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Messages - JeuneKoq

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401
Hot Topics / Re: Cooking
« on: November 03, 2014, 12:18:47 am »
Cro-magnon's brain was bigger:
http://phys.org/news187877156.html

"Although scientists don’t know for sure why our overall brains are shrinking, some researchers hypothesize that our brains are becoming more efficient as they grow smaller."
LOL. Extra LOL  ;D Just like modern technology, I guess  ;)

"One idea is that Cro Magnons needed large skulls because of the difficulty in chewing their food, which included lots of meat such as rabbits, foxes, and horses. Since our food has become easier to eat, we don’t need such large skulls or jaws."



402
Hot Topics / Re: Cooking
« on: November 03, 2014, 12:03:06 am »
Not that I believe that just eating meat led to bigger brains. I just think it allowed our ancestors to have diminished jaws  instead of  larger, gorilla-like ones, thus permitting extra brain-growth to occur, rather than being the direct cause of said brain-growth.
It is totally wrong to simply link diminishing jaws with growing brains. If you compare Cro-magnon with modern men, the former had bigger jaws...and bigger brains!! Our jaws diminished when we started to replace raw, tough foods like meat and tubers with mushy, soft cooked foods. That's also the reason our brain size diminished, but I guess we already know that.

403
Off Topic / Re: A sad riposte to the depopulation conspiracists here
« on: October 30, 2014, 04:18:55 am »
Earlier when I was talking about "love thy neighbour" as being a necessary survival trait, I should've specified that I was referring more particularly to the "associate with your neighbour" side of it. So not the philosophical, formulated thought of "love will save us all!" way.
However let us be reminded that in nature, forming "alliances" as a survival, and socially-boosting strategy, happens in a way that has little to do with conscious act. What I mean by this is that the friendship feeling one has for another person, or love, is an unconscious expression of this "associate with thy neighbour" survival instinct. At least in part of it.

So the love you share with your family, and with your friends, has something to do with your unconscious mind forging bonds with other beings to ensure your own survival, through collaboration and mutual assistance. There's more to it in the deep, but at least that's one side of it.

404
Off Topic / Re: A sad riposte to the depopulation conspiracists here
« on: October 29, 2014, 07:49:24 pm »
Survival of the strongest may be a more appropriate phrase. Male lions incidentally routinely kill the offspring of other defeated  male lions in order to get the female lions pregnant with their own offspring. They also have  rivalries within the group  where they kick out the losers from their  group.

I see what you mean. In some species (if not most), being the strongest assures you high status within the group, therefor your chances of matting and passing on your genes are higher, especially when part of a specie where only the Alpha is allowed to reproduce. This is the case for wolfs. But how do humans determine their Alpha male/female?

According to wikipedia, on Alpha male/female : "Alphas may achieve their status by means of superior physical prowess and/or through social efforts and building alliances within the group."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_(ethology)

So there is strength, but there's also social bonding, alliances, number, "love thy neighbour".

Given the fact that composing a clear picture of human's natural, intuitive social ranking system is a nearly impossible task, I give you instead some portraits of Alpha individuals in species close to ours, and the way these individual reach this position:

-The chimpanzees:
"The alpha male is the highest-ranking male that controls the group and maintains order during disputes. In chimpanzee society, the 'dominant male' sometimes is not the largest or strongest male but rather the most manipulative and political male that can influence the goings on within a group. Male chimpanzees typically attain dominance by cultivating allies who will support that individual during future ambitions for power. The alpha male regularly displays by puffing his normally slim coat up to increase view size and charge to seem as threatening and as powerful as possible; this behavior serves to intimidate other members and thereby maintain power and authority, and it may be fundamental to the alpha male's holding on to his status."

-The bonobos :
"Most studies indicate that females have a higher social status in bonobo society. Aggressive encounters between males and females are rare, and males are tolerant of infants and juveniles. A male derives his status from the status of his mother. The mother–son bond often stays strong and continues throughout life. While social hierarchies do exist, rank plays a less prominent role than in other primate societies."
Nothing said about who's the Alpha male/ female however. Probably because it doesn't matter that much to them  ;)

I'm very aware that this does not ultimately show how important social linking is compared to strength in human communities regarding social ranking, but given the fact that we are highly social animals, with a sex drive not only aimed towards sole reproduction, but also pleasure and social bonding, our natural capacity to express ourself through speech...


Now, regarding dangers that are exterior to the clan's own internal affairs: How is plurality a far less effective survival trait than individual strength!? Of course, both are needed, but it is very, very obvious that one surpasses the other, when taken from a same reference point ( not 2 mices vs 1 elephant, but 1 very strong lion against two slightly weaker lions). Within these criterions, plurality is advantageous not only when fighting back an aggressor. It's also much more effective when searching for food, or hunting.




405
Off Topic / Re: This guy is awsome! - Wild man Andrew Ucles
« on: October 28, 2014, 10:59:31 pm »
I have to admit, Im quite happy to hear that!
That's pretty cool that you're friends with her.


406
Off Topic / Re: A sad riposte to the depopulation conspiracists here
« on: October 28, 2014, 06:59:23 pm »
I disagree. I reckon survival of the fittest was a bigger impulse, at least  in palaeo times. I agree, though, that civilisation requires far more of the "love thy neighbour" guff  in order to survive.
Tell me how these two scenario ends:

-A physically strong, lone lion attacks 4 not-so-strong hippos (granted they stick with each other, and instead of running away in fear when one of them gets attacked, they fight back). Who's likely to win?

- 4 not-so-strong lions attack a single strong hippo. Who's likely to win?


"Love thy neighbour" is either as strong an impulse, or stronger, than being the individual fittest. Because two 80% forces combined is stronger than one single 100% force. Plus you have the undeniable favor of attacking from several angles. That's only one of the many reasons why, when confronted to a danger exterior to the clan, number counts for more than individual strength.

reminder : hippos DO kill lions when they need to defend their lives!

407
Off Topic / Re: A sad riposte to the depopulation conspiracists here
« on: October 28, 2014, 04:13:26 pm »
"Love thy neighbour" is not a survival strategy and is not really a solid part of Nature.
"Love thy neighbour" is a VERY important survival strategy  :o!!!!
When two solitary male adolescent lions cross each other's way, they will stick together and start displaying behaviors associated with very strong friendship. It can even get to the point of gay love, before they finally find some females or another clan of lions. This "love" urges the two lions to stick together and look after one another, with more ardor and commitment than if they were simply acquaintances.
Alone, these lions would've had a much smaller chance of surviving.

Thus, "love thy neighbour" can sometimes be looked upon as a very important survival tactic.

note: a natural survival tactic rarely is the work of the conscious mind, as we can see in this situation. One lion doesn't decide to love another lion. It's all very intuitive.

408
Off Topic / Re: A sad riposte to the depopulation conspiracists here
« on: October 28, 2014, 03:46:48 pm »
You know that "survival of the fittest" isn't the only rule that applies in the wild, especially if you're talking about "survival of the biggest/ strongest". Wisdom, charism (social skills), knowledge, they also contribute to the survival of the group, as much as strength or speed. That's why the oldest female cat is usually the clan leader,  and I'm sure we can find such examples of Alpha males/ females not necessarily being the strongest members of the group, in other species.

Remember a time when elders where actually valued by society for their life experience  :P?

Of course nowadays It's different, moral/ social/ life values of our Grandparents, and society as a whole, needs to be reconsidered. I mean, don't count on your grandparents to tell you about raw paleo diet and stuff  :D

409
Off Topic / Re: This guy is awsome! - Wild man Andrew Ucles
« on: October 28, 2014, 04:30:40 am »
I sent an email to Andrew Ucles' main website a while back asking him to post video-recorded proof that what he does on camera is not fake. Quite understandingly there was no follow up to this. However I was looking for other bare-handed catches/hunts videos on youtube, and I found this:

Man Catches Hog with Bare Hands- Where to Find WILD HOGS

(relevant part starting at 1:15)

I highly doubt this is staged.
It's not as big a catch as a deer of course, but it shows how humans are capable of getting their hands on animal meat without the use of technology, if it ever comes to that.

Also notice how "calm" (more like petrified) the animal is. It makes you think that maybe the wild animals caught by Andrew Ucles weren't necessarily drugged. Oh well, one sees only what one wants to see. vvvv

410
General Discussion / Re: Raw freeze dried pet food?
« on: October 26, 2014, 07:58:44 pm »
I think Iguana's point wasn't about how effectively the body gets rid of cooked food toxins, but rather how the body can recognize and differentiate a toxically altered molecule from a safe one, depending on the degree of transformation this molecule has been subject to. Am I right?

Say your body is an office building, safe/useful molecules are employees, slightly-modified molecules are hit men disguised as employees, and highly-modified molecules are fully equipped mercenaries with grenades in their pockets, and bullet belts around their shoulder, Rambo style.
Which ones are more likely to be permitted entrance inside the office by the security guards at the front door?  :D

411
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 26, 2014, 06:10:01 am »
You see why I get fed up, sometimes... 

Absolutely  ;D

412
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 26, 2014, 04:14:24 am »
From this thread, which is very similar to this one:  ;)
Please vote: Are we meant to live in the tropics?
http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/general-discussion/please-vote-are-we-meant-to-live-in-the-tropics/msg79334/#msg79334

Wow, you guys had the exact same discussion back in 2011  :P.

The point is that if they carry only one sickle cell gene they are fine but well-protected specifically  against malaria. They only have problems, I think, if they have two sets of sickle cell genes.

Yep, that's what the study says:

"Only those individual that inherit two copies of the sickle mutation (one from their mother and the other from their father) develop sickle cell anemia. If untreated, these individuals have a shorter than normal life expectancy and as such it would be expected that this mutation would be rare in human populations."

"Individuals carrying just one copy of the sickle mutation (inherited from either the father or mother) were known not to develop sickle cell anemia, leading rather normal lives. However, it was found that these same individuals, said to carry the sickle cell trait, were in fact highly protected against malaria, thus explaining the high prevalence of this mutation in geographical areas where malaria is endemic"


I wonder however if this sickle mutation can be potentially unhealthy in other situations, even if the individual only has one copy of it. Regarding good transportation of oxygen by the blood cells and whatnot.

413
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat - Malaria
« on: October 26, 2014, 01:36:07 am »
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/04/110428123931.htm

This explains why Africans have developed greater resistance to malaria compared to Europeans.
I've heard about this.

However it doesn't look like such a "healthy" defensive adaptation against the malaria parasite, IMO. The life expectancy of people with this special blood condition being significantly lower than average...

Is there any other way to protect oneself against the negative outcome of being host to the malaria parasite? As in getting the body to manage it's excessive proliferation, through diet? How do wild animals "manage" it?

If I remember correctly, some instinctos experimented with this, but it didn't end well for them, am I right?

414
Everyone needs to SHILL-out here...   ;)

415
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 25, 2014, 09:03:09 pm »
GS, are you sure Europeans are less resistant to malaria than people native to these equatorial regions?
I will look into this, but it doesn't seem totally right...

To begin with French Wikipedia says malaria was present in Northern Europe till the Nineteenth century, when most humid zones and swamps were dried out. That's only two centuries ago, so Europeans must still be at least partly "adapted" to the parasite.

 http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paludisme#Europe (For those who read french)

BTW, I heard that malaria disease was able to develop and spread so vastly because of Neolithic man-made humid zones (plant cultures, cutting down forests, water reservoirs...) and other factors linked to Neolithic lifestyle, such as human settlement. Insect-born diseases probably has had a much greater influence on humanity since the beginning of the Neolithic age, than it might've had in prehistorical times.

416
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 13, 2014, 03:11:24 pm »
Van, I understand why you're tired or irritated about this- I am too in some way. The thing is, it's also very bothering when you see someone that's so obviously (at least according to yourself) in the wrong. So some may handle it in a more aggressive manner or not, the point at the end of the day when answering something that you believe is a false statement, is to make the other person actually realize that they were wrong. The key is to be open for correction of your own mistakes, and not close your mind to anything that would go against your original idea. But that's a personality thing (and hopefully it can be corrected).

Now, about this techno stuff, you might think it has no importance in defining a natural/optimal habitat for humans, while others believe it definitely has its place in this matter. So if you're unhappy that this discussion is not being handled the way you wish it was, you can go ahead and start a new subject of your own called   "human's natural/optimal habitat !!!No discussing technology here!!!".


417
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 13, 2014, 05:48:30 am »
 "when you don't know where you are going, look back at where you came from"
African proverb.

 ;)

418
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 08, 2014, 03:21:41 am »
you said close quote that "the best atheletes tend to come from warmer climates" followed by url of summer olympic athletes. i simply pointed out that you using such an arguement, is no different than if i were to say "the best atheletes tend to come from colder climates" followed by url of winter olympic atheletes

its pretty simple: people from warmer climates tend to be better at "summer events", people from colder climates tend to be better at "winter events". why make this into anything more than it has to be? unless of course you are argueing that you could bring a bunch of Jamaicans to Austria and expect them to be as proficient skiers as the latter, or visa versa bring a bunch of Austrians to Jamaica and expect them to be just as proficient sprinters (with "proper training" both ways of course).
(...) you seem to have taken way too much offense to my post than was intended...and sport is not real life anyways
Colorles, it wasn't my intention at all to sound hostile against you. Now that I've reread the stuff I wrote to you, I can understand why you would think I was being cynically aggressive or something. It wasn't that, believe me. That's the risk taken with forum chatting: not being able to actually observe the body language and emotions of the person on the other side of the screen, therefor stuff written sometime happens to get subject to misinterpretation.
Aside from that I feel you still don't get the point I was making about olympic athletes. But since it's kind of out-of-subject, I would rather PM you about it.

419
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 07, 2014, 02:21:25 am »
2) you say that "most top atheletes of the world happen to originate from warmer climates" followed by a url to the athletes of the summer olympics. well, no kidding you are going to find alot of atheletes from warmer climates in the summer olympics, if you look at the winter olympics you will notice that the athletes tend to come from colder climates (no duh). that was a rather poor argument; unless you are arguing that  summer athletes are "more athletic" than winter athletes, in which case i'd take it you've never done any cross country skiing...
Okay, first of all any person from any states of this planet can theoretically take part in the "summer Olympics". Unless you live on a 10 meter diameter island in the middle of the pacific, you probably have the possibility to train for a 100 meter sprint, a 400 meter race, or a marathon, and anything in between.
However, there's something missing in warmer regions that makes it quite difficult for athletes native to these environments to properly train for the "winter Olympics": that's snow, and ice. Shocking, I know. I've never heard of people gone skiing on the Kilimanjaro top either. I guess you already acknowledged that (like you said, duh)
The point is that even though everybody on this planet is capable of training for the "summer Olympics", still a vast majority of Olympic champions originate from the warmer parts of our globe. And I doubt they get higher quality coaching compared to European athletes, for example.


420
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 06, 2014, 07:24:36 pm »
Incidentally, the Neanderthals did indeed adapt to cold, Arctic environments without technology. Bear in mind that the Neanderthals came into being 100s of thousands of years before the discovery of fire.

You never gave any satisfactory evidence to your claim. Therefor this is just your opinion. And as it was said before fire is not the only "artificial" method used to resist cold.

Another point is that most palaeo HGs went in for massive migrations, following herds etc. It makes perfect sense for human tribes to, for example, migrate into colder climes during summer months while leaving for warmer climes in winter.
Perhaps. At least it makes more sens than the rest.

The absurd challenge to live outdoors is meaningless, of course. I mean I am a descendant of many generations all of whom lived in warm environments due to having fires in their houses etc.

Damn, too bad for you. I mean my family has been living outside in the artic cold for generations. Just take a look at our recent family picture (I'm bottom right)....









421
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 06, 2014, 07:11:02 pm »
There's the notion of the cold actually creating a strength in the body that warm environments can't begin to induce.
This is an over simplification of things. What you're actually referring to is called "cryotherapy", and it's a brief exposure of the body to very cold temperatures, in a controlled environment. It has nothing to do with the exterior environment the individual evolves in. Also, it seems that most top athletes of the world happen to originate from the warmer climates.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athletics_at_the_2012_Summer_Olympics
Does living in colder climates really make you stronger then?

Tyler, it's true that the Yaghan people's moderate adaptation to cold is impressive. They might've been slowly on their way to completely adapting to their environments climates, perhaps in (far) future generations.
However, as the wikipedia article states, these people use not one but several technological (as defined by wiki) methods to resist the cold, such as fires, constructed shelters, and covering their body with animal grease. I mean, their territory isn't called "land of fire" (tierra del fuego) for no reason  :P, as the article explains.
Obviously their body's adopted method to resist the cold is extra fat layers, as they look "chubby" compared to other ethnic groups/tribes.

Ps: they always look like they're cold as hell!!  :D

422
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 06, 2014, 12:07:01 am »
Van, the conclusion to be made here is that humans living in countries with cold climates absolutely depend on "technology" to survive, which is not the case for people living in countries with a much milder, warmer climate. Therefore, can cold regions really be considered an "optimal habitat" for man?

423
General Discussion / Re: Humans Natural/Optimal Habitat
« on: October 05, 2014, 05:31:00 pm »
You know what? Enough with the theories and speculation about how humans can survive, let alone thrive in the cold without technology (as defined by wiki).
Lets get some actual empirical evidence out there   >D!

And I don't want to hear about no Inuit or Fuegian tribes, because they obviously use at least one form of technology to keep warm (shelter, clothes, controlled fire).

Tyler, you seem to be of northern-european descent, right?
You're probably following what you would describe as an optimal, or near optimal diet, correct?

Well, Tyler, and any other willful person who shares the same characteristics as cited above, I challenge you to pick your favorite winter vacation (Christmas, St-Nicolas...) to go and live outside with absolutely no heating or cold protecting technology.
Yep, that's no T-shirt, no blanket, no central heating, no hair-dryer, no fur, no fire. I you do need to use your car during this experiment, it's windows down (Is their any natural shelter on earth with no open entry-exit?) and no heating of course.
If you've got work to do, just bring your office chair and computer outside the house, and cover it with something when done (We don't want your office tools to get cold and wet, do we?  ;))
If you can't sleep without a good mattress, you are allowed to bring yours outside. But no covers!!
Mosquito net allowed too, if not touching the skin. Probably wont need it though, since insects don't usually hang out in the cold...
You can train before D-day of course, make the most of your weekends and go live and sleep outside while it's not dangerously freezing yet.

This is a joke of course, but if somebody really did that, I can bet you he wouldn't last 3 days. A week max before actual death.
As long as there will be no solid evidence to back up such absurd claims, the only sensible conclusion to be made is that no human being can stand such intense cold, for such an important length of time, without the use of technology.
I'm pretty confident there never will be any evidence to be found against....

424
General Discussion / Re: Probiotics for chickens
« on: September 29, 2014, 03:20:48 am »
I saw a documentary two years ago where the industrials mixed PRE-biotics with the chicken's food. Pre-biotics apparently being the exact same thing as antibiotics, just with a different name  :P

Now I don't know if these people really give probiotics to their chicken, instead of pre/antibiotics. I think it's still better to avoid eating factory chicken anyway, if possible.


425
General Discussion / Re: Group Fast anyone?
« on: September 25, 2014, 05:37:32 am »
I also have binge-eating tendencies and actually had the same desire (more like urge) to go on a long fast. I didn't because of several reasons:
-I couldn't work out a long enough period of free time for the fast to actually be worth it;
-I though doing it while on a transitional/S€D diet might not be a good idea, especially having deficiencies in certain vitamins and minerals at the time. However me having low levels of vitamins is most likely due to my body's difficulty actually absorbing them, as it was pointed out recently by the family doctor.
-Wasn't sure if the house I live in could be considered a "pristine" enough location, as it is advised by the fasting experts. I live in the suburbs of Brussels, Belgium's capital. Quite a green area actually. Of course it's probably not as ideal of a place as the seaside, or the mountains, or even the forest.

In my case I was actually thinking things over too much, and was going against my intuitive desire to fast, by eating!
What I mean to say is at that time I didn't feel truly hungry for anything. Be it a raw or processed food, if I stopped and listened to my own body, I found that nothing really appealed. My stomach felt full even though I hadn't eaten anything in the past 12-16 hours.
Plus my nose was (and still is) completely clogged up and insensitive to any stimuli (can't smell anything), which one could relate to macro-nutrient overload. I still ate because I thought I wasn't ready to fast yet, and once I had processed food in my mouth it was hard for me to stop at satiety. Actually I went to bed most nights with a full stomach...

Now days are getting chillier here in Belgium, studies just started, so I don't want to be fasting right now either. I'll leave the vulnerability and detox crisis for the warmer Spring days, if I still feel like it.
This Friday however I'm going to see someone who can help me deal with my eating disorder, which I believe has a psychological root rather than physiological.

What I want to point out is that both of us (I assume) felt like fasting as a result of our binge-eating disorder, or the cause of it at least, if you consider binge-eating to be a symptom rather than the origin. It is known that fasting cleans out your body of damaged tissues, toxins and unwanted organic matter, as you body can focus on cleaning and repairing, rather than digestion. That's why you don't usually feel hungry when your ill.
It might be a way of "reseting" your gut flora, if your making that last transition to your new diet/way of life.
After a long enough period of fast, true hunger finally reappears. Not the "It's noon, time to eat" hunger. Real, basic, vital hunger.

^not talking from own experience, but from content written by other people knowledgeable on the matter.

Doesn't mean that you'll never fall back to your old habits ever again, but at least this type of hunger puts you back on the right tracks when it comes to eating the proper amount of food at the appropriate time.
 Fasting could also have a psychological effect on you, and make you realize that you never needed to eat this much food to feel good and live good. Especially if the food you ate was mostly junk food, processed food.


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