Author Topic: Pottenger's Gay Cats, Pollution, Population Control Propaganda - We have arrived  (Read 36953 times)

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Offline goodsamaritan

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What possibly predictive behavior was observed to make this conclusion?

I have only wikipedia's definition of bakla: "In the Philippines, a baklâ is a male person who is exclusively attracted to men. Baklâ are often considered a third gender. Many, but not all, baklas have feminine mannerisms and dress as women. Some actually self-identify as women." Baklita is defined as a young bakla. Are you saying that your son was exclusively attracted to men in a sexual way at age 1?

I understand that a child may show predictive gender role behaviors before they are school aged, but I've never heard this labeled outright as homosexuality, and never as early as 1.

This shows the difference in my country's culture from yours.  We know and call it as we see it.

We have a Filipino word called "baklita"... where little boys exhibit all the loud flouting traits of the screaming loud adult homos... in action, in movements.  In our culture, this kind of observation is no big deal and is just a matter of fact.

It was my wife who first brought this to my attention.  And I observed and agreed with her.  Way back in 2002.  So we furiously searched the internet and found out all those text about estrogen in soy, the essays that soy was going to make the world gay, and fiction comedy of the last male on earth due to soy poisoning of the entire population.

And because we as parents did not have that mental block of "born gay censorship / politics", we made adjustments in 2002 and got rid of every instance of SOY in our diet. (we were giving "taho" every morning to our boy thinking taho made from soy was a health food brought in by a vendor every day).

We used to feed our family: Taho, Soy Milk and Soy meat substitute.

In 1 month after eliminating all soy my son was masculine.

-------------

Case in point where our culture is on homosexuals... we can make jokes about them in public, and they can joke amongst themselves in public... they are not a protected species to be handled with care.

See the classic characteristics of "baklita" with this advertisement spoof:
(check out their look, their movements, our child was looking like this "baklita" little gay when he was 1.)

Pantene Shampoo Commercial - Baklita Version

and here see a popular comedian singing "Hindi Ako Bakla"... I am not Gay... (just because I exhibit well known visual traits)... and at the end he says... "Babae ako!!!"... I am a woman! (ha ha ha ha ha ha) Super big hit song in 2006.

Michael V - Hindi Ako Bakla
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 11:16:30 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline Iguana

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Iguana, the issue is not bisexuality, it really is homosexuality...

Ok Edwin, it’s not the same. But homos don’t bother me: that’s their thing, not mine, and it seems there has always been a small percentage of homosexuals in every human population, at least since recorded history. This percentile may increase, who knows? It’s not by interviewing young girls or boys who seem to report their subjective visual impression that you establish valid statistics!

Anyway, if you seem right to say that the reproductive power of mankind is decreasing, it’s not a problem for life on Earth. On the contrary, it could be a good thing since the planet is overpopulated and mankind is fast depleting all natural resources. I know you disagree on that and I won’t argue anymore. There can be no rational arguments to support or oppose beliefs. You said you’re not religious… but you believe you will still live in your descendants. That’s really a very particular belief of yours.

Quote
Pottenger's cats has every relevance to this forum.  The fact that Pottenger observed homosexuality as part of the degeneration of his cats shows during his time he was not censored unlike today's USA politics.  Glad to know, we don't need to bow down to one country's politics to stifle scientific investigation that is much needed.

Ok.

Quote
If you don't like this topic, you don't have to read it.

The question is the negative impact such topics can have on the public perception of the raw paleo movement and of this forum in particular. It’s difficult enough to get the idea recognized that humans seem badly adapted to cooked and Neolithic foods without adding more difficulties by talking about other topics which will be badly perceived and about which there’s not the slightest consensus amongst us.

Are you saying that your son was exclusively attracted to men in a sexual way at age 1?

I understand that a child may show predictive gender role behaviors before they are school aged, but I've never heard this labeled outright as homosexuality, and never as early as 1.

I was also wondering about that!
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline LePatron7

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Just to throw in some info from the opposing side, to make this a balanced discussion that presents alternative views..

"“The Disappearing Male” – A Pinch of Science, a Pound of Speculation"

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-disappearing-male-a-pinch-of-science-a-pound-of-speculation/
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail.

Nocebo Effect - a detrimental effect on health produced by psychological or psychosomatic factors such as negative expectations of treatment or prognosis

Med free since 03/21/2014

Offline RogueFarmer

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Certainly at least a percentage of humans are homosexual due to environmental factors. To insinuate that this is a ridiculous notion is of course in itself ridiculous. To suggest that it must always be the case is equally ridiculous.

It's not totally against the interests of this forum because the facts are that we humans are fucked up, in many ways. This is a harsh reality that most everyone knows but most everyone also cannot except in totality. I think that's what this forum is really all about. I was fucked up, I want to get un-fucked. What other kind of person would in our world want to engage in natural carnivorous tendencies?

I'm at least partially with Edwin on the falsification of overpopulation. It is a convenient terminology for those elitists who seek to enslave the world and own everything. The truth is that one person can wield the consumptive power of thousands, even millions. Humans are not intrinsically harmful to the environment, rather it is the predominant collective zeitgeist that is wrecking havoc globally. Human population is immaterial to the fate of the world at present population density and growth. Regardless of population, without a change in the architecture of human way of life, there are no solutions. It is our way of life that is inherently wrong, not our lives themselves.

Offline TylerDurden

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In that case, our "way of life" has been inherently wrong since the Upper Palaeolithic era when we started wiping out the megafauna etc.
"What is the point of growing up If you can't be childish sometimes..." - Tom Baker as Dr Who.

Offline Iguana

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Yes, certainly so or even before,  since we had been already able to make fire at will for some hundreds thousands of years and probably used it to grill food.
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline RogueFarmer

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well to be fair, there have been many societies with varying levels of sustainability, unfortuately unsustainable societies tend to be bristling with economic and military advantages and their unsustainability drives them to conquer their neighbors. or sometimes sustainability is abandoned for "progress" or "higher quality of  life". such atempts offer an insideously palpable yet fleeting advance. the worlds best examples of include almost endless forests of fruit bearing trees in south america and what is still the worlds greatest treasure trove of topsoil in the american great plains, created through milleniums of hunters driving vast herds of bison that were in effect historically unequaled machines who mulched the earth and built the soil. it is not proven  fact that humanity wiped out the megafauna, it may have been climatic conditions although those in turn could have been man made. it is curious however that the megafauna were not wiped out of africa and asia.

Offline RogueFarmer

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Bruce Lipton, author of the biology of belief, claims that the environment is everything. What we are is not truly ourselves, but a reaction to everything else, down to the cellular level in fact. Our cells have no true minds, only doorways in the cell membrane that open and close in response to outer materials and energies. Crazy stuff.

The book is great. Just found out he has a doc on youtube.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjj0xVM4x1I?

Offline goodsamaritan

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Adult survey time.

Last night I was out with friends who were senior managers and consultants in Business Process Outsourcing firms in Manila.

One guy said in his BPO firm some 12% of his male workers were homosexual.

One female said in her BPO firm some 60% of the male workers were homosexual.

They both suggested I make more provincial interviews.
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Offline van

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If you do indeed find statistically high numbers... how will you ever know as to whether or not gays haven't always been around but unwilling to come out of the closet?
  I also don't understand your fascination with all of this.  Why not simply promote a healthy diet to those who you can effect?  Have you looked deeply at your own feelings  towards Gays?  I mean really deeply?

Offline eveheart

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If you propose to link diet and increase in homosexuality, statistics gleaned from interviews about suspected homosexuality cannot prove or disprove your premise.

Find an older statistical study and duplicate its methodology, using the same population groups, the same questions, and the same method of randomization.

If you use a previous study that goes back far enough in time to find a strong dietary trend from then to now in terms of, say, gross sales of non-local packaged foods, you might be able to validate your findings.

Remember, all researchers are subjected to intense scrutiny before their findings are considered valid. That's why I am urging you to learn and apply pristine research methodology and and statistical analysis.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline goodsamaritan

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Just 2 days ago I interviewed a 21 yr old female who grew up in Sampaloc, Manila and in her high school days she estimated that 30-40% of the male students were homosexual. 

All this urban homosexuality coincidences... which luckily this morning Chaya posted on Facebook an article http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2611317/How-trauma-life-passed-SPERM-affecting-mental-health-future-generations.html

And in the comment section, people referring to an older book called "Rock Prophecy" with the 9th chapter Herd Thinners

See discussion here:

http://www.rockprophecy.com/herdthin.html

For the past decade I've tried to get media to report my explanation for "herd thinners" and clear up the confusion about same sex attraction. The theory is presented in Rock Prophecy, a book that media has censored since 1999. The men who control media have let this confusion over same sex attraction persist and cause much suffering. Prejudices could have been alleviated if the herd thinner explanation were known.

When Rock Prophecy was copyrighted in 1995, the World Wide Web was new. I didn't have access to the internet while the first draft of Rock Prophecy was being written. My theory about "herd thinners" was developed in the 1980s. I had never seen anything like it. But in later years, long after the Rock Prophecy book was published, including my "herd thinners" theory, while searching online I located a report of scientific findings that support my theory about "herd thinners," a theory that was copyrighted back in 1995:

"Ward and Weisz (1980) and Dorner, Gotz, and Docke (1983) have shown that, in rats, stress in midpregnancy causes the male offspring to have permanently low free testosterone levels and homosexual behavior. Dorner has reported low free testosterone in human homosexuals, but no other group has yet confirmed this. His group has also reported a higher rate of stress in pregnancy in mothers of homosexuals than in those of controls (Dorner et al. 1983). Low free testosterone has been found in male temporal lobe epileptics in whom altered sexual behavior, including hypo sexuality, is frequently seen."

- Norman Geschwind & Albert Galaburda - Cerebral Lateralization p. 175
New Biological Books, Dec. 1987
"Research in Britain, America, and Germany has all confirmed that a prenatal exposure to deficiency of testosterone increases the likelihood of a man becoming homosexual…Intriguingly, men who were conceived and born in periods of great stress, such as toward the end of World War II, are more often gay than men born at other times. (The stress hormone cortisol is made from the same progenitor as testosterone; perhaps it uses the raw material, leaving less to be made into testosterone.) The same is true of rats: Homosexual behavior is more common in rats whose mothers were stressed during pregnancy…Gays are also more often left-handed than heterosexuals, which makes a sort of sense because handedness is affected by sex hormones during development."

- Matthew Ridley - The Red Queen pp. 264-5
Harper Collins, Apr. 2003
The research cited above from Cerebral Lateralization presents science to suggest that stress produces gay offspring, but it does not theorize that the context for this is as a mechanism by which nature intends homosexuality as a way of "thinning the herd" - reducing the population.

.


But what do we make of Matthew Ridley's work? His book came out in 2003, four years after Rock Prophecy was published. Notice the repetition of points made in my book now copied into Ridley's later book:

1999 Rock Prophecy: "Events like the Great Depression of the 1930s and World War II in the ‘40s produced millions of conceptions under conditions of prolonged stress. Many of the boys conceived during this period grew up to become gay men."
2003 Red Queen:"Men who were conceived and born in periods of great stress, such as toward the end of World War II, are more often gay than men born at other times."

1999 Rock Prophecy: "Fifty percent of twins are going to share the same sexual orientation. Do you know what the concordance is for left handedness? Twelve percent...well under the concordance for homosexuality, which suggests, that there’s actually a larger genetic component to homosexuality than there is to left handedness.”

2003 Red Queen: "Gays are also more often left-handed than heterosexuals, which makes a sort of sense because handedness is affected by sex hormones during development."

In 2005, a decade after Rock Prophecy was copyrighted, I located another article online at viewzone.com and this article is the first I've seen to repeat my theory that premiered in Rock Prophecy back in 1995:

Embryology teaches that early embryos all start out as female. At some point in early gestation, if chromosomes destine the fetus to be male, this female embryo is altered by the genetically programmed addition of certain hormones, called androgens. These androgens, especially testosterone, instruct the embryo to develop male characteristics. In their absence, the embryo continues to develop into a female.
In a paper published almost a quarter of a century ago, a research psychologist at Villanova University was also puzzled about gender. Dr. Ingebog Ward…divided a group of pregnant rats into three groups. Suspecting that something special might be happening in the early stages of pregnancy, she subjected the first group to stress during the first ten days of gestation by irritating the mother rats to bright lights, noise and annoying vibrations. Ten days into a rat's pregnancy corresponds to the first trimester (3 months) of a human pregnancy. The second group was subjected to stress towards the end of their pregnancy, just before birth. The third group was comprised of male offspring from both prenatal stressed mothers and unstressed mothers. These babies were subjected to the same stress producing stimuli.

Dr. Ward then allowed all the males to grow to adulthood without further interference. She then placed each group of males in cages with healthy females to observe their ability and desire to mate with normal adult females. Here's what happened:

Abstract: "Male rats were exposed to prenatal (i.e. before they were born) or postnatal (after they were born) stress, or both. The prenatal stressed males showed low levels of male copulatory behavior and high rates of female lordotic responding. Postnatal stress had no effect. The modifications are attributed to stress-mediated alterations in the ratio of adrenal to gonadal androgens during critical stages of sexual differentiation. Specifically, it appears that stress causes an increase in the weak adrenal androgen, androstendione, from the maternal fetal adrenal cortices, or both, and a concurrent decrease in the potent gonadal androgen, testosterone."
- Parental Stress Feminizes & Demasculizes the Behavior of Males
Science pp. 83-84, January 7, 1972

Her findings showed that if a mother is stressed during the early stages of pregnancy, she will release an adrenaline related hormone into her own bloodstream and that of her unborn baby. This hormone, called androstendione, is structurally similar to testosterone, the male hormone. If the baby carries "XY" chromosomes and is destined to become a male, testosterone needs to be active when the Central Nervous System (including the hypothalamus) is being formed. This is the only way that the CNS "knows" to develop along male lines. Because the stress hormone seems to bind to the receptors that would normally be receiving testosterone, there is the delay or blockage of the effectiveness of testosterone, even if it is plentiful.

In 1972, Dr. Ward had no idea that androstendione in male pregnancies would prevent or inhibit the hypothalamus to develop into a healthy male brain, but this stress-related hormone now appears to do just that. The brain makes its gender commitment very early in development and, once committed to either male or female, it can not change. The interference with testosterone in the later stages of pregnancy, or after birth, does little or nothing to inhibit primary gender development of the other organs of the body.

In Doctor Ward's own words: "...The present data support the hypothesis that exposure of pregnant rats to environmental stressors modifies the normal process of sexual behavior differentiation in male fetuses by decreasing functional testosterone and elevating androstenedione levels during prenatal development. During stress conditions plasma testosterone emanating from the gonads decreases while adrenal androstenedione rises. The molecular structure of the two androgens, being very similar, it is postulated that the two hormones compete for the same receptor sites. Since androstenedione is a less potent androgen than testosterone, the decrease in male copulatory ability and increased lordotic potential seen in the prenatal stressed animals of the present study would be expected. The relative difference in potency between testosterone and androstendione has been repeatedly demonstrated."

It is therefore possible that while the body and organs of an animal can be a "male," the brain can coincidentally be "female." This extreme reaction to maternal stress has a very logical and natural purpose. Sensing that a population is under the stress of crowding or poor living conditions, nature provides this hormonal mechanism as a means to limit population growth and thereby reduce the cause of the stress. Homosexual behavior results in less offspring than heterosexual behavior.

Again, in Doctor Ward's own words: "The resulting alterations in sexual behavior provide the basis for an effective population control mechanism, since offspring so affected would not possess the behavioral repertoire necessary to contribute to population growth. Thus, the environment, by triggering an adrenal stress response, may control the reproductive capacity of successive generations of differentiating fetuses and, thereby, population size."

Prenatal stress in early pregnancy seems to be a rational and plausible explanation for male homosexuality and should be viewed as a natural population limiting phenomenon. Personal choice in homosexuality appears to be an insignificant factor in those offspring who are born with a female hypothalamus, encapsulated in an otherwise normal male body.

--------

Significant research progress... why urban and more homosexual is linked.

Fact: Manila, Manila (the original manila... not Metro Manila which is a conglomeration of many cities) --- is one of the most densely populated cities in the world.

Why would the women in Manila, Manila be stressed during pregnancy?

- over crowding
- poverty
- pollution
- really bad cheapest things passing off as "food".
- no marriage
- no government financial support
- contraceptive mentality
(newly pregnant woman is so stressed because: she mistakenly thought contraception meant no pregnancy possible, she is not sure who the father is, purported father is poor dead beat who has no money, there is no government money to support her, her family is poor, she is afraid of pregnancy and giving birth)


And of course when the child is born and raised.

- really bad cheapest things passing off as "food". (poverty, ignorance, urban)
- all the free government vaccines


So it seems to appear that urban poverty is a death sentence... must escape the cities... not fit for nurturing human life!

Thanks for the link Chaya!
« Last Edit: April 30, 2014, 07:49:57 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline goodsamaritan

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Why many single mothers in the Philippines?
https://ph.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090227120903AA4GerH

Nice discussion here. (2009)
May give you guys an idea where I'm from and what my observations are about.
Why being a playboy in manila is easy.
Why foreign men come here.

But at the same time the combination of grinding urban poverty and pollution and miseducation leads to the current crisis.

----------

Quote
Papars answered 5 years ago
About three years ago, I had done a study on this phenomenon for a major development agency for Asia. The results were truly startling:

1: The number of Filipina single moms is not as high as you claim- 70%. That's completely wrong. The average is about 50% though no exact statistics exist. Usually, while filing a birth certificate, the names of BOTH the parents are mentioned and hence, there exists no known system to identify which child was born of a single mother.

2: The Roman Catholic church in the Philippines is very strong politically and hence, abortion is legally banned in the Philippines. This means, a pregnant woman has to go through the pregnancy and deliver the child, regardless of the consequences to herself and her family or the child itself.

3: Poor education and promotion of methods of contraception such as birth control pills, condoms etc. In Asia, the other nation that does not promote birth control is Indonesia- due to religious reasons. Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam, Myanmar and other ASEAN states have a clear policy on birth control. China and India lead in this sphere, being the world's two most populous countries. China strictly enforces the 1-child per family policy while India, being a democracy, educates its populace about birth control via ads on the TV, radio and other media.

4: Permissive society:. As a result, many mature adolescents are allowed to indulge in whatever activity they want, without any parental control, in most cases. Having a boyfriend or girlfriend soon after attaining puberty are considered as normal due to the permissiveness of the society.

5: Overburdened educational system: The lack of proper educational facilities in the Philippines forces many adolescents to abandon study after a certain number of years. Due to rampant poverty, such persons seek financial independence and end up with love affairs at an immature age.

6: Promiscuity promoted by TV and media: Philippines is the ONLY country in the world where transvestite and gays are allowed to flaunt themselves openly on public TV. Even in other permissive societies such as Sweden or the Netherlands, there are seperate channels for the transgender/ gay and transvestite communities. TV channels in the Philippines also air soap operas where sexual promiscuity is subtly promoted.

-- IT IS MUCH WORSE NOW IN 2014
-- Why I do not let my children watch TV.
-- Why we Filipinos beat you Americans hands down with Gays and Transvestites in the media, you cannot possibly out-gay our media.  We have screaming faggots every day on tri-media.  We are decades ahead of you in gay media propaganda.

7: Weakness of the religious institutions: While the Roman Catholic church is a formidable political force, it has done very little for the overall welfare of the Filipino citizens. Abortion is banned thanks to the church. The same church turns a blind eye to what the Bible would deem as "sexual immorality."

8: Weak family ties: Often, parents ignore what their kids are up to after they have attained a particular age. The child is expected to be independent.

Since you say that 70% of Filipinas you met were single mothers, it's most likely you are living in some place in the Arabian Gulf. That region is a place where more single mothers go for work to give their kids a better life. Incidentally, female kids left alone in the care of grandparents or other relatives are also prone to end up as single mothers.

Several international organizations involved in the development of Asia are concerned about the high ratio of single moms in the Philippines because it threatens to become a socio-economic menace. For example, some single moms may not be able to afford education for some or all of her kids and in most circumstances, such children can take to drug abuse and/ or crime. In view of the existing poverty and low education, such children can become ideal recruits for any terror network- since job opportunities for these citizens will be lower.

Discussing the issue of single moms in the Philippines is still a taboo and many people simply shun even mention of the topic.

---

Quote
Melvin answered 5 years ago

Filipinas nowadays are either not educated or very promiscuous. I see them all the time. The "not educated" group I see back home; all they wanna do is f*ck. They're usually the ones that easily fall for the "hot" boy next door. They get themselves screwed up, and their supposedly "wonderful" boyfriends leave them in the trash. Go figure.

The "very promiscuous" group I see here abroad. They're always on the phone, talking to different guys each and every time. And while they're here they usually have boyfriends on the side even if they're already married back home. They flirt with other guys to get what they want. Heck, when you're so far away from home you need to relieve that itch, would you not? And when they're discovered all hell breaks loose!! A story fitting for MMK. Now they go home as single moms.

Filipinas who are smart, independent, mature, and loyal are very hard to find. So if you think you got one, lucky you.

---

Quote
36 answered 5 years ago
wow, papars, it was an in dept explanation.

additionally, the filipino culture is very compassionate, forgiving to those that have wronged the society, they tend to say , "bahala na God sa kanila maghusga- It's up to God how to judge them"

if this were in islamic culture, family feud would erupt, the guy or girl's life would be in threat. and the law of islam would punish those who indulge in unlawful sex,even if both are unmarried.

but in fairness, i hear that some mothers preferred to be single moms if their husbands are irresponsible drunkards, bad provider, abusive etc.

and on the other hand, because society now has the trend that beauty and youthfulness is very sought after, the males tend to go after the fresh, young and beautiful replacing and leaving the woman who is faded by age.That's the consequence of having big amount of money and not charter as the choice for a mate. Many males by nature who are endowed with fame,power, riches would tend to seek only the young and pretty and dump them when some new ones are discovered.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2014, 07:42:28 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Moderator note: anti-gay is not the policy of this forum's moderation as a whole. GoodSamaritan does not speak for the majority of the membership here, nor any of the other moderators.

Offline goodsamaritan

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My note is that Americans are overly sensitive about any discussion of gays these days. 
We Filipinos are more gay than you... and for a very very long time.

This is why I noted there that:

Quote
6: Promiscuity promoted by TV and media: Philippines is the ONLY country in the world where transvestite and gays are allowed to flaunt themselves openly on public TV. Even in other permissive societies such as Sweden or the Netherlands, there are seperate channels for the transgender/ gay and transvestite communities. TV channels in the Philippines also air soap operas where sexual promiscuity is subtly promoted.

-- IT IS MUCH WORSE NOW IN 2014
-- Why I do not let my children watch TV.
-- Why we Filipinos beat you Americans hands down with Gays and Transvestites in the media, you cannot possibly out-gay our media.  We have screaming faggots every day on tri-media.  We are decades ahead of you in gay media propaganda.

Informal surveys shows in the early 20s generation today in Manila, Manila today shows 30-40% homosexual men... means one cannot be "anti-gay" in Manila.  Homosexuality seems to pre-date American colonization of the Philippines, pre-dates Spanish occupation... because we have old words for gays... today... many words... and our gays have their own language because there are big numbers of them... we have "sward speak". 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swardspeak

But we can and should do scientific investigations into this recent phenomenon of homosexual % explosion.  And we can and should talk about it.  It is a HEALTH ISSUE.  Whether the health deficit was during the pre-natal health of father and mother, or the health of the mother bearing the child, or the health of the children after birth.

And this thread in the pursuit of scientific studies and inquiries is not at all anti-gay.  In fact the recent information brought about by http://www.rockprophecy.com/herdthin.html Rock Prophecy supports the "born gay" mantra of the US political gay movement:

"Prenatal stress in early pregnancy seems to be a rational and plausible explanation for male homosexuality and should be viewed as a natural population limiting phenomenon. Personal choice in homosexuality appears to be an insignificant factor in those offspring who are born with a female hypothalamus, encapsulated in an otherwise normal male body."

And this recent discussion from Rock Prophecy fits neatly into the Pottenger's Cats experiment.
What a coincidence!  ;D

----

And to add another entertaining video to this discussion, here is the TV trailer of the latest homosexual offering on mainstream TV Philippines which started last March 2014: Beki Boxer (homosexual boxer)

Watch and have a laugh.

Beki Boxer: Trailer
« Last Edit: April 30, 2014, 11:41:36 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline goodsamaritan

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2 African Tribes: No Homosexuality, No Masturbation
« Reply #65 on: April 30, 2014, 11:52:50 pm »
Is the reason these people are so pre-occupied with sex as reproduction only is because infant mortality is so high amongst them?  Must study these 2 tribes more.

Where Masturbation and Homosexuality Do Not Exist
Alice Dreger Dec 4 2012, 8:25 AM ET

When sex means reproduction, certain proclivities may simply not be part of cultural models of sexuality.



 Barry and Bonnie Hewlett had been studying the Aka and Ngandu people of central Africa for many years before they began to specifically study the groups' sexuality. As they reported in the journal African Study Monographs, the married couple of anthropologists from Washington State University "decided to systematically study sexual behavior after several campfire discussions with married middle-aged Aka men who mentioned in passing that they had sex three or four times during the night. At first [they] thought it was just men telling their stories, but we talked to women and they verified the men's assertions."

In turning to a dedicated study of sex practices, the Hewletts formally confirmed that the campfire stories were no mere fish tales. Married Aka and Ngandu men and women consistently reported having sex multiple times in a single night. But in the process of verifying this, the Hewletts also incidentally found that homosexuality and masturbation appeared to be foreign to both groups.

 While the Aka and the Ngandu live in the same general region, an area in central Africa marked by tropic forest, their cultures are distinct. The Aka are foragers and, according to the Hewletts, "gender egalitarianism among the Aka is about as pronounced as human societies get." Women may hunt, even on their own, and often control distribution of resources. The Ngandu, by contrast, are slash-and-burn farmers with stable locations and significant gender inequality, with men typically dominating over women.

What the Aka and Ngandu have in common, besides geography, is this: In both cultures, men and women view sexual intercourse as a kind of "work of the night." The purpose of this work is the production of children -- a critical matter in an area with a very high infant mortality rate. Semen is understood by the Aka and Ngandu to be necessary not only to conception, but also to fetal development. A woman who is already pregnant will see having intercourse as contributing to the health of her fetus.

The Aka and Ngandu speak of sex as "searching for children." That's not to say they don't enjoy having sex. Clearly they do. The Hewletts relay a song a group of children invented after stealthily watching two lovers having sex. In the song, the man asks, "How do you want it?" and the woman answers, "Oh, I want it big." The man asks again, and the woman answers, "Oh, I want it long." The song then enters a refrain with the man thrusting and asking his partner, "Did you come?"

But while the individuals the Hewletts interviewed -- like the song -- made it clear that sex is pleasurable for these folks, and something that brings couples closer, they also made clear that babies are the goal of sex. Said one Aka woman, "It is fun to have sex, but it is to look for a child." Meanwhile, a Ngandu woman confessed, "after losing so many infants I lost courage to have sex."

Is the strong cultural focus on sex as a reproductive tool the reason masturbation and homosexual practices seem to be virtually unknown among the Aka and Ngandu? That isn't clear. But the Hewletts did find that their informants -- whom they knew well from years of field work -- "were not aware of these practices, did not have terms for them," and, in the case of the Aka, had a hard time even understanding about what the researchers were asking when they asked about homosexual behaviors.

The Ngandu "were familiar with the concept" of homosexual behavior, "but no word existed for it and they said they did not know of any such relationships in or around the village. Men who had traveled to the capital, Bangui, said it existed in the city and was called 'PD' (French for par derriere or from behind)."

Given all this, the Hewletts conclude, "Homosexuality and masturbation are rare or nonexistent [in these two cultures], not because they are frowned upon or punished, but because they are not part of the cultural models of sexuality in either ethnic group."

The finding with regard to homosexuality is perhaps not that surprising. As the Hewletts note, other researchers have documented cultures where homosexuality appears not to exist. If homosexual orientation has a genetic component to it -- and there is increasing evidence that it does, in many cases -- then it would not be surprising that this complex human trait (one that involves non-procreative efforts) would be found in some populations but not others.

Moreoever, sexual behavior -- whether homosexual, heterosexual, or any other type -- is never simply genetically determined in humans. Humans are born with sexual potentials that will manifest differently in different cultural settings. So, about heterosexuality, the Hewletts note that Western cultures' valuing of sleeping through the night probably limits Western heterosexual couples' interest in having sex multiple times between dusk and dawn. In our culture, the work we have to do by day may overtake "the work of the night."

It's also worth noting that Western science specifically distinguishes between three components of sexuality: desire, behavior, and identity. While the Hewletts' research suggests that homosexual behavior and identity are foreign to the Aka and Ngandu, it's entirely possible that homosexual desire does exist in these groups, at least for some of their members (so to speak). A culture that recognizes such desires -- and especially a culture that does not condemn them -- and especially one that involves large groups where homosexually-inclined people can find each other -- is the type where such desires will become openly apparent.

When I put this to the Hewletts, they replied that indeed, the desire may exist in some individuals in these groups, but we simply do not know. They added that although the Aka and Ngandu live in small groups, "They travel extensively and our studies suggest each person knows about 400-500 individuals," which means that, theoretically, a person with homosexual desires might find another person with the same. But in a culture in which the general idea of a desire doesn't exist, such a desire might remain unarticulated, even if two people who share it find each other.

The absence of masturbation among Aka and Ngandu men and women may be more surprising, and perhaps also harder to explain. Recall that the Hewletts did not find that masturbation is "frowned upon or punished," but rather that there is just no general conception of it. This finding recalls a much-discussed 2010 Behavioral and Brain Sciences paper called "The WEIRDest people in the world?" in which the authors argued that far too many sweeping claims about "human nature" are drawn exclusively from samples of Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, and Democratic (WEIRD) societies.

Studies of small-scale, rural, non-Western cultures like the Aka and Ngandu paint a more complicated picture of human variation. The Hewletts remark that, "the Western cultural emphasis on recreational sex has ... led some researchers to suggest that human sexuality is similar to bonobo apes because they have frequent non-reproductive sex, engage in sex throughout the female cycle, and use sex to reduce social tensions." But, the Hewletts suggest, "The bonobo view may apply to Euro-Americans (plural), but from an Aka or Ngandu viewpoint, sex is linked to reproduction and building a family." Where sex is work, sex may just work differently.

Source: http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/12/where-masturbation-and-homosexuality-do-not-exist/265849/

------------

I found a paper about these tribes.  More scientific detail here.
http://anthro.vancouver.wsu.edu/media/PDF/sex_paper_final_10-2010.pdf

« Last Edit: May 01, 2014, 12:08:52 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline eveheart

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My note is that Americans are overly sensitive about any discussion of gays these days. 

America is too large and too diverse to make such a broad generalization. In my part of the US, where we are typically inclusive of all sexual preferences, there are still many virulently anti-gay people.

Quote
We Filipinos are more gay than you... and for a very very long time.

We Americans didn't know there was a gayness competition! If we were to compete, we would win. But, what would be the point?

What seems anti-gay about this thread to me is the way anecdotes are used to support your hypothesis. To me (an American), your posts would be considered anti-gay because they constitute second-hand gossip - people "reporting" and "tabulating" the gayness of others, and passing that off as a valid statistic. I would consider false statistics as a thinly-disguised form of hatred, like someone posting that most Filipino immigrants are thieves because he interviewed women in the lunchroom who knew of cases where such thievery had occurred. 
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Offline goodsamaritan

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There were many before me who asked why there are so many homosexuals in the Philippines, none got a good answer.

https://www.google.com/search?q=why+so+many+homosexuals+in+philippines+site:answers.yahoo.com&biw=1257&bih=916

No reliable statistics seem to exist.  This informal surveys I ask about % of "bakla" in their high schools. The word "bakla" easily understood amongst us Filipinos.
--------

"Bakla" defined for Americans as found on Page 7 of this 1969 document:

Homosexuality in the Philippines and US (1969)

http://www.egadconnection.org/homosexuality%20in%20the%20philippines%20and%20US-%20Sechrest.pdf

Although written 45 years ago, may this piece of information form a bridge of understanding between my Filipino culture and American culture.  Although I can speak a fairly good amount of English, I live and breath in the Philippines and your concept of "homosexual" and our concept of "bakla" seem to be different.

See clip of page attached to this post:
« Last Edit: May 01, 2014, 01:16:31 am by goodsamaritan »
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Quite the fetish you have here Edwin. Hope it takes you somewhere useful...
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Offline eveheart

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GS, your English is excellent!

Your reference http://www.egadconnection.org/homosexuality%20in%20the%20philippines%20and%20US-%20Sechrest.pdf
Quote
"...bakla... is widely understood and ... used to refer to persons who are homosexual in their behavior. But it is also used to refer to transvestite, to effeminate males, and even to boys who are simply less active than others in games and outdoor activity."
has pretty well established the fact that the Tagalog word bakla cannot be translated to the English word homosexual. Why not use bakla in your posts, since its meaning is awkward to translate and we now know what it means?
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Being a homo is not paleo.
Dont you see, there are these two tribes in africa who are not gay, and love to make babies. They are Correct.

I was raised on soy and quite effeminate when i was a teen. When I stopped soy and went paleo I feel like I matured, but correlation does not imply causation. Other things were going on too that may have manned me up. Although I was effeminate, I wasn't gay,  so maybe your one year old just likes to squeal and run about on his tip toes but its ok, he will still kiss the girls.
That's not paleo.

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I am sure there were plenty of  homosexuals in palaeo times.  Though I suspect that, due to "survival of the fittest", almost all of them would have been expected to be bisexual in behaviour in those days  rather than homosexual, as such.
"What is the point of growing up If you can't be childish sometimes..." - Tom Baker as Dr Who.

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Here is a bit more info regarding the AKA tribe in Africa.

I'm pretty sure their DIET contributes to their very heterosexual nature.  And they can have sex 4 times a night? Whoa. No concept of homosexuality, no concept of masturbation.  Must mean when they start feeling sexy at a very young age, they just get it on heterosexually... no religious taboos, plus the pressure to reproduce because of high infant mortality.  We must also study why they have such high infant mortality.

Diet is originally majority OMNIVOROUS. With a wide variety of INSECTS!  Remember we were talking about INSECTS may be missing from our modern diets?

"The Aka tribe gain sustenance from 63 plant species, 20 insect species, honey from 8 species of bees, and 28 species of game. They also trade with their farmer neighbors for agricultural goods and, more recently, often plant their own small seasonal crops. In 2003, the oral traditions of the Aka were proclaimed one of the Masterpieces of the Oral and Intangible Heritage of Humanity."

"Fathers of the Aka tribe spend more time in close contact to their babies than in any other known society. Aka fathers have their infant within arms reach 47% of the time[citation needed] and make physical contact with them five times as often per day as fathers in other societies.[3] It is believed that this is related to the strong bond between Aka husband and wife." (I must have Aka father hood traits... I just love being with my children... and in fact spend more time with my children than my wife.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aka_people

We can input what WE KNOW as raw paleo dieters:

1. AKA diet is more omnivore paleo, got lots of access to honey, aka diet has LOTS OF INSECTS, eat wide variety of wild game.  GCB says insects may be the missing class of food in most of our modern diets. Speculation: maybe lack of lots of insects as an entire class of food makes more people homosexual.

2. Most likely, these AKA and NGANDU have zero NEANDERTHAL DNA in them.
Speculation: What if it was the neanderthals were the ancient paleo people who had more homosexuality because of the cold climate and less insects in their diets?

My wife works with indigenous tribes in Palawan (Philippines' last frontier) I shared her this article about the 2 tribes and she says she has not seen any "bakla" (philippine concept for homosexual behaviour) in the indigenous tribes she works with.

Below is a picture of an AKA mother and children.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2014, 08:20:06 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline TylerDurden

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This is ridiculous! So we are all in danger of being poofs  if we don't eat insects? And the colder climate does not by itself make one homosexual - OK, maybe it makes people more likely to "seek human warmth" via having sex, but that just means that heteros and homosexuals become more active sexually, they don't switch orientations! Hmm, I always recall how it was mentioned that people have more sex in Siberia - partly because the cold makes one huddle more, plus the constant brownouts/electricity/lack of heating mean people want more sex since no other activity is possible.
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Lol, this is what I think about daily, as I am currently employed at a ranch that raises pastured pork as well as dairy goats for raw milk....and the owners are lesbians, one of which happens to be a gynecologist/obstetrician(western med.) , one of the other ranch hands is a lesbian and another is a girl who "identifies" as a male and is a lesbian..or whatever.  "He" thinks and want other to recognize that "he" is a man to justify that "he" likes chicks and has more masculine inclinations.  And they use artificial insemination  that has been cryogenically frozen , the only male that isn't neutered on the ranch is a buck who has some kind of disease.  I am always on them to have the vet come up and help him or just fuckin kill him already...jesus.  they neuter everything.  they are all short haired and pretty androgynous looking.   what the fuck is wrong with these women who dont love balls?? 

I dont think you can have a strong flock without healthy males and their impact on the herd and also selective breeding, and of course all of this done instinctually by the animals themselves is ideal.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2014, 10:36:01 am by jessica »

 

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