Author Topic: Vaccination  (Read 52807 times)

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Offline dariorpl

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Vaccination
« on: January 04, 2015, 03:22:14 pm »
What are your thoughts on vaccines?

I've seen some people here refer to them as necessary under bad conditions.

I see them as nothing but venom injected into the body as if it were being delivered by a snake, scorpion or spider.  I haven't seen any conclusive evidence that they do any good, and I have seen lots of evidence that they do plenty of bad. People get all sorts of negative reactions from vaccines that are often minimized or unreported, from mild symptoms to allergies to even paralysis and death. And when you look into what's in them, it's no surprise. Moreover, injecting anything directly into the bloodstream bypasses our bodies' first lines of defense against foreign and toxic substances. Which is why venoumous animals use exactly this method of delivery.

Let me tell you my personal story. When I was 6 years old, my mother told me that we were going somewhere, I don't remember what she said, but I remember I was not concerned about going. Up until then my health had never been a concern, I was a very healthy and strong kid. When we arrived at the hospital, and she told me what they were going to do, I panicked. I wanted out of there. I instinctively knew that this was bad for me. If it wasn't, then why did my mother have to lie to get me to go? They had to drag me kicking and screaming into the vaccination room, where it took two big guys, a nurse, the doctor and my mother to all hold me down at the same time to keep me still enough to inject me. It was a nightmare.

A few days went by, and I was coming home from the swimming classes in the bus that would take all the kids from home to the pool and back. I noticed I had some yellow goo coming out of my arm, where they had injected me, and mentioned it to the kid sitting next to me. I didn't know what it was. He said it was called pus and it meant I was going to die. It made perfect sense to me, after all, I was injected with a poison right in that spot. I was depressed all day. When my mother asked me what was going on, I told her. She calmed my fears and told me I wasn't going to die. I wasn't sure if I should believe her or not; after all, she was the one who tricked me into going, and she held me down along with the others. And she was a doctor. I never trusted doctors.

A few months after that, school had just started, and I began getting colds that would last for months. I would have several every year, so that in total, 6 to 9 months out of the year, I had a cold. This had never happened before. Most of the time, the mucus that I would blow out of my nose was very thick and a dark yellow color, just like the pus coming out of my arm was. It slowly diminished over time until I was 22, when I was only having them 3 to 5 months out of the year, and then they suddenly stopped when I started taking massive amounts of vitamin C supplements. (I'm not taking the vitamin C anymore, I think it probably caused me other problems, and the colds have not resurfaced yet).

I had other vaccines when I was 9, 10, 11, 12 and 15 that probably gave me other health problems or exacerbated them. But the one I had when I was 6 was the one that made the most impact, and it wasn't until recently that I made the connection between the vaccine and my health starting to go down the drain.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 08:29:05 pm by dariorpl »
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Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2015, 06:04:04 am »
dariopl,
Your story is but one of thousands, maybe even millions of like stories.  A friend of mine's son is an autistic child who I have never heard utter a word, but he swings his head around, looks everywhere but at you except occasionally when he looks at you with a completely empty stare which is very disconcerting. He became this way shortly after vaccination. Many PPL complained about this sort of thing and of course the Doctor's union swings back saying there is no proof of any problem despite the fact that they have no reporting system to tally up problems with vaccination.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/12/30/vaccine-injury-compensation-program.aspx
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/12/02/vaccine-court-cases.aspx
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/11/15/vaccine-safety-greater-good.aspx
Lots more pages on that site related to vaccine problems.

The medical mafia thoroughly disgraced one British Doctor,  by publicly making up stories about him and I believe taking away his license when he suggested a link with autism and of course they publicly humiliate any women including Jenny McCarty who have a child change after vaccination, particularly to becoming autistic.

However they were forced to stop when a couple who both happened to be MDs became the first Americans to beat Big Pharma in a court case after their child became autistic post-vaccination.

It is a huge business and now they even force some PPL in the workplace to be vaccinated or to wear around a paper mask all day. We cannot visit our elderly in old folks homes unless we are vaccinated.

The whole thing is based on herd immunity but it is so simple. If someone wants to be vaccinated, fine. Why should I be forced? If the other person is vaccinated, then they should be immune? Well that logic escapes the medical PPL and especially drug companies in a forever search for new business.

Then there is the issue of vaccinated PPL passing the disease to others
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/11/09/ebola-vaccine-downside.aspx

It's like the Ebola scam. They manufactured this "threat" in the media, but then MDs etc from various places in the world went over to Africa bringing Ozone, MMS and Colloidal Silver as well as probably other therapies that easily stopped Ebola in it's tracks. Then the medical Mafia had to do damage control to make sure the natives back in the first world didn't hear about these non-drug therapies, so money changed hands (one guesses).
https://www.bulletproofexec.com/dr-robert-rowen-treating-ebola-ozone-therapy-168/
Cheers
Al

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2015, 11:34:21 am »
*sigh* LOL

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2015, 03:29:12 pm »
My #1 child was vaccinated up to 2 years... we were ignorant then.

My #2 child was vaccinated up to 6 months... we woke up by that time... stopped everything.

My #3 child and onwards no more vaccinations... zero vaccinations... I'm fully awake by this time...

Experiences with illnesses... the 1st child is hands down the sickliest (with to die for episodes) of them all... also had primary complex / TB when he was supposedly vaccinated for it... cured with raw paleo diet with daily plasma muscle blood drinking and beam ray sessions in 2 months.

2nd child has some itches on his skin that never go quite away.

3rd and more have no problems at all.

So in my experience with my children (see their pics in my avatar) ... it seems vaccinations sucked really bad... and the no vaccine camp is a total success for my children.
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Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2015, 03:39:35 am »
Thanks GS.
A friend of mine's wife is a teacher. She has signed a 'no vaccination agreement' for her children, with the school.
Cheers
Al

Offline dariorpl

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2015, 11:48:33 pm »
Thanks everyone for the responses and links, they've been very illuminating.
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Offline raw-al

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Cheers
Al

Offline JeuneKoq

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2015, 07:27:11 am »
... but there is a vein of truth running through it.
Pun intended?  ;D

Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2015, 07:56:06 am »
Pun intended?  ;D
naturellement ;) I guess you got my point
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Al

Offline raw-al

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Cheers
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Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2015, 10:13:57 am »
This guy is on a mission. He is very bright, clear,  and is leading the charge to get rid of vaccines and big pharma. Any doubt as to the cause of autism/strokes etc is clearly dispelled by this guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6Pb2gqbkyk

Vaccine injuries, Dr. Andrew Moulden, Conférence Liberté de Choix en Santé, Montréal, 12 sept. 2009

http://truthalerts.com/dr-andrew-moulden-learning-to-identify-vaccine-damage/
« Last Edit: January 26, 2015, 10:40:52 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Vaccination... Sabertooth... we need you here.
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2015, 10:40:03 am »
I think the main problem with this vaccination "debate" is how many people these days have the opportunity to BET several of their children.

With the "dearth" of children in the urban centers where most internet forum posters usually reside... the fertility rates are way down to usually 1 child per woman.

So they can't really "experiment" / "bet" with enough children on either side of the vaccine debate.

Hopefully you guys can find more parents like me who have bet enough children on either camp... then put us all together and make your statistical graphs.

Sabertooth has a good amount of kids... ask his experience with vaccines.
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2015, 11:03:40 am »
I do understand the risk associated with vaccination, but I have a hard time saying "no" to vaccination. I vaccinated my three children, with the idea that their healthy, whole-foods diet would help them develop the right anti-bodies without devastating peripheral damage.

The problem for me is the memory of poliomyelitis among my peers. I was already a school-age child when the polio vaccines were developed, so I lived among the fear of polio and its effects. It's easy to say "no" to vaccination now that the incidence of diseases like polio are rare, but would the anti-vaccination camp be willing to go back to the old way of death, severe disability, and months on end in an iron lung? Multiply that by all the other severe diseases that we can vaccinate against, and I'm not ready to return to the grim faces and hushed tones of the families whose children contracted diseases like polio, smallpox, and all the other plagues that are nowadays rare.

This is not a perfect world and there are no easy answers, but avoiding vaccines in 2015 seems to be a symptom of forgetting how devastating most diseases were.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2015, 11:18:03 am »
When I got wind of the vaccination debate... my wife and I researched every single vaccine INDIVIDUALLY.   

What happened was one by one we were crossing out each vaccine that failed our research.

Until surprisingly...ALL of the scheduled vaccines were crossed out.

Only then were we convinced all this childhood vaccination crap is a scam.

For polio... our research concluded that "wild" polio was nowhere to be found in the 21st century when our children were being born.  The only cause of polio afflictions in the 21st century was from polio vaccines... especially "live" polio vaccines!  Tragic conclusion!

Therefore... my children would have a much higher chance of getting polio if he / she was vaccinated for polio!  Because the polio vaccine is the primary cause of polio in the 21st century!
« Last Edit: January 26, 2015, 11:26:51 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2015, 11:25:45 am »
For polio... our research concluded that "wild" polio was nowhere to be found in the 21st century when our children were being born.

That's exactly my point! There would have been no near-eradication without the vaccine. Why decide to become a possible carrier for an outbreak when the disease is almost eradicated worldwide?

My sister was a live-vaccine "victim" but her ill health is nothing when compared to my friends who are from the last of the polio epidemics in the US
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Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #15 on: January 26, 2015, 12:08:39 pm »
Eveheart,
Did you watch the video?
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #16 on: January 26, 2015, 02:02:24 pm »
Eveheart,
Did you watch the video?

No, I'm familiar with Dr. Moulden elsewhere. I don't dispute the danger of vaccines. I do not doubt that the single-germ theories of diseases are dead wrong. On a personal level, my sister was identified in an early "group" of disputed live Sabin vaccine-related illnesses, and she survives to this day with some terrible side-effects. However, I believe that, even to this day, the risk of disease is much higher than the risk of vaccine if the disease rose to epidemic levels, and I see the trade-off at a different point than the anti-vaccination group sees it.

I also think there is a danger in changing horses in the middle of the stream: abandoning vaccination prior to eradication is unwise IMO unless "all" of us start living disease-resistant lifestyles. I just don't see any great rush to avoid the real causes of disease, and until a safer "magic bullet" comes along, we should use the one (vaccination) that seems to be eradicating diseases without some miraculous shift in human nature.


"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline van

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2015, 02:54:29 am »
in my area where skunks carry rabies,   I'm not disappointed at all in being required to vaccinate my dogs for rabies.   Without studying it more, I can well imagine dead cell viruses without mercury as being fairly harmless and at the same time stimulating the immune system to be on guard with antibodies.  Just read an interview with Andrew Weil where he faults the government for not coming up with a vaccination sooner for E Boli.     It's easy to criticize vaccinations, but if you had the disease you might think differently.  For the record I haven't had one since high school.

Offline raw-al

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2015, 03:07:27 am »
Eve,
Diseases will never be eradicated. They often just change the names and morph. You cannot prevent PPL from being sick and it has nothing to do with the microbes.

Improvement in standard of living in cities with more food and better housing and sanitation is the reason for reduced incidence of disease nowadays. The reason that we live longer is that these things and various methods of combatting childhood infections is responsible for the increase in lifespans.

What gives someone the right to force you to do what they think is right? That is what is being done with vaccination?

My friend, an MD, has a coworker who is forced to go to work wearing a mask all day because she has adverse reactions to vaccines. You cannot go visit old folks homes unless you are vaccinated. Some PPL are not allowed to work unless they are vaccinated. Yet every mid november it is announced that Ooops they got the wrong vaccine.... sorry but there are still supplies left so hurry and get your that are provided free by the "Government".

I think that maybe if you had a chance to have a chat with a friend and coworker of mine who has an autistic child you might change your mind. It all started just post vaccination. The child looks totally bizarre, is incapable of any human reaction, will be a large infant till death, requiring constant attention.

I could go on....

Van,
You might want to listen to this interview of the author of the second link...

http://vitalitycapsules.com/radio-show-vaccinosis
http://www.amazon.ca/Mark-Beast-Hidden-Plain-Sight/dp/1448644534

I suspect that since you are on this site that you feed your pet a more substantial diet than most and thus it is likelier to be healthier.
Cheers
Al

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Girl got vaccinated early January 2015... died January 18, 2015
« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2015, 03:57:53 am »
Girl got vaccinated early January 2015... died January 18, 2015... put it all together and you know the true cause of her death.

New for 2015

Nevada girl, 5, dies from flu strain she was vaccinated against
Sunday, January 25, 2015, 6:18 PM

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/health/girl-5-dies-flu-strain-vaccinated-article-1.2091435

 A five-year-old girl from the Las Vegas area died Tuesday after coming down with the strain of flu she had been vaccinated against earlier this year.

Kiera Driscoll started showing symptoms including a cough and fever on Jan. 18, according to KVVU. Her family took her to a walk-in clinic on Monday, and she was given a nebulizer and steroids.

However, Kiera collapsed later that day. Her mother performed CPR while they waited for the ambulance.

The little girl’s health worsened after she was hospitalized and she passed away on Tuesday from influenza A, her family said.

Kiera’s family said the spirited kindergartner had received her flu shot and did not have any underlying illnesses.

« Last Edit: January 27, 2015, 04:24:42 am by goodsamaritan »
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Offline dariorpl

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2015, 07:12:09 pm »
eveheart, van: How do you know that vaccines prevent disease? I've looked for consistent evidence on that but haven't found it.

Polio rates were going down before the introduction of the polio vaccine, and the decline slowed down after the vaccine became mandatory.

We may not have a lot of polio today, but there are many other types of diseases that were uncommon or less common back in the day. Everything from cancer to diabetes to ADHD to poor eyesight. You see plenty of people today in their mid 20's who's hair has all turned gray or white or has fallen out or thinned out to the point of baldness (natural color hair dyes and wigs made from real human hair at record high sales). People in their late 20's and early 30's are losing teeth like it's childhood all over again. Most women 21 and older (when they don't have a ton of makeup covering it up) have sagging bags and/or dark colored bruising below their eyes. Allergies, autism, heart attacks, kidney and gallbladder stones, Alzheimer's, IBS, appendicitis, mega-obesity, athsma, infertility, impotence in young males (24 year olds taking viagra), lack of an ability to properly lubricate in females (22 year olds using artificial lubricants), athletes dropping dead during warmup... Could it be that it's vaccines that are a significant factor causing some of these epidemics?

I don't mean to say that vaccines cause everything bad, or that they are the sole or main cause of everything bad, but it's a fact that as vaccines have gotten more widespread, and as we vaccinate our babies, kids, teens and adults against more diseases and in more occasions, most types of disease and health problems have skyrocketed. There might be a causal connection here, at least for some of the health issues.

Long term, proper double blind studies to compare the pros and cons of vaccines have never been done. In most cases they haven't even been done to prove effectiveness against the particular disease that the vaccine supposedly prevents. The labs say it would be "unethical" to engage in such studies, because of the concept of herd immunity. So effectiveness is assumed from the get-go, and then -after probably a large bribe from the pharmaceutical companies- the politicians make it mandatory to take them (forced inoculations) and/or mandatory to pay for them (by making them free, which means you have to pay for them through taxes). This doesn't inspire my trust in vaccines.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2015, 08:12:46 pm by dariorpl »
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #21 on: January 27, 2015, 07:59:34 pm »
I base my logic on what "we" knew back then - that poliomyelitis was literally lurking in unknown places and could strike relentlessly. In today's world, we have seen this with "deadly" diseases such as AIDS and ebola. The mental climate demands that something be done. In the case of vaccines, this was what "we" felt was the best possible solution. Any decision made in that panicked atmosphere is going to be flawed, but does vaccination's imperfections make it wrong?

The wisdom of a few is never the wisdom of the whole group ("we"). Decisions trend towards the mainstream, so what you decry as an unwise treatment is simply a less wise treatment. Vaccinations and other pharma products get developed, tested, and approved by the mainstream, even though there are better choices.

GS's obituary roll call could be applied to each of the diseases for which "we" have developed vaccines. Utopia eludes us, and I prefer to get over my indignation and carry on.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #22 on: January 27, 2015, 09:22:23 pm »
Eve,
Diseases will never be eradicated. They often just change the names and morph. You cannot prevent PPL from being sick and it has nothing to do with the microbes.

When I used the word eradicated, I intended to employ its epidemiological meaning.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2015, 10:08:13 pm »
Younger people here need to understand older people like middle aged me and senior Eve.

I grew up without internet.  Just so happened I'm a computer geek and I was there at the birth of the internet.  In 2001 when my first child was born... I had absolutely no idea... never heard that there was a debate AGAINST vaccines.

The only time I was made aware was around 2004 when we were exploring Steiner Education / Waldorf School and there were books warning against vaccines... that in fact our neighbor, a teacher in that school was aware of how vaccinations were bad, and that the very school she is training to be a teacher did not promote vaccinations either.

Beginning there in 2004 my wife and I sought out information on various sides of the debate and researched per vaccine... one by one.  We got books.  We talked to other people.  We listened to both sides and made our choice.

My parents... maybe the same age as Eve... had zero internet during that time they were having children.

« Last Edit: January 27, 2015, 10:29:16 pm by goodsamaritan »
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Offline eveheart

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Re: Vaccination
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2015, 02:13:27 am »
Even without internet, we had magazines like Prevention and radio/TV shows with people like Adele Davis, Jack LaLanne, Carlton Fredericks, and Gary Null. I grew up in a church that was against vaccination, so the choice was always there to file a religious exemption, which was done easily. The information is not new, only that the internet made it easier to find what you were looking for. I used to hang out at libraries, even large university libraries, to get the information now that I can get on PubMed.

My first internet search (c. 1988) was on the topic of binge eating disorder - the good research then came from the University of Toronto, which I visited from my computer in Los Angeles. This was when a modem looked like a cradle that held the handset of a landline phone at speeds up to 1200 kb/s. This was when you booted your computer from a floppy. This was before Yahoo! and other search engines, so we'd go to university portals all over the world and FTP their files, and you had to configure the file-transfer-protocol packet information by hand.
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