Author Topic: Instincto Opinion on Water?  (Read 12563 times)

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Offline goodsamaritan

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Instincto Opinion on Water?
« on: July 08, 2010, 11:07:52 pm »
Instincto Opinion on Water?
Which, what, when?
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carnivore

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2010, 12:08:26 am »
Instincto Opinion on Water?
Which, what, when?


When thirsty.  ;)

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2010, 05:10:21 pm »
What kind of water?
Mineral water?
Distilled water?
Coconut water?
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Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2010, 07:14:10 pm »
What kind of water?
Mineral water?
Distilled water?
Coconut water?

Spring water, unpolluted rivers and lakes water, seawater, rainwater, mineral water, coconut water...
Avoid chlorinated tap water.
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2010, 07:35:54 pm »
whoa.... sea water?
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Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2010, 08:25:51 pm »
Yeah, sometimes it's good in limited amounts. We can survive a while on raw fish, plankton and seawater, as shown by Alain Bombard in 1952. Even Alphagruis drinks some seawater when his instinct allows him…

It's funny to notice that people are terrified at the thought of drinking seawater because it is salted although they put salt on almost everything they eat!
 ;)
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2010, 01:02:14 am »
Yeah, sometimes it's good in limited amounts. We can survive a while on raw fish, plankton and seawater, as shown by Alain Bombard in 1952. Even Alphagruis drinks some seawater when his instinct allows him…
 ;)

I drink sometimes (a bit) seawater not because I need water or am thirsty but because I like salty taste.

It's a further nice example of (too) strong encoded attraction (in modern environment) because salt is rare in continental paleonature and yet vital for our organism that manages to excrete only tiny quantities of it when there is no salt added to diet.

Everything is OK with this if there is usually no or little salt added to my diet. If salt is available ad libitum as in modern environment and diet my encoded attraction sorry my "instinct" makes me to overeat it and get eventually sick with high blood pressure.  ;D

Alliesthesy or the fact that salty taste of sea water is more pleasant or attractive when there is no salt added to usual diet does not change this reality.

As to Bombard it is important to know that he got his drinking water not from seawater but from plankton and fish juices which contain almost no salt at all.

Drinking plain seawater when thirsty is a deadly experiment.

Maybe there was an empirical knowledge since paleotimes of the fact that drinking seawater when thirsty is indeed dangerous and completely vain. It can only increase thirst and fasten death by dehydration because of basic osmotic pressure realities.





« Last Edit: July 10, 2010, 01:30:36 am by alphagruis »

Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2010, 02:25:26 am »
Everything is OK with this if there is usually no or little salt added to my diet. If salt is available ad libitum as in modern environment and diet my encoded attraction sorry my "instinct" makes me to overeat it and get eventually sick with high blood pressure.  ;D

Mine does quickly makes me feel I’m ingesting too much salt if I try to drink more than a limited amount of seawater. Said in another way, I could never “overdrink” seawater  to the point I got eventually sick with high blood pressure. On the contrary, I was sick with high blood pressure as a kid when I fed on cooked salted food, bread, dairy and white sugar.

Quote
Alliesthesy or the fact that salty taste of sea water is more pleasant or attractive when there is no salt added to usual diet does not change this reality.

To me “the fact that salty taste of sea water is more pleasant or attractive when there is no salt added to usual diet” seems to mean that a limited intake of salt may be useful. 

Quote
As to Bombard it is important to know that he got his drinking water not from seawater but from plankton and fish juices which contain almost no salt at all.

He got it from rainwater,  seawater and fish juices (see ref. below)

Quote
Drinking plain seawater when thirsty is a deadly experiment.

Sure, and what Bombard showed was that shipwrecked men should not wait until they are extremely thirsty to start drinking seawater. They should start immediately to drink regularly a little bit of seawater instead of waiting to be too thirsty and subsequently drinking a large amount of seawater at once. 

Link of my previous post:
Quote
Dr. Bombard went to an oceanographic institute in Monte Carlo to develop ways for people lost in small boats to survive on even less. He concluded that drinking limited quantities of seawater and fluids pressed from raw fish, and eating fish and plankton would do the job.

http://everything2.com/title/Alain+Bombard
Quote
He quickly discovered two things. One was that drinking small quantities of sea water would help maintain the involuntary sailor. This came as quite a surprise to many, and is still controversial. He based his findings on studies surrounding the safe intake of salt, and found that a pint and a half of sea water (c. 1 litre) would enhance survival, whilst causing little permanent damage to the kidneys. He was careful to point out that this level of consumption was still dangerous, if it formed the only fluid intake for more than a few days, and at most a week.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seawater
Quote
Although it is clear that a human cannot survive on seawater alone, some people claim that one can drink up to two cups a day, mixed with fresh water in a 2:3 ratio, without ill effect. The French physician Alain Bombard claimed to have survived an ocean crossing in a small raft using only seawater and other provisions harvested from the ocean, but the veracity of his findings was challenged. In Kon-Tiki, Thor Heyerdahl reported drinking seawater mixed with fresh in a 40/60% ratio. A few years later another adventurer named William Willis claimed to have drunk two cups of seawater and one cup of fresh per day for 70 days without ill effect when he lost part of his water supply.


Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

alphagruis

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2010, 02:55:58 pm »
Mine does quickly makes me feel I’m ingesting too much salt if I try to drink more than a limited amount of seawater. Said in another way, I could never “overdrink” seawater  to the point I got eventually sick with high blood pressure.

Funny triviality.

Civilized man in front of his computer the whole day long with ad libitum springwater and fruit or food available does of course never "overdrink" sea water. Yet this was never in the past (and won't be in future) the normal condition of real man in nature with frequent situations of intense physical activity, exhaustion, dehydration and thirst and nothing to drink but seawater ;D

Offline GCB

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2010, 09:51:28 pm »

Everything is OK with this if there is usually no or little salt added to my diet. If salt is available ad libitum as in modern environment and diet my encoded attraction sorry my "instinct" makes me to overeat it and get eventually sick with high blood pressure.  ;D


I accumulated too many experiments during forty-five years to be able to believe you. I never saw that a seawater intake, limited by the alliesthesic mechanisms, can produce the least trouble. It seems your concept of instinct and the one I defined and taught diverge.

A second reading of your post gives me the impression that you modulate your self-observations, even that you build them from scratch so as to make them coincide with your theoretical convictions. I for one always gave the lead to facts over the theory. It seems to me that, when we speak about instinct, we do not speak about the same thing. It will be necessary to sort it out. ;)

« Last Edit: July 10, 2010, 10:03:19 pm by GCB »

Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2010, 01:18:25 am »
Alpha, I’m quite sure that if I happen to be lost at sea in a lifeboat with nothing to drink but seawater and if by an incredible luck you were sailing nearby, you would rescue me and offer me plain water… Of course, I would do the same in a converse situation!

Shall we fight aboard next? I doubt very much, especially since you’ve always been a very amiable and generous friend in real life. Ok, you have a personal anger with GCB and you got angry with me as well since I wasn’t convinced by your arguments and I backed GCB stand. But such private hostilities and attacks on personal character are not really interesting for the outsiders.

Therefore, I wish we could continue to have interesting discussions, but in an amiable way. You seem to perceive the “instincto” stand as dogmatic (you frequently use the words “instincto dogma”), but a feel it’s just the opposite. I suppose we got diverging impressions because we were presented the instincto model by different persons (FvB in your case, GCB in my case with practical demonstrations by the then 25 years practicing JDD and his family).

For me, instinctive nutrition is an experiment and a research. I don’t see any dogma in it, it’s an open theory not pretending at all to embody the ultimate truth. Many of your arguments were already incorporated in the way I was acquainted with and understand instinctive nutrition and you are therefore very often beating a dead horse, at least in my eyes.

Civilized man in front of his computer the whole day long with ad libitum springwater and fruit or food available does of course never "overdrink" sea water. Yet this was never in the past (and won't be in future) the normal condition of real man in nature with frequent situations of intense physical activity, exhaustion, dehydration and thirst and nothing to drink but seawater ;D

Humans are mammals. So, it seems logical that we can infer from the actual situation of other mammals and especially primates. Do we actually see many exhausted mammals, particularly monkeys and apes, suffering from intense dehydration and thirst dying from having drunk too much seawater? Are the beaches littered with cadavers of mammals dead from drinking too much seawater?

Seawater has at least a common characteristic with that dangerous chemical dihydrogen monoxide (DHMO). Nevertheless, a limited amount of DHMO is necessary to our health  :P. It is similar for every foodstuff: an adequate amount is useful to our welfare, but too much of it is noxious. 
 ;)
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

alphagruis

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2010, 01:49:55 am »
Alpha, I’m quite sure that if I happen to be lost at sea in a lifeboat with nothing to drink but seawater and if by an incredible luck you were sailing nearby, you would rescue me and offer me plain water… 

As I said Iguana you're right in every respect and all of us agree: instincto is OK  ;D

Moreover I readily concede that you're right in the above quote, too.

I would rescue you and offer you plenty of drinking water...

It's the mandatory behaviour at sea but there is much more. We just can't afford to loose one more instincto. The species is endangered. 

Offline Hanna

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2010, 02:52:07 am »
Iguana, perhaps YOU could tell me when and where this instincto species eating durian, cempedak, jackfruit, banana, dates, safu, avocado... lived? Where was this tropical paradise and when did it exist? Were the instinctos living there apelike or already human? WHO CAN HELP ME with these questions?

Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2010, 02:09:23 pm »
GCB answered this question here:
It is unnecessary that such an environment exists in the form of an original paradise. Our genetics could include the ones of various animals we evolved from and memorize numerous partial situations, by adapting for example the alliesthesic mechanisms during a period to such or such new plant, during another to consumption of the meat of a specific animal, etc. It can thus gather all kinds of data making the organism able to function as well as possible in a global alimentary context, and it is this context which I tried to define empirically. The facts showed the need to exclude cooked, seasoned and crushed food, dairy products and cereal, and to be careful with  artificially selected modern foodstuff (be it fruits, vegetables, or meat of domestic animals).
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline iamthecountry

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2010, 10:13:41 pm »
Yet it is so hard to find unpolluted water.  I'm sure filtering rain water would not be too bad.  I have heard too much water can leach the body of minerals.  Too little could cause the build up of minerals, hence listening to your body.  I have found mineral water to be much more quenching, like perrier or pellegrino. Too bad its expensive.  As far as getting water in food, raw meat, fruit, and milk is great. 

Sean

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Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2013, 11:00:44 pm »
How much water / liquid and in what forms would you say you instincto practitioners might drink on a daily basis on average?

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Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2013, 11:28:36 pm »
Between very little to 7 liters (or perhaps more for some people in some special circumstances), according to the thirst.

7 liters is my personal maximum, the amount I drank at the Irak - Kuwait Safwan border in July by 50°C, 55°C in my truck cabin with roof and doors open. I was eating cooked food by then, in 1977.

Coincidentally, I also happen to drink about 7 liters per day during the hottest days of summer in my first year of instincto, 10 years later. Then I drank a lot for about the next couple of decades , supposedly still detoxing. Almost suddenly, this constant thirst ceased a few years ago and now I drink very little,  most of the time.

We drink  water — and coconut water when available. Sometimes palm sap. 

« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 04:27:41 am by TylerDurden »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline jessica

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2013, 11:33:01 pm »
daboss, do you prefer distilled or is that the best quality you can buy?  I would suggest you seriously consider buying spring water, even  RO water is less harmful then distilled, although a far cry from spring.  Distilled is generally for sterility purposes only, not for consumption.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 02:19:56 am by TylerDurden »

Offline LePatron7

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2013, 12:11:31 am »
I personally feel distilled water is the best water you can drink. I've drank spring, and my home made steam distilled water. I prefer distilled.
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail.

Nocebo Effect - a detrimental effect on health produced by psychological or psychosomatic factors such as negative expectations of treatment or prognosis

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2013, 01:29:48 am »
I am about to purchase my second distiller.  Have tried most types, RO, spring, Kagen...  I especially like the idea of adding ionic sea minerals thus creating a water that it's minerals are ionic based and balanced as the sea, as opposed to whatever random minerals are in the ground, as example as with spring water. 

Offline dogman333

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2013, 02:56:40 am »
On the water thing --- I just purchase a water structuring unit for the whole house.

 I like the idea of it. I can't say I've noticed any health benefits since I didn't have any problems to start with. Supposedly it returns water to a natural, 'living' state as it would have been after tumbling over rocks in nature.
Here's a clip that that shows the energy:  http://youtu.be/LD_9BvdpguQ

They have impressive results with plants as in this strawberry field video:  http://youtu.be/mkC02rUS8tU
This is my favorite video testimonial:  http://youtu.be/GzykZd6jKfQ

Has anyone had any experience with water structuring?

I bought mine from www.greenfieldnaturals.com/





Offline AlphaCog

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2013, 10:54:16 pm »
On the water thing --- I just purchase a water structuring unit for the whole house.

 I like the idea of it. I can't say I've noticed any health benefits since I didn't have any problems to start with. Supposedly it returns water to a natural, 'living' state as it would have been after tumbling over rocks in nature.
Here's a clip that that shows the energy:  http://youtu.be/LD_9BvdpguQ

They have impressive results with plants as in this strawberry field video:  http://youtu.be/mkC02rUS8tU
This is my favorite video testimonial:  http://youtu.be/GzykZd6jKfQ

Has anyone had any experience with water structuring?

I bought mine from www.greenfieldnaturals.com/

Have you tried pouring the structured water into a tea bag? Supposedly structured water has a lower surface tension and could dissolve the tea without the water being boiled.

Offline Iguana

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2013, 11:37:19 pm »
I’m afraid this is a scam, pseudoscience in its purest state. There is thorough debunking here
http://www.chem1.com/CQ/clusqk.html
And plenty show up elsewhere when typing “structured water scam” on Google, such as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexagonal_water
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline AlphaCog

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2013, 10:35:24 am »
I'm not an expert on water, just posting what I found:

Water ran through vortex and magnets exhibit special qualities:
http://www.subtleenergies.com/ormus/tw/m-seeps.htm

Reason for vortex is based on the works of Viktor Schauberger:
Viktor Schauberger - Comprehend and Copy Nature

« Last Edit: June 07, 2013, 10:41:02 am by AlphaCog »

Offline svrn

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Re: Instincto Opinion on Water?
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2013, 01:50:08 am »
Yeah, sometimes it's good in limited amounts. We can survive a while on raw fish, plankton and seawater, as shown by Alain Bombard in 1952. Even Alphagruis drinks some seawater when his instinct allows him…

It's funny to notice that people are terrified at the thought of drinking seawater because it is salted although they put salt on almost everything they eat!
 ;)

i knew a guy who survived for years on nothing but a steady diet of ramen, diet sodas, and crack cocaine....
i guess thats proof these things are safe.

as far as distilled water, thats probably the worst most hungry water you can drink. A lot of so called spring water is bullshit just like so many other things in stores today.

findaspring.com

check that out and start harvesting your own real spring water for free.
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