Author Topic: Autism explained  (Read 138445 times)

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Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #250 on: February 11, 2015, 03:28:11 am »
Here's an article opposing Wakefield:-

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/feb/10/listen-roald-dahl-not-jenny-mccarthy-vaccinate-children-measles

I have read that a few people can be very badly affected by vaccines because they do, after all, contain tiny amounts of the relevant disease, but most seem to do fine.

Interesting, I just noticed on reread a comment by the writer. He hung himself. He admitted that anyone with an education can see the issues with the science or lack thereof..

" Vaccine refusers are more likely to have a university degree than those who accept vaccination, so this is not even about throwing statistics at those who might have studied statistics."
Cheers
Al

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #251 on: February 11, 2015, 05:29:29 am »
I really doubt vaccines injected into the bloodstream can have a large enough effect on gut flora to cause autism. It doesn't pass the bullshit test. 

Raw-al, Tyler and I are the sharpest minds on the subject of health and nutrition on this board. A great deal of our knowledge and skill in this area comes directly from taking ALL claims,  conventional/traditional/alternative or whatever, and sifting out the bullshit. We have, as a result, gotten very good at it. We've had lots of practice.

Offline JeuneKoq

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #252 on: February 11, 2015, 06:04:53 am »
I really doubt vaccines injected into the bloodstream can have a large enough effect on gut flora to cause autism. It doesn't pass the bullshit test. 
I don't know how anybody could reasonably trust without second thought something that is introduced in the body by bypassing every natural border and filters. I mean, this is how stinging and venomous creatures are able to successfully kill their victim....

Raw-al, Tyler and I are the sharpest minds on the subject of health and nutrition on this board. A great deal of our knowledge and skill in this area comes directly from taking ALL claims,  conventional/traditional/alternative or whatever, and sifting out the bullshit. We have, as a result, gotten very good at it. We've had lots of practice.
Well someone's feeling cocky today!!  ;)

It is unwise to underestimate the knowledge and reasoning ability of people you know so little about...You'd be surprised.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2015, 06:29:40 am by JeuneKoq »

Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #253 on: February 11, 2015, 08:14:06 am »
I really doubt vaccines injected into the bloodstream can have a large enough effect on gut flora to cause autism. It doesn't pass the bullshit test. 

Raw-al, Tyler and I are the sharpest minds on the subject of health and nutrition on this board. A great deal of our knowledge and skill in this area comes directly from taking ALL claims,  conventional/traditional/alternative or whatever, and sifting out the bullshit. We have, as a result, gotten very good at it. We've had lots of practice.
So you are basing this on your doubts.... I thought science was supposed to be the basis of statements.

Injecting two neurotoxins into an infant's blood vessels is not going to have an effect. Not having done any science on combining multiple doses of vaccine given simultaneously you think that magically there will be no effect?

Take the time to listen to the YTs before you type.
Cheers
Al

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #254 on: February 11, 2015, 08:21:09 am »
If a person has a severe infection, then the virus/bacteria will be in their bloodstream, right?  If so, what's the difference between that and having dead virus/bacteria injected into the bloodstream?

Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #255 on: February 11, 2015, 02:38:21 pm »
If a person has a severe infection, then the virus/bacteria will be in their bloodstream, right?  If so, what's the difference between that and having dead virus/bacteria injected into the bloodstream?
Vaccinations do not just contain dead microbes.
http://www.historyofvaccines.org/content/articles/different-types-vaccines

A baby does not have a complete immune system. It requires colostrum from mother's milk as well as Gawd only knows what else to solidify it. Basically we are tossed out of the womb when really have not developed sufficiently to survive.

Additionally I suspect that our non-raw diet has contributed to our innate weakness.

Also vaccines contain the most powerful neurotoxins available. (Aluminum and Mercury) They have not been tested as they are grandfathered in. The vaccine rules are something to behold. The more I hear the scarier they sound.

Also the single vaccines have been tested, but not the combinations which is what Peter Wakefield was saying seemed to be the problem. The vaccines that he was mainly concerned about, were rejected in Japan and Canada because of serious problems, but the UK government seemed to be OK with them and gave the "home team" vaccine company the green light and accepted the liability for them.

Also the "Lancet" magazine's publisher, just happened to be on the board of the "Home Team" vaccine manufacturer. Funny how "follow the money" works.

One idiot who was attacking PW has been suggesting giving 10,000 different vaccination in a jab. The whole media circus chasing after PW sounds much like the propaganda mill that "Confessions Of An Economic Hitman" talks about.

The story behind the mumps vaccination is absolutely stunning.

The whole medical system is in need of an overhaul. You get your license and then no more training required, except for classes held by the drug companies on their new wares.

In my business, every year and sometimes biannually (Depending on licenses etc) you have to prove your metal in a retest. Fail and you are unemployed. Written and flight (or simulator) testing, plus training on probably a dozen or more topics which must be all signed off.

Pilots are regulated by the Government. Doctors are self-regulated. Therein lies the problem, IMHO. The fox is looking after the henhouse.
Cheers
Al

Offline nummi

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #256 on: February 11, 2015, 02:45:22 pm »
If a person has a severe infection, then the virus/bacteria will be in their bloodstream, right?  If so, what's the difference between that and having dead virus/bacteria injected into the bloodstream?
A severe infection doesn't come suddenly.
The "dead" virus/bacteria, as has been seen many many times on people, are not always dead... Also the injected amount of viruses/bacteria; if the infection comes gradually, you don't get such an amount in one dose.

Quote
Raw-al, Tyler and I are the sharpest minds on the subject of health and nutrition on this board. A great deal of our knowledge and skill in this area comes directly from taking ALL claims,  conventional/traditional/alternative or whatever, and sifting out the bullshit. We have, as a result, gotten very good at it. We've had lots of practice.
Someone who is sharp enough would never say something like this.

How about using the bullshit sifting on yourself? You'd be surprised... If you are full of it, then all the external information you go through will be effected by what you are full of; in other words biased conclusions.

As said, "It is unwise to underestimate the knowledge and reasoning ability of people you know so little about...You'd be surprised." -- To this I'll add: Don't overestimate yourself.

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #257 on: February 11, 2015, 07:43:43 pm »
So what's the difference between "live" virus from an injection  versus a severe infection? None of you have an answer, you just have innuendo, insults, misdirection, and anxiety. None of those equals an answer to that question. Get it  together, control your emotions, and come back when you have an answer.

Offline sabertooth

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #258 on: February 12, 2015, 10:25:48 am »
So what's the difference between "live" virus from an injection  versus a severe infection? None of you have an answer, you just have innuendo, insults, misdirection, and anxiety. None of those equals an answer to that question. Get it  together, control your emotions, and come back when you have an answer.

Let us ask how they arrive at the proper live virus strain to put into our vaccines. Often vaccines are genetically engineered crosspieces hybrids that would never occur naturally to begin with. These live Franken bugs are injected into the body, which by passes the normal rout that pathogens take before being greeted by our immune systems. Because the live virus vaccine by passes the normal lines of defense , it is able to imbed itself deep into the bodies tissues, before the immune system has a chance to confront it. Consider that, along with the fact that the immune response to vaccination is much weaker to that of a naturally occurring inoculation, so that the acute cytokine response which causes high temperature, vomit, diarrhea, and the development of antigens which occurs under natural inoculation, may not be strong enough, to fully clear the viral DNA from the body in the vaccinated person.

The vaccinated person will have produced anti bodies to the virus which allow for a suppressed immune response during future exposures, but it will not have completely cleared the virus from the deep tissues, where it can remain for years causing chronic autoimmune dysfunction throughout the body. This could be why people with autism or other chronic digestive disorders, who have been vaccinated for measles, will have live measles present in brain and gut biopsies.

As bad as having a full out viral episode can be, with the vomiting, fever, pain delirious, and whatnot, it may be necessary to be able to clear the viral DNA completely, along with the accumulated bio toxins and genetic glitches that made one susceptible to begin with. Vaccination, only stimulates the body to produce antibodies against the viral DNA, and does not condition the all out immune response that is necessary to boost overall health and immune function.

Bruce Lipton explains fairly well the difference between being naturally inoculated, and being vaccinated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vF2558AXg-o
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #259 on: February 12, 2015, 11:03:56 am »
Can you just summarize the points he makes? So far you have some innuendo mixed with irrelevant facts. That does not add up to anything,  so far.
Direct blood exposure is certainly possible without injections. Rabies is spread that way, for instance, through bites. What's the difference between a bite and an injection?


Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #260 on: February 12, 2015, 12:40:02 pm »
So what's the difference between "live" virus from an injection  versus a severe infection? None of you have an answer, you just have innuendo, insults, misdirection, and anxiety. None of those equals an answer to that question. Get it  together, control your emotions, and come back when you have an answer.
You made a statement which was untrue. I simple responded to it with a fact. Facts are apparently a problem with you.

I am not anxious over anything. However your response is anxious.
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Al

Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #261 on: February 12, 2015, 03:17:21 pm »
So what's the difference between "live" virus from an injection  versus a severe infection? None of you have an answer, you just have innuendo, insults, misdirection, and anxiety. None of those equals an answer to that question. Get it  together, control your emotions, and come back when you have an answer.
The way I see it CK is that vaccinations are a fear response. They are an emotional response. Terror that you are going to catch a flu. What I do is eat properly and therefore no problems.

I used to sit for 4.5 hours per day about .5 meter from a coworker swapping a headset with a microphone that had a foam tip, a perfect place for microbes to live. Also the air in an aircraft originates in the upper atmosphere and so is slightly different in composition, bone dry, and then it is passed through a compressor that compresses it till it reaches a temperature of about 600 C then it is squeezed through pipes and through a radiator which brings it down to a sensible temperature where it is mixed with cold air and then this windstorm blows by the crew. A recipe for illness. My coworkers would have colds, flus, whatever, regularly for whatever reason. I did not catch their illnesses. Why? I was a (cooked) vegetarian, so, so much for the reason for this site.... Reason was that I selected my foods according to Ayurvedic principles, meditated and exercised IMO.

A raw diet I have discovered reduces the need for such careful food selection.
Cheers
Al

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #262 on: February 13, 2015, 09:22:08 am »
I look forward to the day when someone can tell me the difference between an infectious disease transmitted through a bite, versus a vaccine for that same disease through a needle injection. 

Raw-al, I appreciate that reason is not something you're interested in. That's OK with me, I accept that.

Offline sabertooth

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #263 on: February 13, 2015, 10:51:44 am »
Can you just summarize the points he makes? So far you have some innuendo mixed with irrelevant facts. That does not add up to anything,  so far.
Direct blood exposure is certainly possible without injections. Rabies is spread that way, for instance, through bites. What's the difference between a bite and an injection?



I was not aware that I was guilty of using innuendo or irrelevant facts. I am attempting to answer you as clearly as possible. Bruce Lipton explained in detail how the immune system of humans develop and mature under natural circumstances, its of paramount relevance, when discussing adverse immune reactions that may be implicated in conditions such as autism. The questions you are asking require a deeper understanding of the new science to even begin to answer, Even the most brilliant thinkers on the cutting edge are not yet able to entirely understand how everything really works. That being said, there are plenty of clues that shed some serious doubt on the established view of the biological sciences of genetics and immunology.

As difficult as these new revelations in the advancement of human knowledge may be to comprehend by those raised on the foundation of the old model, I will try my best to explain the jest of it, and answer your questions to the best of my knowledge.

Regarding rabies, and other infectious blood born conditions.... Rationally speaking newborn infants are not usually exposed to rabid animal mauling, or have some deep cut that could get infected, any mother who would allow such horrid things to occur would have their bloodlines weeded out through natural selection.

Yet we have the majority of infants born in the west today being injected with genetically modified hepatitis at birth ( sometimes only a couple of hours old) If you listened to what Bruce Lipton had to say, you would know that the immune system of new borns is not prepared to handle injections designed to stimulate artificial immune reactions.

The immune system of infants needs time to mature, and mothers milk along with a protective environment has naturally provided the optimal conditions for healthy immune development, since the beginning of mammalian history. Take note that the blood brain barrier in children does not become mature enough to effectively restrict viral infiltration of the brain, until at least age three. By that time the average child will have received dozens of injections. Around age 11 or so is when the immune system actual reaches maturity and the programing cells in the thymus begin to down shift. When you inject young children with live viruses before the immune system is prepared to deal with it, it is possible( especially if there are already underlying health imbalances) that the immune response will be inadequate to fully clear out the viral DNA, which can then ember itself into the tissue which can cause a whole host of chronic health issues.

Most people who advocate vaccinations against viral illness do not even know for sure what viruses are, nor do they realize the vital role they play in biological life. I challenge anyone to explain to me exactly what a virus is? Why are they Ubiquitous in nature?

 I believe that they are essential for maintaining balance in nature, and when you artificially suppress viral cleanses, the acumualtion of biotoxins accumulate and lead to negative disease down the road. Polio for example, the majority of people contrated it, but only a few became crippled. Perhaps its function was to clean the signal cord from other accumulated toxins. For those who are extremely toxic or deficient the cleansing process can be damaging.....But what about those who go through the infection and are completely unharmed, could it be that childhood polio could be beneficial, and that by suppressing the viral outbreak you prevent the purging reaction which would cleans the spinal cord....When these people grow up and age, never haven gone through a naturally occurring viral cleanse, the accumulation of bio-waste could lead to degenerative conditions, such as the epidemics in degenerative back conditions, cancer, arthritis, etc.... we are seeing today. Vaccines by only stimulating antigen production, without causing the complete purging reactions, only do a half ass job, and there are many people who now believe that, in general, they do cause more harm than good.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2015, 11:02:00 am by sabertooth »
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Offline van

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #264 on: February 13, 2015, 11:07:53 am »
The way I see it CK is that vaccinations are a fear response. They are an emotional response. Terror that you are going to catch a flu. What I do is eat properly and therefore no problems.

I used to sit for 4.5 hours per day about .5 meter from a coworker swapping a headset with a microphone that had a foam tip, a perfect place for microbes to live. Also the air in an aircraft originates in the upper atmosphere and so is slightly different in composition, bone dry, and then it is passed through a compressor that compresses it till it reaches a temperature of about 600 C then it is squeezed through pipes and through a radiator which brings it down to a sensible temperature where it is mixed with cold air and then this windstorm blows by the crew. A recipe for illness. My coworkers would have colds, flus, whatever, regularly for whatever reason. I did not catch their illnesses. Why? I was a (cooked) vegetarian, so, so much for the reason for this site.... Reason was that I selected my foods according to Ayurvedic principles, meditated and exercised IMO.

A raw diet I have discovered reduces the need for such careful food selection.

I imagine you have considered also that it's not always what we eat, but what we don't eat.  but then ( and I'm joking a little here ) maybe liters of diet (or not ) pepsi and fast food for lunch and dinner was part of your Ayurvedic meal plan.     The guy behind Bullet Proof Coffee,  decided when he was Three hundred pounds to make some changes.  Now it seems we all need his laboratory derived coconut oil derivative etc...    So all these diets have at least one thing in common, they get rid of Junk food. 

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #265 on: February 13, 2015, 07:34:25 pm »
Saber, children under age 3 are already exposed to thousands of viruses simply by breathing. Few of them are potentially dangerous, but they are there. And guess what? Young children get bitten by dogs and cats pretty often, and are exposed to viruses through those bites.

So your theory has a hole. Got any answers?

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #266 on: February 13, 2015, 07:41:39 pm »
And did you really just recommend polio as a spinal cord detox? Have you thought about the possibility that a clean diet makes such a detox unnecessary? Or that the people eating the worst diets, while simultaneously needing the most detox, are the least likely to survive the infection without being severely crippled?

Offline sabertooth

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #267 on: February 13, 2015, 11:45:22 pm »
And did you really just recommend polio as a spinal cord detox? Have you thought about the possibility that a clean diet makes such a detox unnecessary? Or that the people eating the worst diets, while simultaneously needing the most detox, are the least likely to survive the infection without being severely crippled?

Emphatically YES, YES, Yes to all of your questions.

People who are relatively pure and without deficiency, will most likely only have a mild reaction to viruses like polio, which will have an overall beneficial effect of  mildly stimulating the immune system to do some light cleaning( which is necessary even in optimal environments). Even people or animals living on optimal diets still undergo periodic viral episodes, which are often triggered by environmental changes, such as season changes where you have toxic mold blooms, or a lack of sunlight and cold temperature that weakens the bodies detoxification systems. The common cold serves the same function and may be necessary to cleanse the upper respiratory tract) Viruses that induce hives like measles and mumps, indicate that bio toxins are being expelled through the skin. Each particular virus serves a biological function, and to suppress viral outbreak is like sweeping dirt under a rug and calling your house clean!

You are also correct that people eating the worse diets do require the most intense detox reactions are those who are most likely to suffer complications through viral detox episodes, but I insist if those viral detoxes are suppressed artificially, then the accumulation of metabolic , and environmental waste, will eventually lead to degenerative disease later on. The people who were "saved from polio" are the same people who are dying of cancer and giving birth to autistic children, because the necessary virally induced epigenetic adaptions where suppressed. 

The people who would be prone to die from a viral episode should be Identified early on, and the focus should be on preventative lifestyle changes, and holistic ways to build immunity, so that when they eventually have to undergo an episode of viral detox, they will be strong enough to endure. Then afterward with the proper lifestyle adjustments, they can truly recover fully and begin to build a cleaner and healthier life.

In the end people are going to be crippled and suffer due to poor choices, or just bad fate.... regardless of why others may suffer, it is not right that you insist that sovereign individuals, who chose to take care of themselves in accordance to their own values, be forced into altering themselves through chemical injections, under the false notion that they could be carriers of some microbe that will harm other people that are to weak to fend off. This is a dangerous ideology that I will not let stand uncontested, wherever it turns up!
« Last Edit: February 13, 2015, 11:54:43 pm by sabertooth »
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Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #268 on: February 14, 2015, 06:39:14 am »
I look forward to the day when someone can tell me the difference between an infectious disease transmitted through a bite, versus a vaccine for that same disease through a needle injection. 

Raw-al, I appreciate that reason is not something you're interested in. That's OK with me, I accept that.
I am not trained in that topic, however Peter Wakefield is and that is why I posted his interviews. I was enlightened more than anything I knew previously and I recommend listening. I know it is time consuming.

Polls show that  a massive amount of women do not trust pediatricians or are not sure whether to trust them is quite telling. Despite the massive amount of media hysteria about how safe vaccines are, women do not trust them like in the past and the numbers are increasing. Reason is that Mothers have an instinctive strong desire to protect their young. It's not a theoretical argument to them. The more that the medicos try to convince them the less they trust.

The problem is that if they go to a pediatrician and they get told to drug their child or there has to be an operation and they don't want to have anything to do with it, that the state (social services of some variety) may force them, makes many mothers terrified of having their child taken away or declared an unfit mother. This is not just some fantasy talk of a weird new world. I have spoken to many young mothers who said this in so many words to me. They have seen it in the papers where the Gov't has taken away children. With autistic children, parents get accused of being the cause etc. Some mothers of autistic kids have even taken their child and their own life, because they know that when they die the child will end up on the street dying in a horrible way.

See us guys are not quite as wired into 'parentness' as the ladies are.

When mothers get pregnant there is a rewiring of their brains and bodies. Their whole immune system is changed to allow a foreign body to exist inside them. Otherwise it would kill the foetus, in the same way that it kills a virus or tumour. Even the way that they think changes. They become more right-brained. I discussed this with some mothers one time after I read about it in some books on brain development  and they all said that math questions get slotted to the back of the brain unless it is specifically required. They hone their ability to look after many problems associated with protecting nourishing etc the child. Multitasking.

ie. as Mark Gungor says "never put a man in charge of two children". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=814eR5K7KD8

I know that one of the problems associated with young girls becoming exposed to plastics for instance, is that it causes estrogens to be adjusted in them causing prematuration. The normal age of puberty in girls has accelerated about two years, ie breast formation etc. When this maturation occurs, there are physiological/mental changes that occur that cause them to think differently, slowing their abilities in left brained activity and thus school for instance suffers.

Their brains readjust to their new reality of possibly becoming a mother.
Cheers
Al

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #269 on: February 14, 2015, 07:55:35 am »
None of that detracts from vaccine science. As for not trusting doctors, only an idiot thinks it's all or nothing.  Vaccines are not a bad idea. Antibiotics often ARE, for instance.

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #270 on: February 14, 2015, 08:55:02 am »
None of that detracts from vaccine science. As for not trusting doctors, only an idiot thinks it's all or nothing.  Vaccines are not a bad idea. Antibiotics often ARE, for instance.
  FYI: Antibiotics are in vaccines, especially the ones given to infants. Although, I would be more worried about the other poisons like formaldehyde.
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #271 on: February 14, 2015, 09:14:46 am »
It's hilarious to have all these people educating me about health.

Offline raw-al

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #272 on: February 14, 2015, 11:16:17 am »
It's hilarious to have all these people educating me about health.
I often find on this site and others that my most deeply held beliefs are totally manufactured by me. That's the value in continuing to talk.
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #273 on: February 15, 2015, 07:52:58 am »
I often find on this site and others that my most deeply held beliefs are totally manufactured by me. That's the value in continuing to talk.

Yeah, what I usually find is that I spend a lot of time here wondering how to talk people out of their unsupported beliefs. I can only think of one belief that I have had to revise as a result of reading here, my support for raw dairy.  I still use raw cream and butter, but even those are not appropriate for some people, like TylerDurden.

This place is a real slog for me, banning spammers and trying to help people who are not remotely to the point of being evidence-based yet. The only useful things I've learned here can be counted on one hand, and I've been here 6 years. 2 of those have been extremely useful, though, I admit. The Gokhale method is one of them.

Offline eveheart

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Re: Autism explained
« Reply #274 on: February 15, 2015, 08:19:00 am »
CK, your slogging is much appreciated!

I enjoy the diversity of belief here, evidence-based or not. After all, who doesn't have some evidence for his beliefs, invisible though it may be to others. Also, I have become a competent in raw-food handling and storage that I find in this forum, and I've changed many elements of my lifestyle because of what I have read here.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

 

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