Poll

Are you a ZCer (someone who tries to keep carbs as close to zero as possible)?

Yes
13 (37.1%)
No
22 (62.9%)

Total Members Voted: 30

Author Topic: Are you a ZCer?  (Read 26309 times)

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Offline PaleoPhil

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Are you a ZCer?
« on: October 18, 2010, 08:32:48 am »
By ZC I mean you consistently try to get your carbs down to as close to zero as possible and regard any carb eating as cheating.

I'm curious about how many actual ZCers we have here and how their numbers compare to the rest of us. I figured an anonymous poll might maximize the number of responses. Some non-ZCers probably don't read this section of the forum, so the numbers may be skewed toward ZCers.

I'm not a ZCer myself. See my avatar description for my current approach.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline the PresiDenT

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2010, 08:57:20 am »
By ZC I mean you consistently try to get your carbs down to as close to zero as possible and regard any carb eating as cheating.

I'm curious about how many actual ZCers we have here and how their numbers compare to the rest of us. I figured an anonymous poll might maximize the number of responses. Some non-ZCers probably don't read this section of the forum, so the numbers may be skewed toward ZCers.

I'm not a ZCer myself. See my avatar description for my current approach.
I dont know how ZC'ers have the dedication to do so. I would go insane (at least in my current situation surrounded by SAD "food") so fruit sometimes, and raw organic veges daily are a nice escape. This last week i have been eating 300-400g of liver daily, and notice MASSIVE POSITIVE RESULTS all over my body. My sight has improved and cuts heal dramastically faster. The stuff can be a chore to get down tho, but its good medicine
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Offline sabertooth

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2010, 09:00:32 am »
I am on the boarder of ZC ,
I drink two glasses of lemon water and about 20 carbs from coconut butter every day
I have ZC days were I feel good and eat no carbs, but I soon loose my appetite and energy if I go too long without any carbs. I feel like I need just a little lemon juice to level my blood sugar, and produce a mild insulin responce that helps me keep up weight and appetite.    
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2010, 09:06:57 am »
BTW, I'm not going to criticize anyone who publicly reveals that they are ZCers, though I can understand wanting to remain anonymous given the tenor of the forum lately.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2010, 09:53:17 am »
BTW, I'm not going to criticize anyone who publicly reveals that they are ZCers, though I can understand wanting to remain anonymous given the tenor of the forum lately.

The tenor of the forum is always fine and open, Phil.

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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2010, 10:05:32 am »
The tenor of the forum is always fine and open, Phil.
Yours is, GS, but not everyone's, unfortunately.

Quote
Raw zero carbers are raw paleo dieters.
I agree.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline raw

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2010, 11:17:01 am »
me, my husband, my toddler are raw ZC. last two weeks me and my husband didn't eat any fruits or veggies, but my toddler drinks some squeezed oranges in his water. we eat like lex rocker. everyday same food. i eat one meal or 2, my husband eats two meals and my toddler also eats two meals.

my toddler is in ZC almost a year now. today we visit a doctor who's also our family friend. he says that my toddler is too strong for his age. he checks his hands and feet and he also states that it's rare to see all pinkish color like that.

my husband eats 50% raw, 50% cook paleo for the past 2 months, but now he's complete raw paleo (for almost 10 days now). he's having some difficulties in his spinal cord, he's so hopeful that he'll heal faster with complete raw paleo ZC. i prepare his meals twice a day and i also feed him by my own hand. 

my health is also very vibrant. skin, hair,lips everything glows. i get my sculpted arms already, strong hands and feet...etc. amazing!!
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Offline djr_81

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2010, 07:06:33 pm »
I am. It's purely a function of what my body does well on and not a strict adherence to the idea though. I think RVLC/RLC are both perfectly fine choices and possibly the healthiest (moderation is key). Unfortunately each time I indulge in a different fruit or vegetable I have adverse reactions which remind me how RZC is best for me. Some day I may go back to a diet with fruits or vegetables in it but not in the foreseeable future.

Yours is, GS, but not everyone's, unfortunately.
There are a few people who get a bit worked up about RZC, pro or con, which get more attention as they're more vocal. Overall though the forum is civil about it IMO.
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Offline sabertooth

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2010, 08:10:24 pm »
I Just don't gain anything from eatting vegetables and fruits, organic produce is so expensive and if I eat anything like a tomato or avocado my stomach feels a little off, if I eat a sweet fruit I feel like my energy crashes and a little bloated and heavy. So by 4 months into the diet I  gave up on trying to incorporate troublesome greens and vegetables, and furits. Although I do juice two lemons a day.I think the citric acid along with a little bit carbs does have a positive effect, but anything more than that I am afraid to try because I feel so good as things are.
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Offline ForTheHunt

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2010, 08:45:41 pm »
Mostly primal here

Lots of meat, milk and about a tablespoon of honey.

I used to eat meat and fruit mainly, but have trouble with fruit after I introduced milk. I feel a lot better on meat and milk anyway.

Although I'm pretty constipated, I'm hoping it will pass
Take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Try things out for your self and then make up your mind.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2010, 11:29:20 am »
Raw did you vote? I didn't notice the vote tally go up after you posted.

...There are a few people who get a bit worked up about RZC, pro or con, which get more attention as they're more vocal. Overall though the forum is civil about it IMO.
Yes, I agree, though lately they seem to be turning up the heat, so I'm hoping this thread may help improve understanding and turn the heat back down a bit. Thanks for the inputs, everyone.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline KD

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2010, 12:28:56 pm »
Raw did you vote? I didn't notice the vote tally go up after you posted.


yo Angelo, I didn't see you vote for our friend Vinny Sacromonti yet for local office. hows about you do that.

Offline raw

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2010, 01:00:59 pm »
Raw did you vote? I didn't notice the vote tally go up after you posted.
i didn't vote at the beginning, later i did.

i don't like to be stubborn to be on raw ZC diet. i find that, if i have a meal with lots of meat and organs and fats, i just don't have enough place to eat other things. i'm not punishing myself eating same food, i also crave same food (weird!). i realize that my mind goes after so many things that i put less time to seat and think "what's for my diner today!"
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Offline klowcarb

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2010, 08:10:56 am »
I am proudly a lifelong ZCer. I love it, it works, it makes me lean, it makes me strong, it makes me energetic and healthy.

I should add that I don't worry abou the carbs in eggs. So somedays I have a high of 6 or 7 grams of carbs from eggs, but that is all.

ZC rocks!

Offline rawcarni

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2010, 03:13:13 pm »
I am proudly a lifelong ZCer. I love it, it works, it makes me lean, it makes me strong, it makes me energetic and healthy.

ZC rocks!

No need to say more!!!
Nicole

Offline Hannibal

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2010, 05:27:13 pm »
I should add that I don't worry abou the carbs in eggs. So somedays I have a high of 6 or 7 grams of carbs from eggs, but that is all.
It only proves that ZC is unrealistic.
I once said that (carnivorous) zero-plant would be a better description
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Offline Hannibal

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2010, 05:31:03 pm »
I can understand wanting to remain anonymous given the tenor of the forum lately.
You're kidding, Phil. :)
I can't imagine that someone could want to remain anonymous on this forum because of not eating carbs from plants.
Do you blame vultures for the carcass they eat?
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2010, 06:31:13 pm »
What is ironic is that this forum was, early on,  actually very heavily biased against raw omnivores with discussion of omnivorous diets severely frowned upon, even wild raw herbs were damned  etc. By contrast, the only times raw omnivores have reacted against RZCers in a big way were when some of the RZCers, such as William, started to preach that all carbs were evil for everyone and all that rot. Fortunately, the rest of the RZCers are far more reasonable.
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Offline klowcarb

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2010, 07:24:09 am »
It only proves that ZC is unrealistic.
I once said that (carnivorous) zero-plant would be a better description

Only it you are a literalist. No one I know who is ZC considers the carbs in eggs. They are biologically zero. Only a stupid person (not you Hannibal) would say that Zero Carb literally means NO CARBS AT ALL, which, yes, is impossible. We are talking about agents consumed that ACT like carbs in the body.

I don't ascribe to "carnivorous" since that can involve eating plants. I have nothing against it, but that is not my WOE.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2010, 07:34:20 am »
What is ironic is that this forum was, early on,  actually very heavily biased against raw omnivores with discussion of omnivorous diets severely frowned upon, even wild raw herbs were damned  etc.
I've been learning more about that. I didn't know until recently that Satya was apparently one of the founding members here. Even though I'm not ZC and have argued with ZCers in the past (including William going back to my PaleoFood days, though I mostly learned my lesson not to debate him :) ), I have also noticed the shift of the rhetoric more in the anti-ZC direction while I've been here. Part of that is because William was so active and extreme that he made the forum seem much more pro-ZC than it actually was. I knew Lex was more active early on. Why did the other carnivore guy who was here at the beginning and whom you sometimes talk about leave this forum and start his own website? I think you shared the reason before, but I can't remember it.

When I was doing my ZC experiment, I think some people here may have mistook me as philosophically ZC. In contrast, the ZIOH people seemed to think that I was too positive about carb-containing foods like liver. The idea of avoiding liver and eggs just because they contain some carbs never did make sense to me, but when I was reading posts at ZIOH (mainly Lex's, Satya's and Katelyn's--who have all since left that forum), CW asked that before anyone talk positively about liver and other carb-containing foods, or the carbs that the Inuit ate, or criticize ZC, that we at least try ZC ourselves for a while. I thought that was fair and I was curious about it, so I tried it for several months. I must admit that I did very well on it, but it doesn't make sense to me in the long run to completely avoid liver, eggs and herbs solely because they contain a little carbs or fiber (though there could be other reasons like extreme senstivities). It seems too dogmatic to me and I abhor dogmatism. On the other hand, if eating nothing but muscle meat and fat was the only thing that worked for me I wouldn't have a problem with doing it.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline klowcarb

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2010, 08:33:54 am »
Agree, Phil. But I don't let ZIOH define ZC. I eat organs, eggs, and butter. I am ZC. I think the ZIOH diet of Wal-Mart muscle meat is crap.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2010, 08:37:04 am »
You're free to call yourself what you like, of course, but I think of that as a raw animal food diet, rather than raw ZC, though CW appears to have laxened his own definition of ZC, which supports my contention that it's time to bury the term, because not many people still adhere to actual zero carb and literally zero carb is impossible, as has been pointed out by others here.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2010, 01:35:47 pm »
PP, the person referred to was Craig, I think. He did not quit rawpalaeo or RZC, he just left the forum because he found arguing with Satya such a hassle.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 05:44:42 pm by TylerDurden »
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Offline rawcarni

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2010, 04:43:16 pm »
Guys,
Sorry I don't want to be mean (really) but I think these types of discussions (what is ZC, with or without organs etc) are kind of tiresome. I eat only animal foods (meat, fat, eggs, organs) and have never felt better in my life. Also I think it would be rather nice not to judge or (for Katelyn) to look at ZIOH with a sense of anger. I found their behavior on ZIOH towards katelyn REALLY BAD and CHILDISH!!!!! I am not taking part in discussions on ZIOH because they seem rather childish and superficial (like fighting over who has a harder job raising kids, woman or men....) also because I hate the anti-exercise atmosphere overe there and I love to exercise....(oh sorry didn't intend to write all this)
What I wanted to say is: I am glad that I was part of ZIOH, b/c that's were I met katelyn and she was one of the main drivers for me to have my meal at night - and both ZC and WD is, what is working best for my body and mind!
So why the talk how you define ZC? Is it really important?
Nicole

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Are you a ZCer?
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2010, 05:15:00 pm »
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