Author Topic: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment  (Read 65414 times)

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Offline Inger

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #100 on: June 10, 2010, 05:41:45 am »
Looks great, your ZC experiment actionhero!   :)

I had no problems with switching to ZC eather, just a bit dry lips and strange taste in mouth.. l) And I was thirsty..

Now I just feel good!
OK, I am eating some wild edibles almost every day. ;) But these have almost no carbs.

I think the same as you with the fruits.. it could be the fiber. Strangely I don't feel any problems with digestion if I eat a occasional organic papaya, I eat the seeds and all. But this happends maybe once/month or something.
I am curios how you will feel about the honey-butter-egg-mix!
It sounds delicious for sure..

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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #101 on: June 11, 2010, 01:02:57 am »
Ok, tried raw butter and didn't like it at all. It just didn't agree with my system. I might or might not try raw honeycomb. But I'm thinking why even bother.
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Offline KD

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #102 on: June 11, 2010, 01:13:02 am »

But I do want to try raw butter, raw honeycomb and high meat on my much improved digestion.
I think I missed a step here, you went out yesterday and got raw grass-fed butter? how/how much did you eat? when and what were the problems etc...?

Offline ForTheHunt

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #103 on: June 11, 2010, 01:52:50 am »
Ok, tried raw butter and didn't like it at all. It just didn't agree with my system. I might or might not try raw honeycomb. But I'm thinking why even bother.

Your system probably needs to get used to it. I would give it a few weeks before you write it off. Although I personally don't eat any dairy.

I had a lot of problems when I ate raw meat for the first time. Heart palpitations, higher blood pressure, fatigue. Same as when I started eating fruit again. Stomach aches, fatigue.

Take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Try things out for your self and then make up your mind.

Offline rawlion

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #104 on: June 11, 2010, 04:37:21 am »
Ok, tried raw butter and didn't like it at all. It just didn't agree with my system. I might or might not try raw honeycomb. But I'm thinking why even bother.

Its not fair! You allocate 6 months for ZC while ruling the butter out just after one meal  ;)

"Some" claim it is so powerful that can even reverse the damage from the poisonous death cap!!! :o
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Offline Ioanna

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #105 on: June 11, 2010, 06:39:14 am »
Your system probably needs to get used to it.

IDK, could say the same for twinkies.

Offline ForTheHunt

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #106 on: June 11, 2010, 07:08:39 am »
Kind of an overstatement.

I'm not advocating dairy. I don't have experience with raw dairy. I'm just saying that dropping something because it doesn't work straight away is not right.

If that was the case I would still be eating SAD this very moment.
Take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Try things out for your self and then make up your mind.

Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #107 on: June 11, 2010, 07:15:56 am »
Emm yeah that's right, I tried 60 gr of raw grass-fed butter on empty stomach and it made me go to the bathroom several times today. Plus it made my body feel dirty and heavy. The ZC euphoria and sense of lightness disappeared in a instant and was replaced by this heavy crap feeling. No way am I touching that stuff ever again.
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Offline KD

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #108 on: June 11, 2010, 08:14:06 am »
I don't really agree with either extreme. I was actually more shocked that you procured it so quickly than the results. here its like you gotta make an appointment to go to a farm or get a delivery. I tend to think butter has potentially detoxifying effects but that argument is not worth discussing in this thread. Even considering that I would agree it is not from experience a high energy type of food and seems to be a roadblock then a benefit right now. Have you tried higher animal fat yet and its effect on energy?

Offline wodgina

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #109 on: June 11, 2010, 09:01:01 am »
I tried butter years ago and ate about 100grams. ruined my day and crapped it out. I had high hopes also.

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Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #110 on: June 11, 2010, 11:20:37 am »
I tried (not raw) anchor butter several times.
It doesn't work for me.
My kids don't like it either.
I stopped buying it.

I don't have access to raw butter.
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Offline RawZi

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #111 on: June 11, 2010, 11:29:39 am »
    I might give raw butter more of a chance if I were you.  I know suet feels like it gets stuck in my chest, and bothers me for hours.  Seems like I don't digest it after either. 

Your system probably needs to get used to it. I would give it a few weeks before you write it off. Although I personally don't eat any dairy.

I had a lot of problems when I ate raw meat for the first time. Heart palpitations, higher blood pressure, fatigue. Same as when I started eating fruit again. Stomach aches, fatigue.

    First time I tried raw (grass-fed cultutred) butter it made me empty my bowels over and over.  Same thing happened every day I ate it for a month.  After that it was smooth sailing.  Raw (fresh grass-fed possibly triple ground) beef gave me reactions the first time.  I still don't do so well with beef.  Pasteurized butter I could eat some of many years ago.  It made me sick when I tried it more recently, so sick, it took me months to recover even though I did not continue eating it. 
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Offline rawlion

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #112 on: June 11, 2010, 05:15:07 pm »
I know suet feels like it gets stuck in my chest, and bothers me for hours.  Seems like I don't digest it after either. 

PRECISELY!!! Suet forms a brick inside of me whereas I hardly notice that I have eaten butter. Moreover, as opposed to suet butter never produces a foul smelling stools. It is by far the most stable animal fat.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #113 on: June 11, 2010, 05:50:21 pm »
I just bought raw honeycomb and will try it later with raw eggs. Yesterday I recovered pretty quickly after eating a large meat meal. As for people who say I should give raw butter some time before I cut it out completely, not gonna happen. So I should endure stomach upset and feeling like shit for a month just so I can eat it? Lol, it's not like it will make me fly or something. I just wanted to test out how I would react to raw butter and now I know. Stupid move and my body let me know. I'm doing better than ever now and don't want to screw up my blood chemistry, hormonal balance or digestion. Just looking for something that could improve it even more.

I was actually more shocked that you procured it so quickly than the results. here its like you gotta make an appointment to go to a farm or get a delivery.

Our country is a dairy country. You can find raw butter on pretty much every market here.   
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Offline KD

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #114 on: June 12, 2010, 01:58:56 am »
that was the part I found somewhat suspicious, truly raw butter will not be able to sit on a shelf anywhere and have any lasting value, its super expensive to produce also which makes it unprofitable to sell much less than 100%. like typical store products.

was it in a package or you bought it from a farmer's market?

according to Real Milk, truly raw dairy is rare in Holland. although the quote here only applies to cheese.

"Raw Cheeses? Real Milk correspondent Rob Hundscheit has compiled a list of "raw" cheeses available in Holland and Germany. However, he warns, "the cheese here is 99% pasteurised or sterilised - even the "raw" cheese here is heated between a temperature between 43 and almost 70 degrees Celcius (102 and 150 degree Fahrenheit).)."
http://www.realmilk.com/where-other.html#nl


I still think you are right to continue with your ZC experiment and what is working, but the argument isn't that you eat it until you get used to it, but that the symptoms are in the end positive. Theres no shortage of disagreement with that especially on this site, but there is a bit of a difference in interpretation there. It also seems to be equally common for the same logic to be applied to eggs, poultry, pork, fruit, fish, seafoods, and water.


Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #115 on: June 12, 2010, 03:39:17 am »
I'm not talking about commercial supermarket butter. When I say market I mean the market in the open where dairy farmer's bring dairy, beekeepers bring honey and candles, and fruit/veg importers bring their stuff. The raw butter is called 'boerenboter' translated 'farmers butter' and you have to ask for it but they do have it.   
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Offline invisible

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #116 on: June 13, 2010, 05:03:45 pm »
rawlion what's your reaction to pasteurized butter? I've never tried raw butter, but react terribly bad to pasteurized butter. Gives me immediate diarrhea and nausea. Tallow on the other hand I don't get such a reaction. So cooked suet is easier to digest for me than cooked butter, but I have never been able to compare raw suet to raw butter, so can only assume from their cooked counterparts. I do however do terrible with raw coconut oil which I believe is more similar to butter than suet.

Offline rawlion

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #117 on: June 13, 2010, 07:09:05 pm »
rawlion what's your reaction to pasteurized butter? I've never tried raw butter, but react terribly bad to pasteurized butter. Gives me immediate diarrhea and nausea. Tallow on the other hand I don't get such a reaction. So cooked suet is easier to digest for me than cooked butter, but I have never been able to compare raw suet to raw butter, so can only assume from their cooked counterparts. I do however do terrible with raw coconut oil which I believe is more similar to butter than suet.

I ate pasteurized butter only a couple of times way back when I was on the conventional diet. I didn't have any problems just as with the other foods.

If I had any diarrhea and/or nausea I wouldn't eat it for sure. Everybody is different.

Under the perfect conditions (i.e. optimal digestion, availability etc.) my priority sources of fats would have been (in a descending order):

- raw bone marrow (from never vaccinated/dewormed preferably wild animals);
- raw tongue/brain (from never vaccinated/dewormed preferably wild animals);
- raw subcutaneous fat (from never vaccinated/dewormed preferably wild animals);
- raw suet (from never vaccinated/dewormed preferably wild animals);
- raw butter (from never vaccinated/dewormed animals);
- raw butter (from yearly vaccinated/dewormed animals at least four weeks after the vaccination).

I think I wouldn't follow the high fat diet if I could only get heated fats or raw non-dairy fats from occasionally vaccinated/dewormed animals.

I make the butter myself. My butter is cultured butter because its is produced from the fermented cream and not from the fresh milk (conventional method).

I only use coconut oil when I feel that my bowels are stuck. It gives me horrible stomach pain, nausea and diarrhea which is just what I am after.

apologies to the author of the thread for straying from the subject
« Last Edit: June 13, 2010, 07:26:15 pm by rawlion »
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Offline miles

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #118 on: June 13, 2010, 07:16:44 pm »
wtf rawlion?
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Offline klowcarb

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #119 on: June 13, 2010, 09:26:42 pm »
Raw bone marrow is my primary source of fat. It is delicious! I have to admit that I don't like raw egg yolks so I -gasp-cook them. So I am 99% raw. I don't like wet food, so I air dry my steaks and ground beef, but I cannot air-dry egg yolks (I do not think). But I love eggs for their nutritional profile and I do not want to give them up because I cannot stand wet yolks. I stay as raw as possible, but still think slightly cooked ZC is healthier than anything else out there, save raw ZC.

Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #120 on: June 13, 2010, 10:31:41 pm »
Update on raw honeycomb. I took a tablespoon of raw honeycomb and mixed it with 4 raw eggs. Tasted very good. I expected an insane sugar high followed by a crash but it didn't happen. No excessive urination or feeling tired, even hours after the drink. Might have something to do with consuming the whole thing not just the honey. One thing I'm noticing is that I'm much less thirsty now compared to when I start my day with a ground beef meal. I was starting to get a bit bothered by being so thirsty and having to drink so much water every day. I've been drinking this raw H&E drink once a day for 3 days now and it somehow takes away the thirst. I might make this raw drink my daily breakfast if no negative things come from it.

apologies to the author of the thread for straying from the subject

Don't worry about it. As far as I'm concerned you are on topic and adding value to the discussion.

Raw bone marrow is my primary source of fat. It is delicious!

A lot of people mention raw bone marrow. I'll have to try it soon.
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #121 on: June 13, 2010, 11:38:12 pm »
... Right now all I'm eating is raw lean meat, raw fatty ground beef and raw eggs
You might want to consider adding some animal organs. Lex includes organs with his ground beef and fat. Iodine, magnesium and salt levels tend to be very low in modern carnivorous diets, so some other foods to consider are seafood (fish, shellfish, seaweed), young greens and/or sea salt, but Lex seems to do fine without these.

Re: raw comb honey, I recommend getting a free blood glucose test kit and then testing your blood sugars before you eat it and 1 and 2 hours afterwards. I noticed only small negative physical effects from eating raw comb honey, but when I tested my BG I found it spiked it terribly--so I don't recommend that you go by your own perceptions only.

...First time I tried raw (grass-fed cultutred) butter it made me empty my bowels over and over.  Same thing happened every day I ate it for a month.  After that it was smooth sailing. ...
Good lord! A single test may be insufficient, but I would never keep eating any food that gave me diarrhea for a month straight!  :o  And even if the diarrhea eventually stopped I would have to wonder what it was doing to my system in an unseen manner at the cellular level.

PRECISELY!!! Suet forms a brick inside of me whereas I hardly notice that I have eaten butter. Moreover, as opposed to suet butter never produces a foul smelling stools. It is by far the most stable animal fat.
In my experience suet digests better when thoroughly chewed (someone here tipped me off that salivary amylase digests fat as well as carbs). It's still harder to digest than marrow, but much less expensive and I don't have a source for grassfed marrow (I buy supermarket marrow every 2-3 weeks, but it seems to be a mediocre product--I'm hoping to try grassfed marrow some day). Suet also tastes better and goes down easier if I air-dry it first. Granted, suet is more difficult to digest than marrow. I fare poorly on pastured, cultured, pasteurized butter, ghee and raw milk. I'm planning on trying raw cultured butter some day, but I'm not hugely optimistic, as none of the pro-dairy claims made here or at other sites have turned out to work for me.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2010, 11:51:06 pm by PaleoPhil »
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Offline rawlion

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #122 on: June 13, 2010, 11:49:44 pm »
I took a tablespoon of raw honeycomb and mixed it with 4 raw eggs. Tasted very good.
You didn't spit out the wax, did you? Whenever I ate the honeycomb in the past I never swallowed the wax. I thought that it might impair the digestion.

I always felt that honey fits much better in with the high fat raw meat diet as compared to fruits. Being an inverted sugar, honey does not ferment in the stomach/intestines and is absorbed easily.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #123 on: June 14, 2010, 07:39:53 pm »
Re: raw comb honey, I recommend getting a free blood glucose test kit and then testing your blood sugars before you eat it and 1 and 2 hours afterwards. I noticed only small negative physical effects from eating raw comb honey, but when I tested my BG I found it spiked it terribly--so I don't recommend that you go by your own perceptions only.

That little glucose machine would tell me nothing about whether it's good for me or not. I'm sure it would say that my blood sugar spiked. But that's why I eat raw honeycomb, to get the pure sugar into my system. If there is no crash afterwards no harm is done. Here's what I mean. Way back when I used to eat a plate of pasta I always felt like I had to take a nap afterwards. I was also gaining weight with pasta/bread in my diet. Fast forward to the fruitarian period when I used to have 15 bananas for breakfast alone and NOT experience a crash afterwards or gain any weight even after months on 2000-3000 kcal of fruit daily. I can tell the pasta was causing harm to my body but the fruit wasn't. I have a magnificent body that has been fine-tuned over millions of years to know what is good for it and what is not. We should not rely on machines to tell us what is right for us. Instinct is king, always has been always will be. 

You didn't spit out the wax, did you?

Nope, I crush the honeycomb with a fork, mix it with raw eggs and drink it.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #124 on: June 16, 2010, 07:06:18 am »
Update on the raw honeycomb. From tomorrow I'm back to 100% ZC. I noticed today after very intense exercise that I'm way less energetic compared to when I'm 100% ZC. The honeycomb does take away my thirst but I'm not thriving as I did on ZC. I guess I'll just have to keep drinking water like a horse, there's no way around it. 
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