Author Topic: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.  (Read 5964 times)

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Offline Projectile Vomit

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2013, 09:14:43 pm »
Wow, what a gem of a find! Doesn't say anything that people here haven't been saying for years, but having a peer-reviewed paper in a well-respected journal saying the same thing is vindicating. The article Jessica linked to was in Science, but the original article is in The American Journal of Cardiovascular Disease. For those who are interested, you can read the article's abstract here, the full text of the article here and download it as a PDF here.

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2013, 09:51:47 pm »
Since this seems too important, let's save this pdf here.

Am J Cardiovasc Dis 2013;3(1):17-26
www.AJCD.us /ISSN:2160-200X/AJCD1211005
Review Article
Interaction between sphingomyelin and oxysterols
contributes to atherosclerosis and sudden death
Fred A Kummerow
Burnsides Research Laboratory, Department of Comparative Biosciences, College of Veterinary Medicine, Univer-
sity of Illinois, 1208 W. Pennsylvania Avenue, Urbana, IL 61801, USA
Received November 26, 2012; Accepted January 23, 2013; Epub February 17, 2013; Published February 27,
2013
Abstract: Despite major public health efforts, coronary heart disease continues to be the leading cause of death in
the United States. Oxidized lipids contribute to heart disease both by increasing deposition of calcium on the arte-
rial wall, a major hallmark of atherosclerosis, and by interrupting blood flow, a major contributor to heart attack and
sudden death. Oxidized cholesterol (oxysterols) enhances the production of sphingomyelin, a phospholipid found
in the cellular membranes of the coronary artery. This increases the sphingomyelin content in the cell membrane,
which in turn enhances the interaction between the membrane and ionic calcium (Ca2+), thereby increasing the risk
of arterial calcification. Patients undergoing bypass surgery had greater concentrations of oxysterols in their plasma
than cardiac catheterized controls with no stenosis, and had five times more sphingomyelin in their arteries than
in the artery of the placenta of a newborn. The oxysterols found in the plasma of these patients were also found in
the plasma of rabbits that had been fed oxidized cholesterol and in frying fats and powdered egg yolk intended for
human consumption. Together these findings suggest that oxysterols found in the diet are absorbed and contribute
to arterial calcification. Oxidized low-density lipoprotein (OxLDL) further contributes to heart disease by increasing
the synthesis of thromboxane in platelets, which increases blood clotting. Cigarette smoke and trans fatty acids,
found in partially hydrogenated soybean oil, both inhibit the synthesis of prostacyclin, which inhibits blood clotting.
By increasing the ratio of thromboxane to prostacyclin, these factors interact to interrupt blood flow, thereby contrib-
uting to heart attack and sudden death. Levels of oxysterols and OxLDL increase primarily as a result of three diet or
lifestyle factors: the consumption of oxysterols from commercially fried foods such as fried chicken, fish, and french
fries; oxidation of cholesterol in vivo driven by consumption of excess polyunsaturated fatty acids from vegetable
oils; and cigarette smoking. Along with the consumption of trans fatty acids from partially hydrogenated vegetable
oil, these diet and lifestyle factors likely underlie the persistent national burden of heart disease.
Keywords: Sphingomyelin, oxysterols, thromboxane, prostacyclin, trans fatty acids, calcium, stenosis
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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2013, 11:45:39 pm »
Kummerow lost me when he blames cigarette smoking for heart disease.

This is political correctness, in my book corruption and makes his findings suspect.

Offline ys

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2013, 12:35:15 am »
Quote
article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked

This is the wrong conclusion based on this article.

The article is talking about oxidized LDL which is not a dietary cholesterol.  LDL is only being produce by liver and is never ingested.

The article does not say what happens when you heat dietary cholesterol.  It is saying that cholesterol is getting oxidizes already inside the body.

The first sentence is really confusing and the article does not explain it either.

Quote
unless that cholesterol is unnaturally oxidized (by frying foods in reused oil, eating lots of polyunsaturated fats, or smoking).

If you fry potatoes in vegetable oil you will ingest 0 cholesterol.

The only coherent conclusion you can make is "frying foods in reused oil, eating lots of polyunsaturated fats, or smoking" is bad for your health.  It says absolutely nothing that cooked cholesterol is bad for your health.

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2013, 03:31:55 am »
Uhm yes it does, it's about oxysterols which can be exogenous as well as endogenous.
The effect of oxidized LDL is additionally investigated.

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2013, 10:35:28 am »
Kummerow lost me when he blames cigarette smoking for heart disease.

This is political correctness, in my book corruption and makes his findings suspect.

Nicotine is a stimulant.  Generally stimulants are not known for their positive effects on the heart.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2013, 07:43:22 pm »
It's unsurprising that cigarette-smoking is considered to be as bad as eating cooked food. After all, cigarette-smoke contains heterocyclic amines and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, both of them toxins that also appear in cooked foods and car-exhaust fumes.
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Offline ys

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2013, 02:04:42 am »
Quote
Uhm yes it does, it's about oxysterols which can be exogenous as well as endogenous.
The effect of oxidized LDL is additionally investigated.

That's your bias talking.

If you look at the article closely, there is not a single hint saying people should be eating uncooked meat.

He is saying "dietary cholesterol is good for your heart -- unless that cholesterol is unnaturally oxidized".  According to him unnatural oxidation only happens when "frying foods in reused oil".

His only recommendation is to avoid frying anything in reused oil, don't eat lots of PUFA, and do not smoke.  He does not give any other dietary recommendations.  This is very old news.  Paleohacks endorse the same view as well as many other cooked paleo gurus.

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2013, 05:10:41 am »
I guess you know better than someone researching this stuff for the past 60+ years :)

Cholesterol is extremely fragile and will oxidize just left out on the air and sun. You don't even need to cook it.
But even oxidized cholesterol has it's functions in the body.
For example how is vitamin D made? It starts by UVB oxidizing cholesterol in the skin to oxysterol..

But then there are different types of oxysterols, and obviously frying foods will produce the worst stuff and have the strongest link to disease. Or are you saying you have the facts that less cooked foods, like slow-cooked for example will also have a huge impact on health?

Probably he was specifically referring to oxycholesterol: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxycholesterol

Offline ys

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2013, 05:20:42 am »
No, all I'm saying is this article does not say cooked cholesterol is bad for you.

The summary of the article is too generic.

It equally applies to both raw paleo and cooked paleo since it specifically talks about not frying in used oil, limiting PUFA, and quit smoking.

Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2013, 05:47:53 am »
It equally applies to both raw paleo and cooked paleo since it specifically talks about not frying in used oil, limiting PUFA, and quit smoking.
Yeah no surprise there
Quote
I wish to thank Dr. Chris Masterjohn, Ph.D. for his helpful insight and editing of the text...
This work was supported by funding from The Weston A. Price Foundation and the Verna L. and John R. Hildebrand Foundation.
The contribution of the article is mainly the link between excess oxysterols, sphingomyelin and calcium to atherosclerosis.

Offline Wai Kai Zen

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2013, 07:02:21 am »
raw cholesterol is way better than cooked, think we all agree on that.
i do wonder why cooked meat/eggs taste so good, could someone explain this to me?
 8)
Reminder to myself:
Search for truth, not dogma.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2013, 09:16:33 pm »
raw cholesterol is way better than cooked, think we all agree on that.
i do wonder why cooked meat/eggs taste so good, could someone explain this to me?
 8)
  It is due to addictive opioids created by cooking which influence the brain:-
http://www.waiworld.com/waisays/diseases/dis-ADHD.html
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Offline ys

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2013, 12:05:33 am »
Quote
The contribution of the article is mainly the link between excess oxysterols, sphingomyelin and calcium to atherosclerosis.

I'm not disputing that.  I also do not dispute that raw cholesterol is better than cooked in any possible way.

All I am saying is the name of this thread does not reflect what's in the article.

It does not say or imply anywhere in the article that "dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked".

What's more, this guy is probably never even looked at raw paleo diet in any of his research.


Offline aLptHW4k4y

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Re: article: dietary cholesterol good, as long as its not cooked.
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2013, 01:55:11 am »
Yes I agree. When it comes to the cooking part, it's not so trivial and with the facts we have we can only say with confidence that fried cholesterol is not good. But you don't need much brain to figure out that the less cooked the less oxysterols and hence safer. I assume they are putting low cooked cholesterol in the "safe" dietary cholesterol, since raw cholesterol means raw animal foods and we all know how that works in the general public. So perhaps the title should be changed to "dietary cholesterol good, as long as not fried" in order to match the original article. Or it can stay as is, since we're smart enough to derive that raw cholesterol is the best, and also not afraid of raw animals.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 02:05:23 am by aLptHW4k4y »

 

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