Author Topic: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim  (Read 23852 times)

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CitrusHigh

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2012, 01:01:03 am »
Infowars is a scaremongering propaganda machine. As soon as I saw Adams link up with Jones, I knew I wasn't imagining that NaturalNew's is kinda a sensationist tabloid for the health world. It's funny, because I've thought, especially in the last year, that Adams it beginning to lose his credibility because he is overblowing stories and even twisting them a bit. Stories that were bad enough as they were, he'd then try and juice them a little more. And I was there thinking, "this guy is beginning to discredit our movement" plus like you said, he's pretty much a raw vegan and this is evident in his unequivocal "holier than thou" attitude. Don't get me wrong, the mass public are a bunch of walking zombie fucktards, but I used to be one of those fucktards, and I really didn't know any better, I was literally programmed to be braindead, just like most of us once were. So to use a holier than thou attitude with them is kind of silly, save it for people who you try to wake up, and have absolutely heard your message and the logic, then reject it, those are the true fucktards.

Anyway, the whole thing is ugly, and really has little to do with this movement, which is about health, peace and love and sustainability IMHO.

And yes, I got that off a facebook Primal Diet group and it came from his website.

Offline Eric

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2012, 01:02:25 am »
I suspect they're all scammers, including and especially Aajonus Vanderplanitz. Yeah, he does advocate ideas that some of us have found useful, but we're foolish to continue holding him high given that he's dug himself into such a deep hole regarding his credentials and trustworthiness. Time for AV to enjoy a downward spiral and hit rock bottom. Hopefully he enjoys a soft landing, maybe in a few years he'll start being honest with people and stop building his business on silly stories.

Administrators might consider removing the "Primal Diet" section so he doesn't drag this website down with him.

Offline svrn

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2012, 01:16:57 am »
I dont find almost everything infowars does to be sensationalist. I mean we really do have people getting thrown in jail over raw milk, we really do have a government controlled by those who want to reduce the population, the tsa really is radiating people and molesting babies, and world elites really would like to see almost all of us dead and plan in secret to commit these things.

Im not saying they dont sometimes make things seem worse than they are but they also sometimes make things seem better than they are as well.

My biggest problem is really mike adams and his veganism. I think the whole infowars team is getting behind mike more out of ignorance than any bad intent.

I also wonder if mikes raw vegan/vegetarianism was reason for his attacks on aajonus. Iv noticed that raw vegans such as durianrider and others make a point of attacking aajonus and he has become somewhat of a target for these people.
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2012, 01:20:40 am »
Our society is totally into sheets of paper. If he was going to accomplish what he did he HAD to have that piece of paper - and that piece of paper takes a lot of time doing bullshit work that was in his view probably useless when he already understood better - so why NOT make it up?

If legitimate, those "sheets of paper" represent that a person has demonstrated something to others who have knowledge in the field being demonstrated. In order to earn my "sheets of paper," I studied and performed certain skills to a certain standard. It says so right on my "sheets of paper." There was no bullshit work involved. If;, you say, a person understands something that can be demonstrated and certified on a diploma, why would it be necessary to make one up?
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline svrn

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #29 on: June 08, 2012, 01:50:48 am »
having that sheet of paper for me indicates being brainwashed into a thoroughly disproven set of beliefs as well as having a license and inclination towards dealing some of the most dangerous drugs known to man.
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CitrusHigh

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #30 on: June 08, 2012, 02:13:12 am »
having that sheet of paper for me indicates being brainwashed into a thoroughly disproven set of beliefs as well as having a license and inclination towards dealing some of the most dangerous drugs known to man.

What troll said, the papers mean nothing in this society except that you're a good little plebe who jumped through a few annoying hoops.

Troll, the ideas infowars talks about are true, america is a corporation, we are being destroyed systematically, our freedoms are being taken very surely every minute that congress and the whitehouse are in power. But fear is NOT the answer. There is fear and love, protection or growth. You can't be doing both at the same time. So fuck fear, take back your heritage, humans are gods, but very feeble, amnesiac gods. You can move worlds if you want to, whining about how powerless we are isn't doing a fuck of good.

Offline svrn

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #31 on: June 08, 2012, 02:40:22 am »
Yeah but alex is constantly talking about how the nwo is going to be defeated and I agree with him.

I like Alan Wattsanalysis more anyway. Alex Jones just really entertains me for some reason and that might not be a good thing. I love watching him get really worked up.
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Offline Dorothy

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #32 on: June 08, 2012, 03:22:08 am »
I dont understand why people just assume that the coyote story is fake. Ive seen crazier things happen in my life that.

I watched his face when he was telling the story. It was the first video I saw of him telling his story and I noticed when watching that he flashed micro-expressions that made me note at the time that he was probably lying about the coyotes.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 03:31:42 am by Dorothy »

Offline Dorothy

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #33 on: June 08, 2012, 03:29:52 am »
If legitimate, those "sheets of paper" represent that a person has demonstrated something to others who have knowledge in the field being demonstrated. In order to earn my "sheets of paper," I studied and performed certain skills to a certain standard. It says so right on my "sheets of paper." There was no bullshit work involved. If;, you say, a person understands something that can be demonstrated and certified on a diploma, why would it be necessary to make one up?

When Aajonus knew more than the teachers and would have to learn all sorts of stuff that he knew causes disease - like eat your wheaties - that's what I mean by bullshit.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 03:46:46 am by TylerDurden »

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #34 on: June 08, 2012, 06:14:17 am »
I just wish he'd quit pushing dairy so hard. 

And the whole fake-PhD thing isn't helping much, either. 

In the long run, though, Aajonus getting discredited isn't going to hurt the raw or paleo movements much.  There's just too much logic and common sense in the concepts we work with for them to lose momentum because of that.

He also pushes tomatoes.

I am allergic to tomatoes.  My son too.

But i think these allergies are the responsibility of the individual.

I'm satisfied with Aajonus' reply.

Just as I'm happy GCB of instincto fame actually took the time to post here.

Just as im happy to learn wai diet wai is a man.


« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 06:29:25 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #35 on: June 08, 2012, 09:10:26 am »
http://www.naturalnews.com/036076_Aajonus_Vonderplanitz_doctorate_nutrition.html
That's no news. This was brought out before in this forum. We knew that his doctorate was phony. The rest of the world is just starting to catch up with us. Thanks to Tyler and others, we are not overly enamored of ANY guru. I hope that anyone who is surprised will ask themselves why they bought into the hype so easily and commit to becoming more skeptical in the future.

Exactly. I have brought this issue up on another thread in the past. This proves beyond any doubt my long-held suspicion. Very frustrating that someone who takes such great pains to turn themselves into a public face of the raw food movement would do something so foolish. A real PhD isn't that hard to get; I finished mine last summer...
Congrats!
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 09:32:53 am by PaleoPhil »
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>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #36 on: June 08, 2012, 09:55:39 am »
Degrees are bullshit, except perhaps in the area of hard sciences.

Nutrition is not a hard science, especially at the level of ignorance that even the most knowledgeable nutrition professors are at.

Offline eveheart

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #37 on: June 08, 2012, 12:19:26 pm »
The first diploma-mill degree I ever saw was on the wall of a self-styled nutritionist in the 1980's. Her PhD was in the field of hypnosis  l). She was an older woman with the body somewhere between chubby and flabby, who insisted (as she pounded her fists against her distended gut) that "This is all muscle!"

Reminds me of the old story about the Reverend Minister and one of his parishioners - - -

Parishioner: Reverend, what do all those letters after your name mean?

Reverend: Well, you know what B.S. is, right?

Parishioner: Why, yessir, I reckon I do.

Reverend: Well then, M.S. means "more of the same" and Ph.D. means "piled higher and deeper!"
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Offline afroza

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #38 on: June 08, 2012, 07:50:54 pm »





I'm satisfied with Aajonus' reply.


Me too. The man has been attacked so many times before, as anyone who went public like him would. That's why so many of us RAFers are still hiding in the closets. Aajonus is a brave advocate for health, no question about that for me. I remember listening to a webradio interview with him about the Swineflu hoax and thinking "Oh, my good, they will kill him now, for sure". Not long after did I read about the forced vaccination done to him. Anyone who questions Big Pharma, Governments and other Big Ass Companies are living dangerously these days. Even if you are just a raw milk farmer, as we have seen. Wouldn't be surprised if the fake PhD was given to him with the intent of doing him harm in the future. And he was naive enough to accept it, as he shouldn't have.

As for the coyote story; That critique is just strange. How anyone but him can know what he experienced then and there is beyond me. It's a reasonable enough story to me, I have lived amongst animals in the Himalayas and they have given me stranger gifts than that at times. The difference is that I am not ready to share it boldly with the world as AV does. Thankfully, though, some of us are that bold. That way this important information about healthy foods have spread.
I am meeting Aaron's in July in Finland. I will see what he says about the whole thing if I get the chance.

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #39 on: June 08, 2012, 08:23:45 pm »
>>  I have lived amongst animals in the Himalayas and they have given me stranger gifts than that at times.

I would certainly love to read about these experiences.
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Offline svrn

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #40 on: June 08, 2012, 08:53:44 pm »
me too.
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CitrusHigh

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #41 on: June 08, 2012, 08:59:05 pm »
Yeah, I concur with Afroza, I don't think I can really relate the strange experiences I've had with animals, because usually it's during a mushroom trip or when I've been wandering in the forest pretty stoned, so my memory is kind of dreamy and foggy, but I've had some seriously close and seriously strange experiences with animals.  They respond big time to your energy/body language, and if that energy is loving, or child like, or without a schedule, the animals will interact with you, not as a human, but as part of their world. That's why I urge people to spend time meditating in nature, because you'll be sitting at your secret spot, practicing a sense awareness, and when your brainwaves/energy level are at baseline, you'll look up and see a fox standing a few feet away staring at you, or you'll have a buck walk right by you 10 feet away, or a family of mink play in the water in a trout stream while you sit and giggle at the sheer pleasure they seem to derive from it. Or birds will land on you, or I remember one time I was super baked next to the factory I used to work at just when I went RVAF, which bordered a nature preserve (awesome, I know...) And I went for a walk down the path and all of a sudden I was covered in painted butterflies and they were kissing me! That is they wanted some mineral or compound on my skin, just the same though, to be covered in 10 of these delicate little flying pieces of origami is quite the experience. They didn't care if I moved around, they were content to sit on me, it was like having a living coat on.

But, if you wanted to share Afroza, I too would love to hear any stories about close encounters with wildlife, those have been some of my favorite experiences in life, such a gift to be able to see these animals up close, interact with them instead of just seeing them running to and fro on the freeway.

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #42 on: June 08, 2012, 11:16:26 pm »
My time in the wild involve other people, my husband, and to some extent my children but other locals from the area as well. I am not comfortable sharing because it may affect others. And I cherish that time so immensely, I somehow feel that if I analysed it much it would loose it's magic to me. But this forum feels like a safe haven so if I were to write something about that time in my life I might just post it here. But let's just say that I have experienced animals offering game and showing where to find clean water for example. I have seen people living with animals in coexistence to an extent I did not think was possible, but this were persons engaged in spiritual practises and not people living a "normal" life.

CitrusHigh

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #43 on: June 09, 2012, 12:01:32 am »
>>  I have lived amongst animals in the Himalayas and they have given me stranger gifts than that at times.

I would certainly love to read about these experiences.

GS and Troll, you might check in to books by or recommended by Jon Young, he gives some anecdotal experiences in there. He also recommends a book by someone, I think up in BC canada, but the name escapes me at the moment, I'll have to listen to the audio course again (it's been a while anyway) then I'll get back to you with the author and title. I think it was a guy in BC caretaking someone else' forest and because of that, because of his mindset, attitude and body language energy, he's got buck's and bear and other animals just hanging out with him practically like family WITHOUT feeding them. It's just a by product of caring for the land in such a way that you become linked with it and the animals, after a time, get to know you (yes, they recognize you individually just like we all recognize each other individually), know that not only are you not a threat, but you're also a very loving, nurturing person and they're just drawn to you, much like we're drawn to people in our lives who are caring and nurturing to us!

Offline Dorothy

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #44 on: June 09, 2012, 04:09:01 am »

As for the coyote story; That critique is just strange. How anyone but him can know what he experienced then and there is beyond me. It's a reasonable enough story to me, I have lived amongst animals in the Himalayas and they have given me stranger gifts than that at times. The difference is that I am not ready to share it boldly with the world as AV does. Thankfully, though, some of us are that bold.

What I said had nothing to do with whether the story was possible or not - it had to do with the science and art of lie detection from watching someone's facial movements. The way his eyes moved, the change in his expression, vocal speed increase, increase and change in head movements and the way his mouth moved were all quite different in the part where he was telling the coyote story than other parts where it looked to me like he was just telling his life story rather than a made up story. Eye movements can indicate if you are remembering something or if you are making it up as you tell it or trying to remember a made up story.

Again though - I don't care if he made up that story to himself or to others, or it was a dream, hallucination or a confusion embracing it and telling it in order to make it ok to eat "the easter bunny" after being an ethical vegetarian. We all have to do what we have to do to deal with ourselves and the essence of his gift to us is still intact. I don't doubt that what he said happened to him "could" happen.  I do believe he went through most of the horrendous things he said he did btw. The way he said most everything else was fairly congruent. The part that was absolutely true was that he was abused as a child because he flashed an expression of disdain almost imperceptibly as he was saying it and he jutted out his chin in anger.

All it would take is a real professional lie detection person to tell you. I'm an amateur - but usually right. It's one of my hobbies.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2012, 04:19:23 am by Dorothy »

CitrusHigh

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #45 on: June 09, 2012, 05:29:40 am »
Whether or not it's accurate, that's pretty cool Dorothy, I love studying body language and neuro linguistic programming, fascinating, and part of cultivating one's own awareness also, how we carry ourselves and how we behave.

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #46 on: June 09, 2012, 06:13:57 am »
I didn't refer to your doubts about the coyote story, Dorothy, but rather that it seamed to be one of the "charges" against Aajonus´credibility coming from the people trying to discredit him in media. I totally get that they would come down hard on the fake PhD, but to criticise his personal experiences or rather his interpretation of events in his past is just strange to me.
Whether or not it's accurate, that's pretty cool Dorothy, I love studying body language and neuro linguistic programming, fascinating, and part of cultivating one's own awareness also, how we carry ourselves and how we behave.
I agree!

Offline Dorothy

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #47 on: June 09, 2012, 07:03:27 am »
I didn't refer to your doubts about the coyote story, Dorothy, but rather that it seamed to be one of the "charges" against Aajonus´credibility coming from the people trying to discredit him in media. I totally get that they would come down hard on the fake PhD, but to criticise his personal experiences or rather his interpretation of events in his past is just strange to me.

Totally Afroza. Doubting someone just on words alone in my opinion is hubris - thinking that only what you are capable of experiencing is all that there is to be experienced. In fact, we are all small when compared to the possible. 

Offline Dorothy

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #48 on: June 09, 2012, 07:06:27 am »
Whether or not it's accurate, that's pretty cool Dorothy, I love studying body language and neuro linguistic programming, fascinating, and part of cultivating one's own awareness also, how we carry ourselves and how we behave.

It is fun isn't it?! :D

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Re: Controversial anti-Aajonus claim
« Reply #49 on: June 09, 2012, 09:17:03 am »
http://www.wewant2live.com/rawesome-data-comes-to-light-poisonous-chickens-eggs-etc/

aajonuses response.

His response so destroys adams' allegations its not even funny. Mike adams is a joke to me at this point after reading this response.  AAjonus has a ton of facts and evidence here while adams just had embarrassing almost tabloid style reporting.

This is making me think theres some weird dealings going on between adams and stewart or maybe even adams and the feds. who knows tho, all I know is that adams has lost pretty much all credibility in my book even though I agree with so many things he discusses.
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