I'd like to share with my friends here my learning journey regarding chickens. I started out reading every book on chickens I could find - but the real learning has been from having chickens and hanging out with old "chicken people" from my local meetup group with a great yahoo forum.

Most chickens are either fed chicken food or allowed to forage on their own. It occurred to me that neither of these usual ways was optimal. I talked in detail with the producer of the best organic soy free chicken food I could buy and was left wondering why on earth anyone feeds that! I won't go into real detail unless asked, but with all I have learned about food it fell so very short and was still relatively expensive for what it was. Besides, when I fed my old hens only that food they stopped laying.

You see, chickens actually have enough ovum to lay more eggs than they could live to lay. But every chicken book says to expect their egg production to start to fall radically after the first year. Most chickens are only kept a year or maybe two and then culled. But some of my chickens are now over 5 years old and lay better than the year old chickens and their eggs are larger. That's because they are all stretched out and can lay such big eggs. Their eggs taste the same or better than the young chickens' eggs because they have been eating better longer here with me and they are the dominant ones so demand the best pickings.

A chicken in the wild would lay only a small amount of eggs during a specific period of the year. My chickens on the other hand being bred to lay over 300 eggs a year need mega nutrition. Running around my yard isn't going to cut it when they have to pop out the perfect protein most days.

The people that really know the species told me that in the wild they estimated that chickens would probably eat at least 70% bugs and small creatures. I see that totally from watching my chickens and the kinds of food they really are designed to eat. I have never seen such carnivorous creatures ever. Because they are designed by humans to make eggs beyond anything that could ever be otherwise they go into a frenzy around meat that cannot be compared to any predator I've seen.

The feed that is usually given is ground up so that the fats are denatured over time, the fish (if fish is used) is heated at extreme temperatures and they use just a few different grains - the food is narrow. This is completely unnatural even if the chicken wasn't laying so much. What's more is they only have a 20 - 30% protein ratio! No wonder they stop laying and die early. On the other hand, in order for a laying chicken to get even the bare minimum from bugs found in an environment you would need lots of land for each chicken - I've heard estimates of at least an acre per chicken - of course depending on environment.

I buy organic seeds of all varieties and sprout them for my chickens . This comes closer to how a chicken would find a seed in nature, in the dew or on the ground starting to grow. It disables the enzyme inhibitors and brings the seed up to 20 - 30% protein and makes it into an enzyme powerhouse. But more than that I feed the chickens bugs and meat and I'm working on getting that portion of their food up to at least 70% along with their foraging. No chicken grower does this. The standard is 30% tops of protein. I just don't understand how they got that number!

You should see what happens with my chickens when I feed them Slankers pet food. It's a frenzy that you just have to see to believe. They get almost that way with bugs I give them - but still - raw meat sets them ablaze. They will eat it also as high as I make it for them. The dogs won't eat it, the cats won't eat it - but the chickens will kill for it.

I'm convinced that most chickens are starving and the eggs you buy in the store and even farms are from starving chickens. People love to say all the vegetables, fruits and cooked treats that their chickens get. My chickens won't eat any of that unless I withhold their real natural preferred food from them. They won't eat from my vegetable gardens even. They will dig to bath in the dirt, but they hold out for their natural food instead if they can. They will still dig for bugs though and try to find little snakes etc. to devour. They also will still chew on grass, because chickens really do need a certain amount of greenery in their diet - but they are so very particular about what kind and they almost always pick the wild and most succulent and fresh young greens. They don't want old stuff from the grocery store - even if it's the organic things I get that cost a fortune from Whole Foods!

I've been farming mealworms and feeding them the best organic foods I can and I've been raising black soldier fly maggots. These the chickens also go nuts for. I'm working to get my supplies high enough, but I already feed them dramatically more of these foods than anyone else I've ever talked to except old farmers who would let the chickens eat the maggots from the cow patties and give them old deceased cows to eat.

Today we finished our massive black soldier fly composter as our two small composters aren't big enough and I've found some businesses that are willing to give me their meat trimmings for composting. It's a lot more work than just feeding them the crap that everyone else feeds their chickens - but it is impossible to buy the eggs that we produce anywhere. I've yet to find anyone who thinks about feeding their chickens a species specific raw diet - I mean - they have those for dogs and we have raw paleo for us and we want only grass-fed for our beef and wild seafood - but our eggs are not thought about in these terms - not really.

My little flock might be the only real raw paleo chickens around with enough of the food they need not to be starving. I can't wait until our 6 young hens start laying because we still don't have as many eggs as we want - but I've learned so much that I've ruined buying even the best eggs from backyard growers. Knowledge can make things harder...... but I think it's worth it. I just have to be a little more patient.

I got my husband some lamb's heart. I plan on thinly slicing some for him to try, but it's really important he eats it. Any seasonings or ideas for it would be appreciated. He's also not fully raw so if there are ways to dehydrate or cook it that will make sure he eats it, that would also be useful. It came in a large frozen package and I'm not sure I will be able to get any more so I'm going to have some I'll have to figure out what to do with. I was thinking dehydrating so he can have a little bit every day. Has anyone dehydrated heart before?

Got an email today. At the very least it's interesting - but thought maybe someone here might want to participate? Why they need help from the entire country and instructions further down.


SOMETHING HISTORICAL IS ABOUT TO HAPPEN - BUT YOUR PARTICIPATION IS CRITICAL
 
I'm pleased to announce that the Money Bomb Against Monsanto has been officially launched!
 
Volunteers and staff from the California Right to Know Campaign are submitting nearly 1 million signed petitions from registered voters across the state of California to county officials, to place Right to Know Genetically Engineered Food Act on the Ballot for November 6.
Starting May 1, and extending through May 26, a broad coalition of farmers, health groups, and organic food manufacturers, will attempt to raise one million dollars (i.e. "The Money Bomb"). Donations can be made online, via regular snail mail, and over the phone. All donations will support state GMO-labeling campaigns and their defense from biotech bully lawsuits.
 
ACTION TO TAKE
 
1. READ the Message from Dr. Mercola and WATCH the video at
http://e2ma.net/go/11034792164/208893591/234066353/1407690/goto:http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/05/01/monsanto-vs-gmo-labeling.aspx
 
2. DONATE to the Money Bomb on GMOs by May 26, 2012 at
www.organicconsumersfund.org/donate/moneybomb.cfm
 
3. SIGN the Labeling Petition at
www.organicconsumers.org/monsanto/action.cfm
 
4. SPREAD the word and EDUCATE yourself and others; for more information on GMOs, go to  www.responsibletechnology.org
 
More details and links are posted at  www.farmtoconsumer.org/aa/aa-07may2012.htm
 
THE RIGHT TO KNOW GENETICALLY MODIFIED FOOD ACT
Act will require food manufacturers to identify genetically engineered ingredients on the labels of foods sold in California.
 
When California voters pass this ballot initiative, the Label Genetically Engineered Food Act will also not allow the common practice of mis labeling genetically engineered foods as "natural" or "all natural." It's imperative to understand why this initiative is so important and how it can affect all Americans, regardless of where you live.
 
California has the eighth largest economy in the world, so passing a labeling law for genetically engineered foods in California can have the same impact as passing a federal law.
 
Large food companies are unlikely to accept having dual labeling; one for California and another for the rest of the country. It would be an expensive logistical nightmare, not to mention a massive PR problem.
 
To avoid the dual labeling, many would likely opt to not include using any genetically engineered ingredients in their product, especially if the new label would be the equivalent of a skull and crossbones. Those who opt not to replace GE ingredients from the get-go will likely find themselves unable to sell their products, as a majority of consumers reportedly will not buy foods once they know they're genetically engineered. Unable to sell their products, such companies will eventually be forced to stop contaminating our food with genetically engineered ingredients, or risk going out of business.
 
This is what happened in Europe and over 40 countries around the world. It can happen in the U.S. This is why we can't leave California to battle the biotech giants on their own. They need your help!  Donating  funds to this campaign may be the best money you'll spend all year to safeguard your health, and the health of your children.
 
Do you know which foods are genetically engineered when you go grocery shopping for your family? Wouldn't you want to know? Genetically engineered foods have been on the market since 1996. It's time they tell us what's in the food we're eating on a daily basis. Making a generous  donation to this campaign  is the best chance every American has at this point to make that happen!
 
THE PROVERBIAL DAVID VERSUS GOLIATH
Naturally, the biotech industry is not about to let this pass without a fight. Monsanto, the Farm Bureau, the Grocery Manufacturers Association, along with corporate agribusiness, are all raising millions of dollars to spread their propaganda in an effort to defeat the California Ballot Initiative, just like they did a decade ago in Oregon. At that time, a cabal of corporate giants, including Monsanto and DuPont, calling themselves The Coalition Against the Costly Labeling Law, outspent the pro-labeling group 30-1, and successfully defeated the labeling initiative by scaring voters into believing that labeling genetically engineered foods was unnecessary and would raise food prices.
 
They did it again in Washington state last month, where campaign contributions to three of the eight politicians on the Senate Agriculture Committee-Democrat Brian Hatfield, and Republicans Jim Honeyford and Mark Schoesler-guaranteed the bill's demise in committee. Right now, the biotech industry is also working to defeat similar GE labeling bills in Vermont, Hawaii, Connecticut, and other states. According to the Union of Concerned Scientists, Monsanto spent $8 million on their lobbying efforts in 2010 alone, and gave more than $400,000 in political contributions. Monsanto also spent $120 million on advertising, to convince consumers that genetically engineered foods are safe - despite the overwhelming scientific evidence showing otherwise.
 
Let's send them a message, loud and clear:  We have the right to know what they put into our food!
 
You can do so by making a  donation  right now. The money will be used to counter the industry propaganda so that we can win this ballot.
 
WE'RE DROPPING THE MONEY BOMB!
About twenty years ago, the FDA decided to deny consumers the right to know whether their food was genetically altered or not. This shameful regulation was spearheaded by Michael Taylor, a former Monsanto lawyer who transferred into the offices of the FDA. Taylor is not the only ex-Monsanto employee that ended up in a position of power within the US federal government and its regulatory agencies, and this is precisely why previous efforts to get genetically engineered foods labeled have been blocked.
 
Not so this time!
 
Ballot Initiatives like the one in California is one way for citizens to  take back control  from compromised politicians and government officials and bypass them entirely. To sweeten the deal further, a group of "Right to Know" public interest organizations and organic companies have pledged to match the first million dollars raised in this nationwide "Drop the Money Bomb on Monsanto Campaign."
 
So  click here , and help us raise 1 million dollars to win this historic campaign! These "Right to Know" groups include:
 
The Organic Consumers Association
Mercola.com
Food Democracy Now
Nature's Path
Lundberg Family Farms
Eden Foods
The Organic Consumers Fund
Institute For Responsible Technology
 
CAN WE WIN?
Yes, I believe we can! But we need to get the word out, which requires a strong campaign to educate the citizens of California to vote for the initiative on November 6. According to Ronnie Cummins of the Organic Consumers Association, we stand a good chance of winning in California because:
* This time, we have far more scientific information and greater public awareness on our side. GE contamination is now a mainstream media issue. Monsanto has become the most hated corporation in the world.
* This time, we have overwhelming public support. Polls show that more than 8 out of 10 voters in California want mandatory GE labeling.
* This time, we have built the strongest coalition of concerned food consumers in history, for the exclusive purpose of passing this law.
THE TIME FOR ACTION IS NOW!
Today, I ask you to invest in this Initiative. Invest in your future. And invest as generously as you can.  If you've already sent in your donation, thank you! If not, please  contribute to this historic and critical campaign  today.  And then please forward this email to your friends. Share it on Facebook and Twitter. Print it out, hand it to all your friends. Every action counts!
 
As stated by Ronnie Cummins with the Organic Consumers Association:
"Monsanto is one of the most powerful, arrogant and destructive companies in the world. For decades, they have controlled the world's food supply by buying off politicians and regulatory agencies, intimidating small farmers, manipulating the outcome of scientific studies, lying to consumers - and threatening to sue states like Vermont if they dare to pass a GMO labeling law.
... Despite Monsanto's claims to the contrary, scientists are clear: genetically engineered food has been linked to a wide range of health hazards, including kidney and liver damage, infertility, auto-immune disorders, allergies and autism, accelerated aging, and birth defects...
We have the right to know if the food we buy has been genetically engineered.... It's time to take back our food. Our farms. Our power. It's time to show Monsanto what ordinary people like us can do when we come together. It's time to drop the money bomb on Monsanto."
Hundreds of thousands of people making small donations can help the coalition behind this initiative run a dynamic, effective campaign to bring down Monsanto and the rest of the Biotech Bullies.
 
So please, join us, and make a donation right now!  You can donate online, by phone, or by dropping a check in the mail.
 

Check out this thing I saw in Hammacher Schlemmer:

http://www.hammacher.com/Product/79504?promo=search

It says that it can cold -smoke cheese and fish indoors!

I might be getting a whole grass-fed ewe ground up for my dogs from the guy that I have gotten my ground lamb from. Us humans might or might not like the taste so it will be considered dog food. It's getting harder and harder to get grass-fed as most of the suppliers are done for the year and there wasn't much with the drought to start with - but an older ewe might be possible. The big thing is - making the trip (long) out to the processing plant I just might be able to get at least part of it unfrozen. This would be the first unfrozen meat I have been able to locate as here in cattle country I have found out that meat is no longer butchered locally, but sent to the big processing plants to be butchered and frozen because of all the FDA tough regulations and risks involved for the farmers.

I was planning on freezing the vast majority but am now wondering which one would be better - freezing or smoking?

I'm betting that the meat will last a month or two (maybe three if I add enough other things) - if only the doggies eat it.

Do I have other options? One dog is pretty sick, one is old and picky (neither have many teeth) and the other is young but a chub a muffin.  All three are rescues with history of bad diets behind them - but have been on all raw with me for years. I wonder about high meat with the ground meat for them - but pre-frozen can't do that right? Maybe I could experiment with some of the meat fresh and fermented for them? That could be exciting.

I have a dehydrator and that could be an option to - but wouldn't that be pretty smelly?

I wonder what kind of things can be cold-smoked besides fish...... anyone have experience with it?

Gotta figure out how the best way to make this ground meat last. I have a whole freezer side of an upright fridge so can fit the whole ground ewe in there without problem if that's the best.

Thanks!

After a couple of months of watching me eat raw ground meat, chewing off bones and living to tell the tale -- hubbie has progressively eaten his (now grass-fed) burgers rarer and rarer until........ he ate a whole 2 tablespoons raw himself! wOOt! Funny how hard that first bite of all raw can be even with eating rare burgers and sushi all the time. It's a mental leap. He seems to only like ground. I would make very thin steak sashimi - but rare steaks are turn-off to him.

In the morning I have gotten him to stop eating cereals (FINALLY!) by making a soaked, dehydrated mixed nut and date cream/pie crust on top of which he can put all his berries and fruits (which he loves btw). The first time I put frozen banana icecream on top to really win him over. It's like the best desert you ever had anywhere. So breakfast is much better now.

For lunch I've gotten him very happy with frequent sliced sashimi en masse. We make fab sauces and add herbs and seaweeds. Sometimes he has his rare hamburger - but I'm hoping to get him willing to eat the all-raw version more and more with the raw egg yolk sauce on top but at present he will only eat such a tiny amount and he needs more meat. Lunch is a time that we eat greens cut directly from my garden. They seem to digest well for us well with the meat. It's certainly better than the bread with the hamburger that is being replaced, slowly, but surely. I find that I have to eat much less meat than him to feel good. I think he needs even more than what he is getting though and really needs bone/cartilage.

You see, he has a disc that is almost all gone. We've been doing physical stuff like traction and he now goes out to do yoga most days. The overall pain is reduced and if he gets into pain I can get him back to his baseline pretty quickly with hands-on-healing. But....... diet is pivotal! FYI he also suffers from allergies terribly here in Austin - the allergy capital of the world. People without allergies move here and get them. Most of the population suffers but he already was susceptible. Any suggestions for the disc and the allergies would be listened to with open ears and mind.

I was finally able to get some bone marrow yesterday. I tried before to get grass-fed but it was always too hard and frozen. What I got this time was not grass-fed - but better than nothing. At the market the kind butcher was also willing to cut it up into the ideal pieces to eat easily - unlike the whole bones from the farmer's market. Hubbie will eat the marrow only with his hamburgers, one bite of burger and one bite of marrow. together - but at least it's in! I took the marrow out of the bone for him but I eat it right out of the bone. I LOVE the taste of the marrow. It gives me such a wonderful hydration! It's like the best lip balm in the world. I bet over time he will come to like it more. I just HAS to be good for him.

On the stove now are the bones with the cartilage and the left-over less-soft marrow in a pot simmering. Breakfast and lunch are handled but the last meal ends up being his old cooked stuff often with brown rice and such. I at least can get him to put raw egg yolk and avocado on the rice and veggies now though. He's been watching me eat raw egg yolks from our chickens for years. I'm trying to figure out a way to make that last meal better. I figure, if it's going to be cooked, I should try to make it slow-cooked and some vegetables that are only good cooked for a larger variety of nutrients, cooked only in water and covered so the nutrients go back into the water - and a way to get some more meat and minerals into the guy. I don't understand slow-cooking much, stews or stocks. I'm thinking of it as a stop-gap on the way to getting his mineral and nutrient stores up and a way to get him towards raw....... but I only made stock once with lamb bones and he wouldn't eat it. I got some winter squashes that I thought I could put in and might help make it taste better - kombocha pumpkin is very rich and meaty. I need help with seasoning and recipes, what to add to make it taste good to the average Joe.

I feel like we have made TREMENDOUS progress considering that the changes in his diet were not self-initiated. It just shows what being an example can do when it comes to eating raw animal foods. My ears are open to all suggestions of any kind on how to help my hubbie heal up his disc, cure his allergies, get mineralized and transition to raw paleo with the most taste and grace. I'd like to pick up the pace of healing.

Diet, alternative therapies, paleo lifestyles, recipes - any old thing that comes to your mind - please don't hesitate to offer.

Thanks!

A friend lent me Aajonus Vonderplanitz book Recipe for Living Without Disease. I have my own chickens and have great eggs but in his book AV says that the "protein in eggs is not utilized for cellular reproduction. They are utilized for regeneration and maintenance and cannot be substituted for meat except occasionally."

He also says that "Freezing food alters, damages, or destroys most enzymes and damages many vitamins. In animal tests, animals fed exclusively uncooked frozen meat developed severe skin problems, including mange. The other group fed the same diet of the same meat but unfrozen remained healthy and vibrant."

AV talks extensively about the dangers of irradiation and eating animals that are not fed their natural diets so it's not like I'm going to be able to go to the store and buy the standard meat.

My dogs although eating an all raw frozen diet DO have skin problems now. 

Slankers sends its meat frozen. All the raw dog foods are frozen. Getting grass-fed meat from the farmer's market - it's all frozen.

A store near me JUST started to carry grass-fed so I have a lot of research to do, but I wonder what the rest of you do besides going out and hunting for yourself? Do y'all just take get a whole animal and what you can't eat you make into high meat or something until it's gone? What do you do about fish? The freezing is what kills parasites and just about all sushi is frozen in this state.

I'm having a hard time figuring out the practicalities. I've got the eggs down from my yard, never refrigerated, bloom on. I've got a great source of grass-fed dairy and figured out how to ferment it properly for digestion. I have not a clue how long you can keep raw meats in the fridge and still have them not get really smelly or two intense for a newbie. I have to go slow with this for the hubbie and not scare him away. The eggs and milk took me a VERY long time to figure out. Would y'all help me some with this meat learning curve please? I've been reading through as many old posts as I can - but I'm still lost and I don't have time to sludge through this the way that I am and help my hubbie the way that I need to.

Thanks in advance.

Is there some place where there's a list of what the color of the stars and the labels that are above members names mean?

I'm very sad that I am no longer an egg thief, because that label described me the best. When I get to shaman could I just stop there? I mean, I'm not much of hunter. Forager, egg thief, gatherer or a fisherwoman maybe but keep me away from being a mammoth hunter please - sounds way too scary. But - if I eventually get to shaman could I just stop there? That fits me almost as well as egg thief. I'm not much for being a chief any time in the future either because they are often the first to die or be killed in a skirmish. 

Of course this is all great fun - but I do get the sense that those stars and labels are supposed to mean something and tell me who's alpha and beta etc so that I can properly roll over and show how submissive I am so I don't get hurt. If there's no place where all the roles and colors are listed in hierarchial order, would someone like to make such a list so that all us low down on the totem pole can socially negotiate more safely the structure of the tribe?

Deep thanks to the elders and leaders for your guidance. 

That's right, the highest up on the food chain I've eaten for the last 20 years has been raw fish - and extremely infrequently at that - and not large servings and I have gone a decade without it and then the other 10 years I could go many months without it. I've been eating raw eggs regularly for a year or two now - because I got my own chickens so trust the quality.

As I re-introduce meat into my generally raw diet, what should I expect? My stomach is now making some pretty outrageous sounds that I haven't heard in a very very long time. Is that normal?

Has anyone else here done similar or can guess what might happen?

I am very healthy so no issues there to consider.

My first meat meal was lightly seared steak.

Are there things that are easier to start with that you can suggest for me?

Btw, I don't want to eat animal species that live with us - dog, cat, rabbit, chickens. Not that most people eat dog or cat - but it is common in other cultures. I am willing to eat insects if I can figure out ways to prepare them that I can tolerate. I understand that they are very healthy to consume and I have raised many of them to feed pets.

Thanks in advance for any help/advice you can give me.