.

    Maybe a farriers file would serve to grind them down raw for bone-meal use.
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Offline chucky

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2010, 03:20:38 am »
   I think Jamaican people boil oxtails to make soup.  I think it gives a lot of minerals and amino acids to the broth.  I'm sure people of many cultures do this, but I think it is more common and celebrated with them.

    Maybe a farriers file would serve to grind them down raw for bone-meal use.

Is it safe to eat them raw or better to be boiled ? Heh, using farriers for the bones. Nice idea ;) Can I get calcium overload eating bones ?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 04:18:44 am by jarnapal »

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2010, 04:05:00 am »
Is it safe to eat them raw or better to be boiled ?

    I've never seen them.  I assume most (natural) animal products if not all are better raw.  If you are accustomed to cooked foods, this would be a good one.  It would have to be cooked all through, not just whatever meat or skin might be on them.  Like I said, not having seen them, I have little conception.   
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Offline Stig of the Dump

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Re: Hello from Estonia
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2010, 04:12:26 am »
I was shopping for meat today and found oxtails (beef tails) and bought some. Are those bones eatable ?
I love chewing on bones of all kinds - I always have, even though for nearly all of my life the bones were cooked and some could splinter dangerously.  (People used to tease me about being a caveman.)  I have certainly chewed the bones in ox-tail soup.  And just this morning I was chewing on the remains of my raw lamb leg bone in the bath (so as not to make a mess).  I guess it depends how strong your teeth are.

 

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