Author Topic: Hard Anopsology question to explain  (Read 10185 times)

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Offline AnopsStudier

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Hard Anopsology question to explain
« on: January 08, 2014, 07:50:52 am »
Okay so....  :P

I have damn right dedicated three years of my life to researching nutrition and various diets.
Recently I stumbled on Anopsology and it makes alot of sense in alot of ways..

My question is about fruit and veggies today.  I live in North America.  More specfically Central Illinois, USA.
Now I want to give anopsology a real effort and I am wondering.. What types of fruits and veggies should I be looking
to start with and continue with?    I know I know.. Its all INSTINCT!  BUT>>>

Modern fruits and vegetables are so modified and altered in comparison to the original fruits and vegetables that existed.
Would it be better to be looking for wild tropical fruits in stores or going for the common oranges and things I already love?  foraging in the woods for berries ?!   etc...

Its hard to make a decision!

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2014, 01:32:42 am »
I mean why are we eating domesticated fruits instead of wild tropical fruits or wild berries etc... did GCB ever explain about the difference between todays fruits and veggies and the ones that originally existed?  Arent we eatin un natural foods that didnt originally exist in nature by instincto eating all these domesticated fruits and veggies?

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2014, 01:44:38 am »
Just do the best you can and try to get the best you can.
If you are getting good results, you are on to something.
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2014, 05:30:40 am »
You can't turn back the clock, but you can anticipate which of our modern foods are most bred for traits like sweetness, size, and appearance. If you want to approximate an ancestral diet environment, try to imagine what would be available during various times of the year and buy that type of food for your selection. I find that farmer's markets have more "primitive" plant foods than supermarkets.
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Offline Iguana

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2014, 06:45:23 am »
Quote from: Eveheart
I find that farmer's markets have more "primitive" plant foods than supermarkets.
Sure. Supermarket fruits are a last resort — and better completely avoided. I think all fruits imported from foreign countries into US are irradiated. But you should be able to find organic fruits from Florida, can't you? Anyway, it's advised to eat a minimum of modern heavily selected fruits and a max of veggies, because vegetables have been selected to keep some taste after being cooked... thus, when raw they  trigger an instinctive stop so strong that it's hard to overeat them.

Quote from: AnopsStudier
did GCB ever explain about the difference between todays fruits and veggies and the ones that originally existed?
Yes, he did,  in great lengths during the seminars. Just talked with him by Skype 10 min ago, but we spoke about poultry and eggs...
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 06:55:54 am by Iguana »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2014, 07:12:30 am »
I guess I still am confused..  Didnt our ancestors originate from a tropical paradise type place?   Now I live in north america and I should be eating fruits and veggies from here?  Im just confused.. maybe i need to read the anopsology book.  I cant find it anywhere!   I mean I crave celery and I crave melons but....  I just went to the store and bought fennel and I loved it!  But before that I had never had fennel.. now i might start craving fennel?  Should I be trying all these new foods or sticking to the crops that grow locally? 
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 07:49:10 am by AnopsStudier »

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2014, 07:44:39 am »
So i should be trying to eat these foods to start my anopsology journey because they are in season in North America?

http://www.eattheseasons.com/

Offline eveheart

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2014, 08:06:45 am »
So i should be trying to eat these foods to start my anopsology journey because they are in season in North America?

http://www.eattheseasons.com/

This list you linked to looks like this:

Quote
FOODS IN SEASON NOW

VEGETABLES

arugula, beet, beet greens, bell peppers, carrots, corn, cucumber, eggplant, garlic, kohlrabi, peas, radishes, rhubarb, zucchini

FRUIT & NUTS

apricots, blackberries, blueberries, cherries, figs, lemons, limes, melon, mulberries, nectarines, passion fruit, peaches, plums, strawberries, tomatoes

MEAT

duck, lamb

FISH & SEAFOOD

lobster

Maybe it's an old list because I seriously doubt that you'd find apricots, bell peppers, cucumber, eggplant, melon, peaches, lamb, and others in the dead of January. Lobster can be had, but it's expensive and local to certain areas, so I would go for any other cool-season fish and seafood from your area.

You have to start somewhere, so why not buy what you can source locally and start with the practice of eating to instinct? Choosing any raw, unprocessed, unseasoned foods is a good start.
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Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2014, 12:42:27 pm »
oops i think that is just a random chart.. my mistake..

try to stay with me here lol..I am not very good at posing my questions in coherent paragraphs  -[

but isn't the whole point of anopsology to optimize your health through instinctive eating through your senses?
I now live in north america but obviously my ancestors didn't come from here.  Humans are obviously natural nomads and explorers.
  I am sure somewhere all of us have ancestors from every continent  that ate "local" in season foods.

  To optimize my "diet" or my "health" or  use my"instinct" does it make more
sense to consume just the food that grows (wild) or is grown and cultivated(farmers markets) in my areas?
Or does it make more sense to use my senses to consume everything around the world and not limit myself?(Fresh,organic foods *even if imported*)
Would an adapted local diet (locavore) make me not have instinctive raving for citrus foods and tropical fruits and what not when they dont grow around my area???
Even though they are in season in other places all around the world? Obviously most of our ancestors were not from where we currently are living.

I mean (hypothetically)
you can use any example.. and keep going down the line of ancestry in your life
so...
if my Father  was born and raised in Greenland and my Mother was born and raised in Brazil (and keep going down the ancestral line) but I lived or was born in North Dakota.  How would one be eating instinctively by limiting him or herself to a local diet?  My body had adapted to living in North Dakota because I was born there?  even though my  ancestors came from all over the world?
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 12:53:20 pm by AnopsStudier »

Offline eveheart

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2014, 02:20:38 pm »
I've heard about the idea that one should eat like one's fore-bearers, but I don't think you're going  back far enough when you look at Greenland and Brazil. The clues about what those distant ancestors ate vary from site to site, but those clues were always things like piles of bones or piles of shells, or hunting implements.  Then, too, they probably at least nibbled on things that grew nearby.

I don't think about it as much as you do. I think you can learn how to eat instinctively just by doing it. The benefit of instinctive eating is the process, not the menu, and it's the process that helps you identify the menu. Because it is a process, you'll learn by doing, and a lot of your questions will be answered by your own experiences.
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Offline Iguana

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2014, 04:31:14 pm »
I guess I still am confused..  Didnt our ancestors originate from a tropical paradise type place?   Now I live in north america and I should be eating fruits and veggies from here?  Im just confused.. maybe i need to read the anopsology book.  I cant find it anywhere!   I mean I crave celery and I crave melons but....  I just went to the store and bought fennel and I loved it!  But before that I had never had fennel.. now i might start craving fennel?  Should I be trying all these new foods or sticking to the crops that grow locally? 

The whole book is freely available on line, translated by I don’t know who :
http://www.reocities.com/HotSprings/7627/ggindex.html
http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/instinctoanopsology/who-has-read-gc-burger%27s-first-book/

The branch of our ancestors most probably split from the chimps, more precisely bonobos, about 6 million year ago. Those are tropical animals.
 
Our cravings are formed by the memory of previous experiences, and since our needs change over time, cravings don’t necessarily reflect our current needs. We shouldn’t rely on them, but rather on our senses of smell and taste.

The concept of eating locally grown food is due to the macrobiotic diet (which is quite opposite to a paleo diet) and it makes no sense.
 http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/instinctoanopsology/eating-locally/

What exactly is meant by « local » should be defined first. All the food we buy from shops or markets has been transported by trucks, ships or airplanes over a certain distance. Furthermore, if you live somewhere away from the shop or market, you have to transport that food from the shop or market to your home.

For example, the next organic food shop is 30 km away from my place. So, I drive 60 km in my car to bring back home a few kg of stuff, which means that the fuel consumption per kg transported is much more than the amount of fuel burned by kg of stuff in the semi-trailer truck that brought 25 tons of food at once over 1000 km.

If you eat seafood while living 400 km away from the nearest coastline and even further from the next fishing harbor, you obviously don’t eat locally.

The problem is that by trying to eat locally, more often than not you restrict you food choice drastically and this doesn't bode well for repairing a body damaged by several years of cooked and junk food.
 

It’s been repeatedly argued between Inger and me:
… the ideology of eating exclusively “local foods” is both irrelevant and undefined (AFAIK it is a part of the macrobiotic diet, which is rather the opposite of a raw paleo diet) and neither you nor anyone else ever provided any clue why my arguments would be invalid. Nevertheless, you constantly bring the same unchanged stance, as if you don’t care of any facts contradicting it.

I don’t say that we shouldn’t eat “local foods” but you have to provide a definition of  what a “local food” is. If it has nothing to do with a radius, please let us know with what it has to do.

I’m very far from wanting to convince anyone that he/she should eat oranges and bananas! Where did you get this idea from?? On the second point, I doubt that many hominids settled in what is now Finland during the lower Paleolithic.   

But we obviously can eat food found around us if we are in a place where some specific food we currently need is available! On the contrary if we are somewhere where no suitable food is to be found, we better eat raw paleo food brought by a modern transportation system rather than cooked junk or else let us die of starvation.  :)
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 04:48:00 pm by Iguana »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2014, 09:41:38 pm »
Yes so what your saying is that our ancestors ate food from all over the world.  Im gonna read the book tonight.
Does GCB explain the difference between us eating modern bred fruits and vegetables in comparison to the wild ones that grew in the wild? (tropics, etc)
 I mean it wouldnt feel optimal to eat Giant Bananas when they dont grow like that in the wild?
How am instinctively eating the right foods when the modern foods didnt even exist in the past?  is this explained in the book?

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2014, 01:26:57 am »
Does a person repair the body through anopsology?   then they become more in touch with there surroundings?  do you need to spend more time outside to be in touch with your sourroundings???  and

Which is the actual book?  there is an interview and practical advice, etc.. are they all part of the book?

« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 01:32:36 am by AnopsStudier »

Offline Iguana

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2014, 03:54:10 am »
Yes so what your saying is that our ancestors ate food from all over the world.  Im gonna read the book tonight.
Does GCB explain the difference between us eating modern bred fruits and vegetables in comparison to the wild ones that grew in the wild? (tropics, etc)
 I mean it wouldnt feel optimal to eat Giant Bananas when they dont grow like that in the wild?
How am instinctively eating the right foods when the modern foods didnt even exist in the past?  is this explained in the book?
The experience and experiments on animals have shown which modern raw food should be most avoided. Wheat and dairy proved to be the most troublesome, followed by corn and to a lesser extend other cereal grains. Modern fruits are to easy too eat and  we should take it into account by limiting their amount eaten to the extremely tasty phase. It’s about the same case with meats from domesticated animals. Wild foods should be preferred in all cases, and if not available, always choose the most rustic varieties.   

Does a person repair the body through anopsology?   then they become more in touch with there surroundings?  do you need to spend more time outside to be in touch with your sourroundings???  and

Which is the actual book?  there is an interview and practical advice, etc.. are they all part of the book?
Yes, all are parts of the book. But strangely the practical advices are translated (quite approximately) from a previous edition and contain some nonsense you will certainly spot.

Yes, the body can repair itself once the illness's cause is removed. Some damages are reversible and some are not, but overall we’ve had some astonishingly good results during 45 years of experimentation with hundreds, maybe a thousand, of persons in Europe. Of course, it’s good to spend as much time outside as possible. There are other causes of troubles and diseases than food, but “anopsology” or “instinctotherapy” is dealing with the nutrition component.

Cheers
Francois
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2014, 04:46:39 am »
thank you Iguana.

How does one go about choosing the most "rustic" types of foods?

Offline Iguana

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2014, 05:07:46 am »
Stuff like that:
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 05:13:05 am by Iguana »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2014, 08:26:31 am »
sorry Iguana lol I dont wanna keep bothering and reiterating the same things but im still confused!

how can i possibly obtain natural wild healthy foods without foraging or hunting and gathering?...
Where am I going to find original undenatured foods at in Central Illinois? 

I mean i still am confused to this as well

Right now I am detoxing from 23 years of cooked and unhealthy foods.  So I am going to eat raw organic foods that I crave but
still these foods are not how they would be found in nature.    They are bigger and brighter and cleaned, etc..
what exactly is an original food?   There are tons of different types of apples and melons and all fruits and veggies!  its confusing!
If i went to the farmers market and bought local foods I would be limiting myself and If i go to the grocery store I am buying foods that have been altered by man..


 I was thinking.. animals in the wild are in tune with there environments and they eat according to the seasons because that is what is outside and around them and required by there bodies to be "in tune with nature"..  but we live in heated homes and most people obviously are not in touch with nature or there natural surroundings so how do we determine what foods are "natural" to our body?


how would we "obtain" these optimal foods for our bodies without being foragers or hunter gatherers that travel the earth?    I all the sudden want berries so I should go and buy berries from the store that are modified by humans?
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 08:40:29 am by AnopsStudier »

Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2014, 01:11:35 pm »
the main question I really am pondering
is How does one decide what the most optimum natural foods are?
Do the fruits and veggies of ancient times still exist in nature today?  Did strawberries and cantaloupes and watermelon and peaches grow in the wild millions of year ago
or are they all just domesticated sub species bred by man?

Offline eveheart

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2014, 01:38:14 pm »
the main question I really am pondering
is How does one decide what the most optimum natural foods are?

You decide continually. For example, domesticated bananas (like Cavendish) are sweeter than most other bananas. All my life, I've eaten Cavendish bananas and thought that was the only banana flavor. Then I started eating instinctively and found that Cavendish are way too sweet. Other times, the whole range of bananas are too sweet or starchy... so that's when I don't eat them at all. I didn't have to do any plant ancestry research to discover which were the domesticated sweet bananas - taste and smell can tell you more than you'd imagine, once you start paying attention.

Now, I know that central Illinois is not full of specialty food stores, so you may have a legitimate question about where to find anything out of American Ordinary in the food markets, but you can learn about the edible plants in your area for the coming spring. In the meantime, get what you can and learn about the regular taste of foods.
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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2014, 02:40:27 pm »
My 2 cents on the banana issue is that I live in a banana country and we have many different types of bananas to choose from.

I'm also privy to how the bananas are grown, if they are wild, organic, or factory farmed.

And also how they are transported... many bananas sold in the big city of Manila are drugged with a ripening agent that is unhealthy... so I have to know where to buy and how to buy bananas that are tree ripened.

Enjoy your continuous exploration and tasting... life is really really good.
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Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2014, 09:41:14 pm »
So if i only have access to local grocery stores I should find the best store with the widest selection of organic produce..
Pick a ton of a produce that looks good and natural and you my instincts to find what best suits me?   

Did all these produce even exist millions of years ago?  did peaches and plums grow in the wild or ate they just sub species of other things?  and does that
even matter when were talking about "original" foods/?



Because real denatured foods would only really exist in the wild

and probably in the jungle and rainforest and vast wilderness
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 09:59:34 pm by AnopsStudier »

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2014, 09:55:57 pm »
You are living in the here and now.
Make use of what you've got.

It is as simple as the pneumonia patient I cured with 10 days of raw paleo diet.
In the first 2 days I tried various fruits on him, no go, he just pooped fruits.
I switched him to raw carnivorous for the next 8 days. 
On the last 2 days I and he went to the fruit stand and I asked to to smell / sniff around the fruits he really wanted and not think about how much anything cost (he was poor).
I saw him smile ear to ear at the ATIS (sugar apple)... that was probably "IT".
So I got him some atis and he ate happily.
Atis are generally organic by default in our country and the season lasts only for 1 month each year.
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Offline AnopsStudier

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2014, 10:16:56 pm »
So it would make sense then.. that when you go through detox and instincto therapy that you will start connecting with the foods you need depending on where you live.

Say I live in illinois and spend a vast amount of my time outside in nature.  I will now most likely to start to choose local native foods as my choices?   
if i moved to where you lived and started "connecting" with nature there.   would I most likely start instinctively choosing native foods to that place?
(after ive detoxed and rid my body of ailments through instincto therapy)


Same thing can be asked of any animal (of the same species)
If i took a chimp from the Rainforest in one location
and moved him (just gonna call him a male)to another location  in the rainforest not known to it...
would it thrive and adjust in this place according to the seasons?
Or would it not "thrive" because its not in its natural habitat


Are we as humans living in our natural habitat?
It seems to me that Africa is where we belong?
Should we be eating foods that come from the rainforest in Africa
or foods that come from the location we our currently living in
and be in touch with the seasons?    Or have we all evolved to
need foods from all over the world because of our mixed ancestory?
my ancestors started in Africa, Migrated all over, ended up in modern Europe
and then recently migrated to North America.???   with all these mixed genes
how do you find what to thrive on?

Personally my fathers most recent ancestors all come from Finland and my mother
is English, irish, and whatever else.  Its just confusing!!!!!!!!!!!
I think i need some clarity on how we are all products of mixed genes
and what diet is optimal for that

I know im going in a circle here. I just have always wondered about original foods and seasonal eating or local eating


sorry for the annoyances!
« Last Edit: January 11, 2014, 12:20:37 am by AnopsStudier »

Offline eveheart

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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2014, 12:36:50 am »
So it would make sense then.. that when you go through detox and instincto therapy that you will start connecting with the foods you need depending on where you live.... (after ive detoxed and rid my body of ailments through instincto therapy)...

I think you're getting the right idea, but I want to share a different perspective on detox. You use the word as a finite period of time, or as a discrete event, but a more practical view of detox is that it happens all the time, it is one of the natural processes in the body. Even something as simple as breathing is a process of detox, which can be seen as ridding the body of waste and foreign products.

One can experience a healing crisis (detox with sensations like diarrhea, skin rash, etc.) when there is a lot of waste or foreign material to be expelled, otherwise, detox happens continuously in every cell of the body.  It is part of the process whereby the body heals itself, so you're on the right track.
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Re: Hard Anopsology question to explain
« Reply #24 on: January 11, 2014, 02:25:51 am »
The out of africa theory is a myth.
Any man can make mistakes, but only an idiot persists in his error. Marcus Tullius Cicero