Author Topic: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises  (Read 101518 times)

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Offline ezekiel

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #75 on: November 14, 2010, 03:34:47 pm »
Sully, do it and you'll see  8)
Ohh, I believe you.  ;) They look tough!

@pioneer
I agree with you in some aspect, but I DON"T do situps and have defined abdominals. I climb trees, carry things, adventure in th woods, make spears, and do martial arts, and that's pretty much it, (besides random things like playing with my nephews or sisters dog etc.)

You say that a woman in paleo days would only care for a man that has a functional body and can provide food etc. Not a model doing sit-ups etc.
I agree. Its about a functional body, and not what body type is popular in today's media.

I don't promote getting as lean as possible or trying to burn off extra calories with workouts.
With my exercises I try to just mimic what I would be doing in the wild. Its meant to build a strong functional body, not to look like a model.


My body is highly functional, so (having a highly functional body) it's not by coincidence that I am leaner than the average american male my age, and that I have more muscle.


So you see, a body able to provide for a woman in the wild, is a functional body, and in turn a leaner stronger body than the average american.


Offline ezekiel

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #76 on: November 14, 2010, 03:43:59 pm »
I don't see the point of the debate.

Being overweight does not make you functional enough to live in the wild.

And being underweight does not make you functional enough to live in the wild.

It's quite obvious.


Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #77 on: November 15, 2010, 03:37:18 am »
Sully, I agree with you and I am not singling you out, you're not the only one who spoke about being lean. There really is no debate about it either. Just trying to get rid of some of this lean dogma. There are plenty of lean athletes out there who are not really healthy, I've worked with them. Hell, I was one. I always was lean, but was not in good health at one point in my life. Health is about vitality and functionality, as we've already said.
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Offline ezekiel

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #78 on: November 15, 2010, 04:33:47 am »
Just trying to get rid of some of this lean dogma.
Yes. It's good to get rid of this dogma. But I also noticed that some people in the raw community advocate a little too much fat on ones body. I think AV does that sometimes but I am not sure.

 Hey, even as lean as Bruce Lee was. In one of his books it said he thought it was very imoprtant to have a thin layer of body fat.

 Bruce Lee wasn't eating raw paleo, but it's interesting that it said he was fond of steaks. And even at a time ate liver once every week.\


Edit: Oh and he hated cheese. Haha. He probably wasn't used to it.


Offline yuli

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #79 on: November 15, 2010, 05:23:20 am »
Do at least 300 hindu squats in a raw and you'll feel the PAIN....

I know, first time I tried it I could not walk down the stairs, I was stuck upstairs for the day, lol
thats why the reason I didn't do this intense exercise right after a week break from exercise  ;)

Listen, why dont you analyze my post with a little more respect as it seems you took me out of context. And bro, Im leaner than you so me getting fat is not a factor, seems that you'd rather try to insult than have a serious conversation...

I'm sure he was joking not trying to insult you... I don't think anyone here is against people having a good layer of fat especially as some paleos obviously did, as we all know dependent on so many factors, location, diet (paleo diets can vary greatly on location), genes etc. Perhaps that part of the story was not mentioned because we are interested in achieving a certain physique and we project how we want to look to our posts, I am sure thats why.

...You think the women even cared whether the males had six packs or not? Plain and simple, women cared about which man could bring home the bacon, in which case, the kill. Which male could build the best shelter and provide for his young. Which male could perform better.

Thats true a man had to be functional in those times. But how do you know women didn't care how he looked, do you know what went through their minds, was there no time perhaps women were laughing about their men while they were hunting, hee hee...
I am sure they thought about survival a lot, but if they had time to paint in caves or do dancing and singing, they probably had time to make fun of each other, and look at each others appearances...maybe someone had a funny nose, you think they would not be able to think that...
And among men too, I am sure if they competed for their women they compared each other, in how they hunt, how effective they are, maybe how good they dance, maybe how big their balls are! lol...sorry but I think they had those emotions too.
Sure they wern't checking out their abs in the mirror saying "hmm I gotta work on those more" but there was probably a degree of vanity...
Even animals like birds display vanity, for example the peacocks flashing their tails (which have nothing to do with survival), paleo humans were probably capable of similar "displays" seeing as their brains were even more developed...

Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #80 on: November 15, 2010, 01:42:38 pm »
Wow, you make a really good points. I agree with you. I just am basically referring to todays society and it's sick views on what it is to be beautiful. In the end all that really matters is one's health.
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Offline greywolve

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #81 on: November 20, 2010, 10:17:38 pm »
i agree...

but hey why not be healthy, be functionally strong, and if you want do some exercise to look good as well.

i really feel plenty of primitive people would be quite lean and muscular depending on the season... hunting without guns is tough work i'd imagine and a good workout.

Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #82 on: November 20, 2010, 11:15:44 pm »
i agree...

but hey why not be healthy, be functionally strong, and if you want do some exercise to look good as well.

i really feel plenty of primitive people would be quite lean and muscular depending on the season... hunting without guns is tough work i'd imagine and a good workout.

Good points. When one really studies primordial man and tribes, one realizes that they did not care about their physiques, they tried to store as much energy as possible because food was relatively scarce. Same thing happens in the wild, the alpha wolf eats first and eats the most. Having fat does not correlate with being unhealthy. Being overly fat is surely unhealthy, but that was rare in primitive days.

The only reason why we have to watch what we eat today is because food is so available to us in any amount and any kind.

As for the seasons, you are exactly correct, however I am learning it is actually flipped from what everyone thinks. We actually eat the most in the summer, store the most fat and muscle to get ready for winter. During summer, food is more abundant with fruit and vegetables whereas in the winter paleo man survived almost 100% on animal. Because more carbohydrates are available in the summer, the primitive human body was primed for insulin increases and fat/ muscle storage. Paleo man also generally got the least sleep (6-9hrs) in the summer, and the most sleep (9-14hrs) in the winter. Therefore, the kind of hibernation we had created an environment where our metabolism was slowed and we did not need as much food. By January our fat stores were very depleted and we were very lean. Our leanest was right before spring when food was starting to get abundant again. Then we were in fat and muscle storing mode again.

You see, we are much like bears who store fat in the summer for the winter. When one knows about honest paleolithic life it baffles him/her that this nonsense of being lean means being healthy. This information is just the same fat phobic low fat nonsense the media spews out to young girls who inevitably become anorexic.

surely everyone wants to be lean, but it really is just for aesthetic reasons.

If being lean was the healthiest, then why do overweight people have lower mortality rates. Yep, thats right, people with slightly higher BMIs have the lowest mortality rates whereas people with the lowest BMI have the highest mortality rates and obese people are somewhere in the middle. This baffles people, but it is true, lower BMI's correlate with death. Don't believe me? Just look at every frail alzheimers or cancer patient.
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke

"There is a lot of pressure to be sexualized but not to actually be sexual."
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Offline miles

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #83 on: November 21, 2010, 05:51:25 am »
surely everyone wants to be lean, but it really is just for aesthetic reasons.

If that's the case, don't you think it's for a reason? Just like with taste/smell/touch etc.
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Offline KD

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #84 on: November 21, 2010, 10:37:39 am »
heres a jackpot of Native American images.

http://www.facebook.com/photos.php?id=10150102703945578



Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #85 on: November 22, 2010, 01:15:44 am »
If that's the case, don't you think it's for a reason? Just like with taste/smell/touch etc.

I know it is a reason, sure physical attraction, but that is not my point. I am speaking purely health, and it is not necessarily healthier to be lean, nor unhealthy to have some fat; simple concept.
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke

"There is a lot of pressure to be sexualized but not to actually be sexual."
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Offline yuli

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #86 on: November 22, 2010, 01:57:25 am »
heres a jackpot of Native American images.

http://www.facebook.com/photos.php?id=10150102703945578
......

Nice collection of photos there!

Look at this guy here, the hairstyle, earnings and everything, so cool!



And this guy... he's a good looking man, check out his 'sneakers' too, I want those:



Most of the Natives look of average weight, some being thinner some being bigger, there is no perfect physique as there will always be these natural variations.

Offline KD

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #87 on: November 22, 2010, 02:04:00 am »
I know it is a reason, sure physical attraction, but that is not my point. I am speaking purely health, and it is not necessarily healthier to be lean, nor unhealthy to have some fat; simple concept.

right, but given that, this subject had a focus, and you presented something as if people were misinterpreting health based on some modern societal concept when all the records and shared info speak otherwise. In a sense, you are giving value to the fat = healthy concept largely on the merits of it being non-conventional thinking, which it isn't. Even if having more fat than HGs was more beneficial to health today, this does not mean it was prized then or in the paleolithic or any other thing you are associating with it. To use this to say that excess body fat is attractive or prized in nature is even more of a stretch. There is no indicator this is true. When it comes down to it if this is your main point, I think you should just accept that people here have probably heard this before and can address the physiques of HGs non superficially.


Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #88 on: November 22, 2010, 08:31:58 am »
To use this to say that excess body fat is attractive or prized in nature is even more of a stretch. There is no indicator this is true. When it comes down to it if this is your main point, I think you should just accept that people here have probably heard this before and can address the physiques of HGs non superficially.



I'm just curious how you think I said excess bodyfat was prized or attractive, when did I say this? Am I trying to prove this? No! I am trying to give a simple concept that people cant seem to understand. People ate when they were hungry, stopped when they were full and if necessary ate more to store more for famine. Are you once again trying to spew that nonsense that being fat is unhealthy? Once again, being overly fat is not healthy, but to be fat to the point where you cant see your abs is fine.



"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke

"There is a lot of pressure to be sexualized but not to actually be sexual."
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Offline KD

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #89 on: November 22, 2010, 08:53:33 am »
I'm just curious how you think I said excess bodyfat was prized or attractive, when did I say this? Am I trying to prove this? No! I am trying to give a simple concept that people cant seem to understand. People ate when they were hungry, stopped when they were full and if necessary ate more to store more for famine.

hmm, this is unnecessarily aggressive and incorrect. I've already acknowledged that being fat in modern circumstances could be healthier, but that doesn't mean that pursuing being lean is strictly tied to being fashionable, or that being fashionable is somehow not paleo or also an inefficient body type in nature. Appearance and fashion are an intrinsic part of human culture and certain body types and features are sought after independent of cultural distortions, even if they might vary from culture to culture. It might be a simple concept that you are saying, but you can't make those assumptions about how people ate and lived, particularly if it doesn't match up with the evidence.

Im just the kind of person who likes to shake things up a bit and tell it how it is. Everyone needs to reread my post. It is obvious that I was trying to say being real lean does not correlate with being healthy, nor does being fat necessarily correlate with being unhealthy.

And don't try to say that my post was not relevent to this topic. The post is hunter-gatherer physiques and what they did instead of modern exercises. Do you guys actually think the ideal hunter gatherer physique was to be lean? Are you kidding me? They wanted to store as much energy as possible.

[...]You think the women even cared whether the males had six packs or not? Plain and simple, women cared about which man could bring home the bacon, in which case, the kill. Which male could build the best shelter and provide for his young. Which male could perform better.


Much of what you say are just assumptions based on your acceptance that being lean is somehow not practical and superficial in nature, so that is largely why you are getting flak for 'shaking things up' in this thread because that is just an not accurate start point. The idea that having more than accepted levels of bodyfat for health is not so ultimately groundbreaking or even so undeniably correct as to be so adamant about it when people were merely discussing HG physiques..

Are you once again trying to spew that nonsense that being fat is unhealthy? Once again, being overly fat is not healthy, but to be fat to the point where you cant see your abs is fine.
not sure if you meant to target this towards me as this was my last post here:

heh, yeah well the sentiment in what was said was fine, but I mean, the whole purpose of this thread was that HG's had incredible physiques through their fairly natural biological diet and activity. Modern people - while divorced form some of the advantages of HGs, have control over a ton of other variables like choice in diet and movement as well as access to a variety of technologies and ways of thinking. No one has to do anything or to compete with anyone, but certain results will correlate with certain habits. This doesn't seem to necessitate having a judgment on which build is best, just a cause and effect.

I'm certainly not in any race to lose the remaining body fat I have. I've had less in the past and it wasn't healthy as per my nutritional program I was on. I think most people won't associate low bf with health in all instances. At the moment its not been determined by myself whether having lower or high fat percentage is to my best health interests, as i'm inclined to appreciate either stance, but honestly it effects my eating or exercise habit not at all as you say because I'm content. If I wasn't then I would asses my diet/exercise/lifestyle etc...

as for paleo folks I do not know about what builds they preferred, but I think what AV and others refer to as 'fashion thin' is different from the trim and relatively healthy bodies of the HG's discussed or shown here. You'd have to ask a Masai whether they preferred a junk in the trunk Inuit or a playboy centerfold. Plus I'm pretty sure that the gaining bodyfat thing is seen as a temporary tool for modern peoples problems rather then a long term requirement for health (beyond the actual accepted lows for %).
« Last Edit: November 22, 2010, 09:02:08 am by KD »

Offline pioneer

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #90 on: November 22, 2010, 11:23:23 pm »
No, Im not targeting my replies to only you, but everyone.
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke

"There is a lot of pressure to be sexualized but not to actually be sexual."
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Offline ezekiel

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #91 on: December 04, 2010, 06:17:40 am »
pretty cool pic


Offline miles

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #92 on: December 04, 2010, 06:05:00 pm »
Why do you think they're wearing loin cloths?
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Offline ezekiel

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #94 on: December 05, 2010, 05:50:04 am »
Why do you think they're wearing loin cloths?
I don't know, maybe European influence? Photo doeasn't look that old.

Offline raw

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Re: Hunter Gatherer Physiques and What They Did Instead of Modern Exercises
« Reply #95 on: December 06, 2010, 01:58:46 am »
bugs or country chickens

 

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