Author Topic: Plantains vs. Bananas?  (Read 16416 times)

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Offline dariorpl

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2017, 09:14:33 pm »
Even so, these are a very small number of fruits that grow in a small number of geographic locations, are not very prolific, and are generally only available for a short period of time. And some are not even that sweet, such as wild figs. Also, in the wild, other animals such as birds, monkeys, chipmunks, boars, etc, tend to get them before humans can.
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Offline van

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #26 on: June 26, 2017, 10:17:20 pm »
I think just as important,  those early peoples, if they did find a tree with such fruit, most likely would have spent many calories just hiking to get to the tree, and climbing it,  not to mention that they were moving throughout the day burning up calories ( relieving any excess blood sugar ) and not sitting at a computer.  Those who seem to fair the longest on high sugar diets are those running marathons, etc.. very active physically. 

Offline Iguana

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #27 on: June 26, 2017, 10:54:02 pm »
Years ago, some friends of mine went into a primary forest in Sumatra without any food provisions, planning to eat whatever they would find and hoping to make contact with orangutans. I asked one of them what they ate and he replied they ate only fruits of various kinds mostly unknown found high in the trees, which they managed to climb. He said it was ok because their expedition lasted one week only.

Other friends, a whole family, lived a year or two into Amazonia in French Guaiana and one of the sons told me there was about 50 different edible fruits available, also high in the trees.

Writing that, I remember having already written it somewhere on this forum, apparently to no avail!

Don't forget there's co-evolution. Fruits such as cempedaks and durians are only found in the wild in the primary forest where orangutans or other apes and monkeys spread their seeds. Since humans started to grow grains and domesticated cattle for dairy, they destroyed the primary forest and they were no longer spreading the seeds of numerous fruits they consumed before. Thus we have no idea of what were the forests where hominids lived and what grew in during the paleolithic era before the use of fire and agriculture. 
     
« Last Edit: June 26, 2017, 11:00:12 pm by Iguana »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline cobalamin

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Offline dariorpl

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2017, 07:05:11 am »
Iguana,

It's a different thing to survive for a week in the tropics on only fruits, than to survive and thrive year-round, year after year, in the much harsher climates of this Earth. And I wonder how many of those 50 different edible fruits were as sweet as a regular domesticated overripe plaintain or banana or grape or apple or mango. Probably none of them.

Also, humans are not tree-dwellers. There's a reason we walk up straight and why our legs are 10 times as strong as our arms, whereas other apes who spend a significant amount of time up in the trees walk mostly on all fours and have arms almost as strong as their legs. We left the jungles and forests long before ever becoming humans, and opted instead mostly for the plains, savannah, tundra and other mostly open field areas where large grass and shrub eating game was available for hunting. Yes we can still do ok in the jungle and in the forest, but the main staple of our diet has mostly been meat. We did destroy some of the forests and jungles, but to believe that the whole Earth (or our natural living environment) consisted largely of these, is simply mistaken. The reason we destroyed what forests and jungles we did is because we don't thrive in those environments, whether as farmers or as hunter-gatherers.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2017, 07:26:12 am by dariorpl »
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Offline dariorpl

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2017, 09:11:03 am »
Btw, elephants will often destroy trees with no apparent immediate purpose. Some biologists think it's because they know trees block the sunlight and destroying the trees makes more way for grasses to grow, which are the main staple of their diet.

The theory sounds a little outlandish when you first hear it, but elephants do have amazing memory and long lifespans. One can only guess if this is the reason they're doing it, or if it's something else.
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Offline Iguana

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Re: Plantains vs. Bananas?
« Reply #31 on: July 03, 2017, 08:11:55 pm »
Iguana,
It's a different thing to survive for a week in the tropics on only fruits, than to survive and thrive year-round, year after year, in the much harsher climates of this Earth.
I never said the contrary!

Quote
And I wonder how many of those 50 different edible fruits were as sweet as a regular domesticated overripe plaintain or banana or grape or apple or mango. Probably none of them.
Cempedaks, rambutans or arbutus are very sweet, for example. 

Quote
Also, humans are not tree-dwellers. There's a reason we walk up straight and why our legs are 10 times as strong as our arms, whereas other apes who spend a significant amount of time up in the trees walk mostly on all fours and have arms almost as strong as their legs. We left the jungles and forests long before ever becoming humans, and opted instead mostly for the plains, savannah, tundra and other mostly open field areas where large grass and shrub eating game was available for hunting. Yes we can still do ok in the jungle and in the forest, but the main staple of our diet has mostly been meat. We did destroy some of the forests and jungles, but to believe that the whole Earth (or our natural living environment) consisted largely of these, is simply mistaken. The reason we destroyed what forests and jungles we did is because we don't thrive in those environments, whether as farmers or as hunter-gatherers.
Well, you know it.

I don’t know. I think the reality is more complex than that.
Neanderthal dental tartar reveals plant-based diet – and drugs 
Plant foods and the dietary ecology of Neanderthals and early modern humans
Evidence for the Paleoethnobotany of the Neanderthal: A Review of the Literature

But the above references concern a relatively recent era and we certainly have to look even further back in time because Neanderthals seem to have not been well adapted to their diet (which included cooked foods) and maybe to their environment also.
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

 

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