Author Topic: Enzymes  (Read 14357 times)

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Offline Techydude

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Enzymes
« on: February 05, 2011, 06:22:13 pm »
I heard that cooking destroys enzymes and usually the whole enzyme argument is the main basis of raw veganism -> which translates over to raw paleo. Anyone support this? I kind've do with all the enzyme therapy out there.

Moreso, has anyone noticed a digestion improvement with all the raw paleo foods they've eaten?

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2011, 06:32:25 pm »
There is little scientific info on enzymes, but it is telling that many cooked-food-eaters find they need extra enzyme supplements for better digestion as their bodies own enzyme-producing organs get worn out in old age.

http://www.realmilk.com/enzyme.html

As for digestion-improvement, pre-RPD diet, I had nasty stomach-aches after eating any cooked animal food whatsoever( a trait peculiar to adrenal burnout) and constipation etc. etc. Going rawpalaeo meant my digestion was fine as long as I didn't eat ground, raw meats.
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Offline achillezzz

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2011, 07:11:50 pm »
There is little scientific info on enzymes, but it is telling that many cooked-food-eaters find they need extra enzyme supplements for better digestion as their bodies own enzyme-producing organs get worn out in old age.

http://www.realmilk.com/enzyme.html

As for digestion-improvement, pre-RPD diet, I had nasty stomach-aches after eating any cooked animal food whatsoever( a trait peculiar to adrenal burnout) and constipation etc. etc. Going rawpalaeo meant my digestion was fine as long as I didn't eat ground, raw meats.

And again I don't understand whats wrong with ground beef?

Teachydude of course digestion is improved!! there is nothing to digest its all almost ready for your body to use.
and the fats are literaly turned into liquid fatty acids vitamins and minerals supplements in your stomach.


Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2011, 08:32:48 pm »
Well some people claim that grinding the meats make them less digestible not more, plus there is the issue of butchers washing their knives with chemicals and leaving traces on the meat thereby.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
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Offline King Salmon

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2011, 07:13:39 am »
For sure,I used to eat tons of nuts and seeds thinking I could replace meat.Big mistake.Most nuts are heat treated(even if the label says raw) and to add insult to injury they have enzyme inhibitors.Painful experience in the gut.
When I switched to raw meats:voila!
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Offline kurite

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2011, 09:31:47 am »
The whole idea that the enzymes in raw food help digest the food itself is absolute bull. There is no science to it. However if you want to argue that foods are more easily digested because the food hasn't been modified by cooking then that's a different story.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2012, 06:27:46 pm by TylerDurden »
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2011, 04:35:02 pm »
The whole idea that the enzymes in raw food help digest the food itself is absolute bull. There is no science to it.
B*ll, I'm afraid. The article above pointed out that enzymes get to predigest the raw meats in the upper stomach for 30 minutes  before they eventually get destroyed in the lower stomach.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2011, 04:36:31 pm »
Some nutrients are destroyed by cooking, most noticeably Vitamin C.  But not everything we eat is cooked, and it's not difficult to get plenty of these nutrients with the amount of raw food we do it.
Irrelevant to the topic of enzymes. You wouldn't be a spammer, by any chance?
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline MarkC

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2012, 06:51:35 am »
Has anyone ever found a scientific article or reference that verifies that enzymes present in the food help to digest food in the upper stomach without being denatured by hydrochloric acid? Tbh, until reading the above article, I had never before encountered any reference to different parts of the human stomach as having different functions and conditions.

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2012, 07:35:34 am »
I doubt any enzyme survives in the stomach, except maybe those that specifically work in such an acidic environment, like pepsin for example.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2012, 06:29:55 pm »
The trouble is that all the studies only focus on the effect on foods as they pass through the whole stomach. It seems logical that the enzymes are not affected in the upper stomach, though.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2012, 01:09:13 am »
Just an interesting writeup, apparently aged, on food enzymes. I'm giving this RVAF class to about 15 people tomorrow and trying to get some material together to talk to them about the basics. Food enzyme is kind of a question mark, it makes sense, but haven't seen any studies on it for the reasons listed above...anyone with updated info on FOOD enzymes?

http://www.life-sources.com/pages/Is-Your-Body-Demanding-Food-Enzymes%3F.html

This guy seems like he may be coming from a conventional health perspective, but may have some good points nonetheless.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2012, 01:18:51 am by TylerDurden »

Offline Alive

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2012, 02:11:29 am »
Since scientists have recently found active broccoli DNA in the bodies of people who ate raw broccoli it seems perfectly reasonable for enzymes to survive also.

Our stomachs are lined with taste buds at 1/100th the density of our tongues, so our stomach can precisely control its secretions on a localised basis in response to the foods.

Regarding stomach acid, I experimented by putting raw foods in cider vinegar and that preserved the food rather than digesting it. Animals and plants are found preserved in peat bogs, so does acid really digest food? Maybe acid's purpose is to sterilise food so our own microbes can then be introduced? If the food was raw or even decomposing already and we liked the microbe culture present then could the stomach choose not to use much acid?

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2012, 02:30:28 am »
Of course acid alone won't digest the food, you need enzymes.. but enzymes typically can't work on food as is, acid and mechanical force is needed to break it down and unfold proteins.
Quote
Maybe acid's purpose is to sterilise food so our own microbes can then be introduced?
No, that's definitely not acid's purpose.

Offline Alive

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2012, 06:03:43 am »
Also inside the food lumps there must be a lot of food that is not effected by the acid, especially if you are swallowing lumps of meat, so the enzymes in the middle of the food lumps / particles could easily have their enzymes intact.

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2012, 11:01:23 am »
Thanks Alive, neat info and IDEAS as usually, much appreciated!
____________________________________

Still hunting info on food enzymes, class went really well and peeps are wanting to come back for more classes, which I'll plan to give in Dec. I targeted WAPF folks because one, I've been commenting on their listserve for a few years and have a reputation as someone with solid info, and two, because they already think animal fat is the bees knees, now it's just flipping the switch and keeping it raw. Great group, asked really awesome questions and responded very positively. Some are now even eating raw meats as a result of it, couldn't really ask for more.

Here is some words from a link I just dug up...

On the synergistic effects of enzymes in food with enzymes in the human body. A literature survey and analytical report.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7935080

Abstract:
"Recently, a theory has been postulated that suggests that vital enzymes in ingested food interact synergistically with enzymes within the human body and more specifically with enzymes in the digestive tract. Alterations in food enzymes induced by bulk processing including heating and irradiation and also the addition of chemical additives have been proposed to create a decrease in metabolic availability of nutrients, with the long-term consequence being disease. This review of the medical literature provides evidence that enzymes in food do in fact survive during digestion and can indeed, add significantly to the nutritive value of ingested foodstuffs. Examples of enzyme synergy in human nutrition are provided in whole grains, milk and dairy products, beans and seeds, and meat products. A bibliography on this interesting finding is included as well as concluding remarks on enzyme synergy and its putative interaction with cell metabolism. Finally, the interaction of enzyme synergy with disease is discussed."
_________________________________________________
I haven't fact checked the attached pdf which is on work by one Dr. Howe(ll), he makes a lot of claims in there, but take it for what it's worth, interesting stuff!
« Last Edit: October 07, 2012, 11:23:12 am by Thoth »

Offline Alive

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2012, 12:52:47 pm »
Good result Thoth - well done! :)

Offline Chris

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #17 on: October 23, 2012, 04:39:44 pm »
I heard that cooking destroys enzymes and usually the whole enzyme argument is the main basis of raw veganism -> which translates over to raw paleo. Anyone support this? I kind've do with all the enzyme therapy out there.

Moreso, has anyone noticed a digestion improvement with all the raw paleo foods they've eaten?

Your body craves and needs Raw food! It's designed to run and thrive on Raw food. Look at our society, and tell me we don't have heath issues? If you want change, you have to change! Change only happens, if YOU change you're thinking and actions! When YOU take a step, that's change.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2012, 04:49:44 pm by Chris »

Offline Bio-shell Avatar

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2012, 09:25:13 pm »
Has anyone ever found a scientific article or reference that verifies that enzymes present in the food help to digest food in the upper stomach without being denatured by hydrochloric acid? Tbh, until reading the above article, I had never before encountered any reference to different parts of the human stomach as having different functions and conditions.

i have three books about enzymes and all are recommended:

http://www.amazon.com/Enzyme-Nutrition-Dr-Edward-Howell/dp/0895292211/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350997872&sr=8-1&keywords=enzyme+nutrition

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0981604552/ref=oh_details_o06_s01_i00

http://www.amazon.com/Enzymes-Fountain-Life-K-Miehlke/dp/1884303005/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1350998157&sr=8-3&keywords=enzymes+for+life

the 1st one has details on the digestion and is probably where the idea originates that food is predigested by enzymes in the upper stomach. the author is a scientist who researched enzymes for decades so he probably knows what he's talking about.

the 2nd book deals with probiotics but we know that it's these little critters that produce the enzymes which help to digest our food. it cites tons of research where probiotics helped to cure diseases and improve health.

the 3rd book talks specifically about enzyme therapy and explains that not only do enzymes work in the upper stomach but in the whole body, meaning they don't get destroyed by stomach acid (or not all of them, anyway). that has been proven because oral enzyme therapy works.

enzymes are the secret of life - anything that delivers enzymes into our body or helps to produce enzymes in the digestive system helps the body to spare its own enzymes and prolongs life. the more enzymes the body itself has to produce, the ealier you get sick and die.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2012, 12:55:12 am »
Thoth, I'm impressed. You teach students the wonders of enzymes etc.? Why haven't you already been expelled for spreading "dangerous  l)  ideas" ? Tell us more about your situation. Maybe a few of us more charismatic types(ie not me) could follow your example.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline Inger

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2012, 01:55:23 am »
Pro biotics taken orally do not always work well at all because they do not pass the stomach acid well. That is why they do not help many. I guess persons with weak stomach acid get more help..? Some get help when making a enema with the same pro biotics but not when taken orally.
The bacterias and viruses die when cooking foods. And we need them to thrive. We need them for epigenetic signaling too.
I do think the whole enzyme theory from raw vegans is a bit overblowed that is my feeling at least. We know there were rawfooders that got sick and died early despite being 100% raw. They must have been so full of enzymes, so why? I do not know but I am not taking it really.. it does not fit with what I have personally witnessed it the rawfood scene.

 Maybe to get some dirt in would be more effective then some pro biotics..lol
Just thinking out loud here..

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2012, 03:06:31 am »
Inger, probiotics != enzymes

Offline Inger

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2012, 03:16:51 am »
Inger, probiotics != enzymes

Yeah... lol I know.
Sorry if my post was confusing.. I am confused in my head right now anyway not telling why..lol

Offline jessica

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2012, 10:46:04 pm »
Inger, probiotics != enzymes

enzymes are chemicals secreted by the pancreas that break down food for proper assimilation
probiotics are single celled organisms that live in a symbiotic relationship with us and our intestines to also break down nutrients and wastes for proper assimilation or elimination

Offline Inger

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Re: Enzymes
« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2012, 11:41:42 pm »
Jessica, thank you!
I always thought probiotics were bacteria, and that is what they are too, mostly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probiotic

Quote
Probiotic organisms are live microorganisms that are thought to be beneficial to the host organism. According to the currently adopted definition by FAO/WHO, probiotics are: "Live microorganisms which when administered in adequate amounts confer a health benefit on the host".[1] Lactic acid bacteria (LAB) and bifidobacteria are the most common types of microbes used as probiotics; but certain yeasts and bacilli may also be used. Probiotics are commonly consumed as part of fermented foods with specially added active live cultures, such as in yogurt, soy yogurt, or as dietary supplements. Probiotics are also delivered in fecal transplants, in which stool from a healthy donor is delivered like a suppository to an infected patient

Inger (less confused now...lol)

 

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