Author Topic: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment  (Read 65415 times)

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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #50 on: May 26, 2010, 05:57:30 am »
Day 6 on zero carb. Digestion of raw meat/fat has become very smooth. I thought I had perfect digestion on fruit+raw meat. I never had any discomfort after eating and I falsely thought this meant perfect digestion, lol not even close. It is only now that I realize this. Right now it runs like a well oiled machine. Hunger is nonexistent but when food is eaten it is appreciated by the body.

Another thing I can clearly notice now is how energy is generated. Using sugar for fuel is like a tank of gasoline that is burning up. After a fruit meal you feel propelled to move to get rid of the energy. You can't just sit and do nothing. You feel an urge to move just to get rid of something. I can see how fruitarians interpret this as 'motivation to exercise'. And after the exercise the tank is empty and needs to be refilled.

Right now energy is constant and always there. You do not feel like you have to move just to get rid of something. But if you choose to move the energy is there to fuel you fully. And the best thing is after exercise the energy is still there, that constant smooth flow. This is huge, at least for me it is. The way energy is generated now is like a nuclear reactor. You can draw from it as much as you like and there is still more. So before it felt like a tank of energy that can be emptied with use but now it's like a nuclear reactor where you can draw from as much as you like.

Brain is being powered fully now and I suspect things might get really interesting as my body adapts even more. No wonder some ZCers act like they have discovered some secret nobody else knows about. I'll have to seriously reconsider the value of fruit in diet. But I suspect it will be a rare treat once in a while like some sweet juicy oranges on a hot summer day. Purely for enjoyment but no way the most optimal fuel for the body, not even close.
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #51 on: May 26, 2010, 06:20:49 am »
I have a few questions. What is your ethnic ancestry? How much carbs were you eating daily before this experiment? It seems like your negative symptoms ended after only a few days, do you think you mostly adapted this soon, or do you think this is a temporary up that might be followed by a few more up and down cycles during further adaptation? I ask that last question because when I cut out carbs usually I get a head ache a day or two after starting, which goes away and then I feel good, and if I continue then something else will happen like another head ache or a dizzy spell. The last time I tried zero carb or close to it around 2 weeks in I got a bad dizzy spell at the gym and had to go home early.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #52 on: May 26, 2010, 08:00:47 am »
You didn't read the above properly. The 1st link concerned certain Aryan tribes in India which focused solely on vegan foods, no other foods. And that group in Iran was a tribe, not a religious sect. Although, granted, several religious offshoots(India etc.) have also practised 100% vegan diets throughout history even until now.
Tyler, did you even bother to note the name of the Aryan tribe that was mentioned in the article at that link and did you investigate that tribal name any further beyond that biased Hindu article? Did you also happen to note in the photo what's hanging on the corner of the wall of the hut behind that girl?
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline wodgina

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #53 on: May 26, 2010, 09:03:41 am »
decoration only! TD needs to read his links first before posting.
“Integrity has no need of rules.”

Albert Camus

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #54 on: May 26, 2010, 09:53:30 am »
If you check into these people and learn what they do for a living, the decoration will make sense.  ;D  You know Tyler doesn't like to read his links, which sometimes results in some good laughs.  ;D
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #55 on: May 26, 2010, 05:30:37 pm »
decoration only! TD needs to read his links first before posting.
That's just childish. I did read the article, of course and do read my links. As for the goat, I did in passing assume it was some sort of decoration(normal for antlers to be displayed on walls in the Continent of Europe for example), I guess I was more interested in the female figure in the foreground. But that's by the by. There was that iranian tribe which Halsted mentioned  and, of course, numerous religious sects(some Jainites etc.) which practised vegan diets, throughout history.

And , yes, I did note the name of the tribe  in the article. However, I used different search-terms as regards their diet (re aryan tribes etc.)so only found the vegan references. Ah, it seems that it's only dairy and poultry that was outlawed. I'm surprised why they would call that vegan in the article.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 05:57:24 pm by TylerDurden »
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #56 on: May 26, 2010, 08:11:49 pm »
I have a few questions. What is your ethnic ancestry?

My parents are from the Balkans.

Quote
How much carbs were you eating daily before this experiment?

500-900 kcal from fruit daily
1800-2200 kcal on fruit only days, a couple times a month

Quote
It seems like your negative symptoms ended after only a few days, do you think you mostly adapted this soon, or do you think this is a temporary up that might be followed by a few more up and down cycles during further adaptation?

I'm curious about this myself. Frankly I have no idea what will happen. My previous attempt at ZC was before RPD and followed KGHs PaNu protocol. Cooked meat, fried eggs, whole cream, camembert cheese, grassfed butter. It did nothing for me and I did way better as a fruitarian before that. I still think fruit is awesome but recent experiences tell me it interferes with optimal digestion and absorption of nutrients from raw meat/fat. So if I eat a meal of fruit in the future it is purely for enjoyment and delight of the senses not because I think it is somehow needed or is a superior fuel.

As for what happened to you. Have you tried doing a fruit only day once every 2 weeks on ZC? If you are thriving for 2 weeks and have a fruit only day before the dizziness episode you might not get it at all and be able to have another 2 weeks of kick ass time in ZC land. Then repeat ad infinitum. That way you still continue to develop mitochondria, enjoy the benefits of increased GH secretion, maintain low insulin levels and experience the nuclear-like energy from a fat burning metabolism.                 
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #57 on: May 27, 2010, 08:12:53 am »
I never tried that, but I would think eating just fruit for a day would disrupt fat burning mechanisms. I don't know this for sure but biochemically and anecdotally it seems that the body adapts faster switching from fat to carbs for fuel than it does the other way 'round.

Offline wodgina

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #58 on: May 27, 2010, 04:25:48 pm »
After eating nothing but meat/organs for a few weeks I found fruit made me itchy/hungry/crappy. So every few weeks you can eat fruit and get itchy/hungry/crappy.

There's something to just meat.

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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #59 on: May 27, 2010, 07:03:24 pm »
I never tried that, but I would think eating just fruit for a day would disrupt fat burning mechanisms. I don't know this for sure but biochemically and anecdotally it seems that the body adapts faster switching from fat to carbs for fuel than it does the other way 'round.

I'm not sure it would 'disrupt' the fat burning metabolism. You are merely switching the fuel for a day but the machinery is still fine tuned to burn fat. It's not like the mitochondria will go away in one day just because you have a day of fruit. What drives this is what food is taken in most of the time, so a metabolism adapted to fat has no problem burning sugar for a short period. A fruit meal on a fat burning metabolism can act like nitrous oxide, a turbo boost of energy. Here's what KGH says

Quote
Now here is the good part. When you race, you have new mitochondria and your newly efficient fat-preferring metabolism. Add a moderate carb load and some GU bars if its a long race, and you will be faster than you were before. Glucose is now your nitrous oxide, not your primary fuel.

quoted from

http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/2009/5/18/there-are-no-essential-carbohydrates-even-for-athletes.html

What would however disrupt the fat burning metabolism is having fruit every day. That way you are just confusing the body by switching fuel constantly. And the other negative thing about eating fruit daily is that it seems to interfere with optimal digestion and absorption of nutrients from raw meat/fat. So once in a while fruit is fine and gives a nice boost of extra energy but daily consumption is less than optimal.   
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Offline luis

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #60 on: May 28, 2010, 12:21:36 am »
Does anybody have any idea howlong would it take for someone to get cured of candida on ZC? Since the candida feed on sugar after some time without any, it will die. But how long would that be?

Offline ForTheHunt

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #61 on: May 28, 2010, 01:31:51 am »
My believe is all this candida stuff is nonsense. It's probably real, but I don't think the theory that starving your self of carbohydrates is the right way to go about it.. Believe me I´ve been down that road.
Take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Try things out for your self and then make up your mind.

Offline djr_81

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #62 on: May 28, 2010, 07:54:23 am »
My believe is all this candida stuff is nonsense. It's probably real, but I don't think the theory that starving your self of carbohydrates is the right way to go about it.. Believe me I´ve been down that road.

And for all your conviction that it doesn't work I contend that it does, at least for me. I'm not saying that it solves the problem as it has not done this for me yet but my symptoms greatly diminish and then eventually (over months) disappear when eating strictly carnivore (and low liver intake).
While starving the Candida of carbs may not seem the right way for you I personally think continuing to feed the overgrowth carbs in anything other than tiny amounts can lead to long-term complications. FWIW I would say with 90% certainty my extensive food allergies came about due to Candida-induced permeable gut.

As of late I've been refining things that make a raw carnivore diet easier for me recovering from Candidiasis.
I've found that the intermittent fasting (even in the form of one meal a day) do me no good (maybe I have some adrenal fatigue?) so I try to eat 3 smaller meals a day but at least get 2 in each day.
I've also found that I was eating too high a ratio of lean to fat before. Not only is this important for energy reasons but it's more important because what I wasn't using could feed the Candida. Now that a high percentage of my calories on a given day, perhaps even as much as 85% (I should do the math some day), is from fat I find my recovery this round is hastened.
In order to make "ZC" as successful as can be I need to make sure I get some strenuous activity every day. This can even be a long walk at a brisk pace or a simple hike but you need to keep your systems flowing. If I get enough exercise I sleep less but feel more rested, and vice versa. This same energy helps reduce any lingering brain fog.
I need a bit of sea salt due to low blood pressure.
Lastly, water is your friend. Drink lots of it but in frequent smaller quantities (If I have too much at once it sometimes flushes my guts out). Don't drink 1/2 hour before eating or at least an hour after eating as it fucks up digestion.
These are my guidelines to make things function best as a raw carnivore for me. Your mileage may vary.

Does anybody have any idea howlong would it take for someone to get cured of candida on ZC? Since the candida feed on sugar after some time without any, it will die. But how long would that be?
8ish months solid raw carnivore made me feel like it was gone. A couple binges with fruit over the next month and a fair deal of the symptoms came back. To be honest with you it may very well take years to resolve and I'd still follow a LC/VLC diet for a while after that just to make sure the Candida stays in balance.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #63 on: May 28, 2010, 06:34:46 pm »
Lastly, water is your friend.

This is huge. I drink 5 liters of water right now. A week ago before ZC it was 3 liters. Fruitarians also drink huge amounts of water, around 4-6 liters despite eating fruit all day long. This could be because they urinate 14-20 times a day. SAD eaters I have observed drink only about 1-2 liters and it's mostly soda or coffee, very little water. So not only are they chronically clogged up with toxins from diet related inflammation but they are also chronically dehydrated and not able to flush that stuff out. No wonder they need stimulants all day long.
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Offline djr_81

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #64 on: May 28, 2010, 06:47:01 pm »
This is huge. I drink 5 liters of water right now. A week ago before ZC it was 3 liters. Fruitarians also drink huge amounts of water, around 4-6 liters despite eating fruit all day long. This could be because they urinate 14-20 times a day. SAD eaters I have observed drink only about 1-2 liters and it's mostly soda or coffee, very little water. So not only are they chronically clogged up with toxins from diet related inflammation but they are also chronically dehydrated and not able to flush that stuff out. No wonder they need stimulants all day long.
I drink 1/2 to 1 gallon of water a day but usually err towards 1/2 gallon (~ 2 liters) right now. This is what my body tells me I need so I'm not forcing more beyond that. On a very hot day or a day with lots of strenuous activity I do take in much more.
FWIW I do not exhibit any signs of dehydration with this amount, barring noticeably yellow urine which I attribute to the large amount of fat I ingest, and I've even kept my hypostatic orthotension at bay by upping my water to this level.
I also only urinate 3-4 times per day so I'm obviously using most of that water and not just passing it through me.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #65 on: May 28, 2010, 08:50:01 pm »
For me it's usually 1,5 liter upon arising, 1,5 liter after exercise and throughout the day another 2 liters. Makes me think that some might be experiencing problems on ZC because of insufficient water intake. Could be something those people might look into.
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #66 on: May 29, 2010, 06:56:59 am »
I'm not sure it would 'disrupt' the fat burning metabolism. You are merely switching the fuel for a day but the machinery is still fine tuned to burn fat.

One thing I think you're overlooking is the change in gut bacteria. Your mitochondria can just work on the pyruvate that is produce from the splitting of sugars, but the bacteria in your gut that is adapted to a fat and protein diet with almost no carb content will not be able to digest the carbs as well as the bacteria in a moderate or high carb eaters gut. I don't know what problem that might cause, but I'd guess moderate indigestion at the very least.

Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #67 on: May 29, 2010, 06:52:12 pm »
but the bacteria in your gut that is adapted to a fat and protein diet with almost no carb content will not be able to digest the carbs as well as the bacteria in a moderate or high carb eaters gut

Is this really such a problem? You complained about dizziness on ZC 2 weeks in. If having a fruit meal once in a while prevents your dizziness episode who cares if it's not digested 'perfectly'. I personally wouldn't be bothered by some dizziness. It is probably the last bunch of the sugar critters dying out and asking for a nice load of sugar.
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Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #68 on: May 29, 2010, 08:51:25 pm »
Day 10 on zero carb. I feel that my instincts have somewhat increased in the last couple of days. I feel more aware and in command of the space around me. The last 2 months the biggest changes I've made that have really made a difference are to finish eating before 18.00 and recently going 100% zero carb. My next thing to implement is aligning my sleep patterns with the circadian rhythm. This one might be the most challenging so far. I've been going to sleep at 1.30-2.00 for years now. I want to move this to 21.30-22.00 and get up around 5.30-6.00 instead of 9.30-10.00. I'm very motivated to do this especially after reading Early Rising by Benjamin Franklin. For those interested the book can be read for free

http://books.google.com/books/pdf/Early_to_Bed__and_Early_to_Rise__Makes_a.pdf?id=oLkOAAAAIAAJ&output=pdf&sig=5KU_0tOtO6vswn49YfDKX9XdzJE

 
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #69 on: May 30, 2010, 04:17:31 am »
Is this really such a problem?

I'm saying that it could be. I guess when your experiment is up you could try eating a day of just fruit. Maybe it wouldn't be a problem, maybe it would cause a lot of bloating and not be digested well at all. As for the dizziness, I think it was just temporary and don't think it was that which derailed my zc experiment. I probably went to a party or something and drank beer lol

Offline Nicole_German

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #70 on: May 30, 2010, 03:29:18 pm »
Day 10 on zero carb. I feel that my instincts have somewhat increased in the last couple of days. I feel more aware and in command of the space around me. The last 2 months the biggest changes I've made that have really made a difference are to finish eating before 18.00 and recently going 100% zero carb. My next thing to implement is aligning my sleep patterns with the circadian rhythm. This one might be the most challenging so far. I've been going to sleep at 1.30-2.00 for years now. I want to move this to 21.30-22.00 and get up around 5.30-6.00 instead of 9.30-10.00. I'm very motivated to do this especially after reading Early Rising by Benjamin Franklin. For those interested the book can be read for free

http://books.google.com/books/pdf/Early_to_Bed__and_Early_to_Rise__Makes_a.pdf?id=oLkOAAAAIAAJ&output=pdf&sig=5KU_0tOtO6vswn49YfDKX9XdzJE

 

Hey I think that is an awesome idea with the sleeping pattern! I have been getting up at 5 am every single day (in summer earlier, when the sun rises) since 2007 after years of sleeping in. I feel much more awake throughout the whole day and get much more done! It was actually not as hard as I initially thought it would be!
Hope you will suceed - wishing you best of luck!

Offline Hans89

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #71 on: May 30, 2010, 07:14:59 pm »
I don't think it's hard at all physically, it's just hard in social terms as a lot of social life takes place during the late hours.

Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #72 on: May 30, 2010, 07:28:04 pm »
Went to bed at 24.00 and was planning to get up at 8.00. Couldn't fall asleep until 1.00 but did wake up at 7.00 after only 6 hours of sleep. I was surprisingly well rested and jumped out of bed with enthusiasm to face the day. Franklin was right when he said the world looks fresh and new in the morning. I think making this change of such an ingrained habit is so much easier because of raw zero carb, mostly because of the absence of stimulants and better hormonal function. I probably would not have woken up well rested if I had a supersized mcdonalds meal late last night. I'm only now beginning to reflect back how my past habits from SAD days must have affected my body and mind at the time. Anyways I'll keep this journal strictly focused on my zero carb experiment and not go into details about the sleep stuff. I might mention other positive changes I'm making but the focus of this journal will be the zero carb experience. 
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Offline Paleo Donk

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #73 on: May 30, 2010, 08:46:14 pm »
You can go a step further and spend as much time as possible outside with as little clothes on as possible.

Offline actionhero

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Re: 6 Month Zero Carb Experiment
« Reply #74 on: June 02, 2010, 07:52:56 pm »
Yesterday I visited my mother and she made baby back ribs which is my favorite dish from childhood. It was my first cooked meat in a while and I didn't have any problems with it. I tried eating raw pork some time ago and didn't like it but the baby back ribs tasted heavenly. Today the surface of my tongue feels a bit sore. This could be due to the salt that was on the meat. Haven't had salt for months on raw paleo. No carbs were consumed. It didn't even cross my mind.
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