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Science / Re: Betaine for working out and for weak stomach acid
« Last post by Eric on Today at 09:02:29 am »
Derek, how does the intestinal juice taste? I helped slaughter a goat last fall and came very close to trying some from the carcass, but the goat was slaughtered as part of the class and the instructor made it clear that it was not acceptable for me to do that. (I had co-taught that class with her the year prior, and ate from the carcass freely while we taught students how to quarter and de-bone the animal. That did not go over well with the students.)
Journals / Re: Lex's Journal
« Last post by townhouse on Today at 07:56:47 am »
Lex, thanks for the detailed journal.  I'm about to attempt to make pemmican, so of course found & downloaded your pemmican guide.  Would you make any amendments it (published in 2009)?  Is it advised to construct a similar jerky grinding machine that's described in that guide?  If so, any advice on doing that?

Thank you for any advice!!
Science / Re: Betaine for working out and for weak stomach acid
« Last post by sabertooth on Today at 07:50:11 am »
I believe that stomach acid insufficiency can be a sign of mineral imbalance or deficiency...its difficult to tell for sure if it is a cause or a symptom There seems to be a catch 22 in that being mineral deficient inhibits the production of digestive enzymes that help breakdown foods for optimal mineral absorption.

There are typically a number of factors involved in these conditions that prevent an easy fix, like supplementation of a combination of enzymes or minerals, from being a long term solution.

I suffered from weak digestion for years and believe it was from a combination of being mineral and bacterial deficient, along with congested liver and eating the wrong foods.

I would recommend if possible trying fresh bile, I know there is freeze dried stuff on the market but if you really want to get the digestion going without risk of burning a whole in your gut, the raw stuff works much better.

I noticed a combination of fresh liver, pancreas, blood, and a shot of bile will allow me to gorge on large amounts of meat and fat without issue. I will also eat bones dissolved in vinegar for added minerals, and eat raw stomach smoothies for good bacteria. The green ingesta juice collected from the intestines is full of digestive enzymes and can be used as a natural digestive aid. (for those brave enough to try it, a shot of green intestine juice, with fresh squeezed lemon, and a raw egg on top is a good digestive primer before a large meal)

Perhaps during transitional phases some supplementation may be helpful, but try to opt for a more diet based approach if possible.

Science / Re: Betaine for working out and for weak stomach acid
« Last post by norawnofun on Today at 07:38:26 am »
I do have quite some experience with low HCI as well. I tried ACV, Red wine vinegar, Lemon, Orange juice, Grapefruit juice, a juiced gingershot made with lemon, apple and ginger, beet juice, beet juice with carrot and ginger, raw corn on cob, sparkling water (both, naturally sparkling and added carbonation), certain red wines (syrah and carbernet sauvignon were best), and also bought 2 HCI brands. One from thorne (porcine source) and the other one from premier labs (beetroot source) among some mixes of the above like orange juice with lemon, acv with lemon juice and so forth..

I took some of these things for over a year and here are my observations:

1. Apple cider vinegar and lemon. They seem to help but in my experience they don´t in the long run. Especially ACV as it can surpress hunger and made my stomach bloated. So I didn´t want to drink it anymore when I drank it before a meal (also tried with and after a meal) even though I was hungry a couple of minutes earlier. That´s a problem if you then start to eat, since your digestive juices in the mouth do not prepare the stomach for the foods what´s about to come. So you eat and you cant digest it since the hunger feeling is gone. IMO it can replace HCI, but at the same time represses your own. Bad idea. Same with lemon and red wine winegar.

2. Orange juice and grapefruit juice (g is more acidic and less sugar) help digestion too but you get a lot of sugar and you are then dependent on them. I also observed that they surpress my own HCI.

3. The gingershot was helping as well, especially due to the ginger but same thing here. However, just biting into one ginger and leaving it in the mouth for several minutes after a meal helps A LOT more to enhance digestive juices/enzymes

4. Beet juice on its own did nothing, but juice with beets, carrots and ginger helped quite a lot. But it was such a mess and hazzle to do this that i stopped.

5. Raw corn on the cob. Worked really great, however, it´s expensive to get organic so it wasn´t feasible and practical (ur not gonna carry around raw corn on the cobs all the time ur out)

6. I tried several naturally and carbonated waters. I read that the carbonated ones are acidic (I assume the natural ones as well). They seemed to work since they made the food move through the intestines quickly which makes space in your stomach and therefore you feel you need to eat more. So more hunger more gastric acid is produced (at least in my theory). Only problem is that when you drink sparkling water (even naturally sparkling) all the time it hurts or maybe even inflames your intestines. Bad idea when u got inflamed intestines already.

7. Certain red wine grapes (which are more acidic) can help digestion tremendously. I would say 1-2 glasses were ok. The food got properly digested and the wine grapes themselves have digestive abilities which help digestion further down the digestive tract. Only problem is too much alcohol is no good when ur not fully healthy and it becomes expensive. Sleep however was great on 1-2 glasses as digestion was very fast and smooth.

8. As mentioned i tried 2 types of HCI. The porcine source made me blocked and bloated (maybe the pork source) and the other one I initially cut out too. However, I started the other one again, this time on a different time interval. That´s 30-45 minutes after food. And so far it works well but I would be careful as it has already been mentioned when you don´t have much stomach lining.

Basically what I can conclude at this stage is that most of these substitues are no good. What you want is your own body to produce enough HCI himself, not lower it by taking substitutes. You might think ACV helps, but it makes things worse. Since I cut out ACV and lemon juice for example, my body produces HCI by himself more and more it seems. I just made this discovery a couple of days ago and I still experiment with the HCI supplement, but I want to cut it out asap as well. Even when ur older you should produce your own HCI, not depend on supplements. Do tribes that eat a RVAF diet use supplements when they get older? No.

I think the most important thing to reproduce your own HCI is by NOT taking supplements, but by teaching your body how to produce it naturally again. I think one crucial thing is the need for hunger, since saliva is produced which is the first step, and how fast the digestive process is (let say food moves through the intestines). IMO that can be enhanced with fats and fiber. When I was eating a lot of bread and grains (like pasta which has a lot of sauce and olive oil) my digestion was super fast and great (aside of the accumulating inflammation which then fucked up digestion), but moving food through the intestines fast mainly with the help of fats or fiber, foods high in magnesium and therefore the peristaltic movement is crucial. I recently looked into food challenges. You know, the people which can eat a shitload of food very fast. Their stomach acid must be incredible and the digestion must work super fast. Otherwise there is no way you can stuff that much in such a short time without puking it all out in a couple of minutes. So I think the key is finding out how they do it and apply it to yourself by eating healthy foods. I also noticed that what I once read you should never do actually turned out to be more beneficial than anything. That´s drinking still water with meals. Especially cooked meals (which I eat since they are easier to digest than raw foods on low HCI).

So to recap. I think the key to get your stomach acid levels back to top class is by drinking a big glass of water before food (which increases the activation of saliva and digestive enzymes according to my experiments), then eat bigger portions more frequently (bulking up) step by step with plenty of fats AND fiber (fiber in form of tigernut flour and nuts to replace the fiber in breads) together with water. That would make things move fast and fast digestion means more hunger, means bigger portions which signals the body to produce more HCI naturally. During that time you could add HCI and digestive bitters (which i found very helpful but still didn´t finish experimenting with) and maybe magnesium if food travels too slowly through the intestines and ur not eating enough foods high in magnesium (if u for ex. are intolerant to certain foods), then slowly lowering these 2/3 supplements until you notice that your body produces HCI naturally again. Once that is done you could cut out the starch/fibers of the tigernut and nuts and eat raw fats and meats only. But in my experience its better to eat a cooked paleo diet first, since the collagen is broken down due to cooking which makes digestion a lot easier on low HCI, then once digestion/HCI is back up you switch to raw meats and raw fats, fully heal and u reached ur goal.

I also think that just taking digestive bitters without HCI could help a lot, that would also be healthier than a HCI supplement. I ordered one recently and will provide an update once tested properly. And then there is the issue of candida and parasites. I think if you have an overload of them your body can´t produce enough HCI in the first place. So you need to lower the "bad bacteria" candia level by cutting out all fruits except maybe lemon and papaya for lets say a month, at the same time kill the malicious parasites (i think not all are bad) and then you have the whole package to heal.

The idea of intelligent design manifest in ways that superseded the limitations of the genetic blueprint model of understanding of how the spirit of life was "created"/"evolved". There are many semantical hangups around the concept of  "intelligent design", stemming from the indoctrination of most western science into a dogmatical mechanistic Universal misconception, that "intelligence has be created", when it is more feasible that the intelligent structuring of the genetic molecule organically evolved from its own inner beginning as primitive strands of self organizing, free associating RNA, before forming itself into the increasingly complex DNA superstructures which eventually lead to the genesis of self aware multicellular organisms.

There is simply no need for the myth of a designer/creator when viewing life as a sui generis phenomenon, where the fundamental energy of the cosmos crystallizes itself within the living genetic matrix. Creating the complexities found within all of lifes forms through a process of ever evolving feedback mechanisms, which attain higher degrees of intelligence through the succession of transgenerational reproductive synthesis.

Its also very misleading to view all the living organisms as separate entities, whose existence can be entirely explained by the mainstream modes of darwinian evolution. The idea of "natural selection" in which the divergent strains of DNA, we call separate species, are all randomly mutating, competing and evolving as separate and autonomous"creatures", is an archaic and oversimplified theory which needs to be seriously revised if biological scientific understanding is to progress to its next stage of evolution.

The question shouldn't be a matter of "if life has within it an element of intelligent design?", instead one should ask exactly when did the building blocks first become alive and once alive when it they begin to manifest intelligence? There must of been a transition from ignorant and Random connections between proto Genes within the primordial soup, to the emergence of intelligently designed micro RNA managed epigenetic adaptations.

Perhaps there are yet to be discovered biofeedback mechanisms which direct the actions of epigenetic adaptation, in ways still not understood. Our modern instruments are not sophisticated enough, nor our top researchers endowed enough with the visionary intelligence needed to formally discover these deeper connections, behind what drives the creative genesis of life.

The mainstream genetic model is a primitive stick figurine representation, of forces beyond comprehension. There are theoretical assumptions as to how exactly the blue print of life was originally drafted....the mechanistic tic tock view seems to prevail in much of academia...synthesised proteins regulated by a clockwork, endless junk gene jargon. Much of what is taught in the universities regarding biology is fascinating...the cellular models full of organelles, the micro machines transporting proteins to and fro...yet behind all the interesting forms and formula taught to the children at school, the origin of the living creation remains elusive.

The idea of sudden planetary level genetic shifts, isn't so far fetched once it is realized how interconnected everything is... periods of hyper-speciation, collective epigenetic mutation, evolutionary quickening have always occurred and will continue to occur. To what degree these events shape life on earth is not certain, and much of the evidence is not accessible to our instruments and so can only be speculated upon.

Earth life has undergone inumerable wave of mutilation events....triggered by innumerable factors....over innumerable ages. Each epic event encounter leaving indelible marks upon the genetic codes of the mutated, mutilated, and adaptive. In the aftermath of each generations apocalypse, life's lessons are learned....then burned and buried into genes, passed to the next generation. Somewhere out of dark and obscure origin the freedom of choice is formed, in the binary decisions "to be latent?" or "to be active".  The primordial building blocks that once seemed merely mindless and randomly self replicating automata, had awoken into intelligently reactive self aware creators of their own destiny.

These feedback Mechanisms were developed on the cutting edge between life and death, as it moved through thriving to dieng some point the accumulation of beneficial mutation reached a critical mass, becoming intelligently capable of perceiving environmental demands and proactively modulating the genetic code in a kind of educated guess as to what the most beneficial mutation may be. The genes of the most successful of these early attempts were shared by survivors in viral fashion from form to form, infecting the future generation with a greater will and innate capacity to survive. This spirit, once formatted; replicated and transfromed itself into the whole of the Gaian matrix.

Its important to note that this capacity for intelligent design which directs the course of evolution is in no ways is above so is below.....The intelligence of the Genetic code can be related in some ways to the intelligence of the humans it created.... much in the same way our theories of how the universe works are in many ways based on "educated guesses", the way genes are modified through biofeedback guided epigenetic adaptation, is based upon educated guesses which draw upon genetically embedded latent lessons of what worked in the past. Sometimes these guesses are wrong and the environment changes unexpectedly....or else there is some glitch in the basic program that inhibits optimal adaptation from such cases of failure to properly adapt, natural selection is used to eliminate the non viable experiments. Though natural selection does play a key role in the process of evolution, its accompanying theory of mutation being entirely random is a baseless assumption.

Just as human experimentations have basic theories and hypotheses behind them, it is possible that these mutations are not totally random and are under the creative effort of an undiscovered intelligence. Also, just as we can never fully predict the outcome of our own intelligently designed experimentations, neither could the aspirations of our genetic forbearers ever predict the nature of the progeny their efforts produced....and just as the lower forms are entirely unaware of the creative intelligence of the higher forms, perhaps there is an even greater intelligence at the superorganism level that is way beyond our own awareness....if such a superintelligence did exist it may not even be able to perceive of us on a human level, much in the same way from our humanly jaded perspective, we could never perceive the true nature of the awareness of the lower forms.(as is below so is above, ad infinitum)

Off Topic / Re: Raw Paleo Diet Forum Statistics
« Last post by van on Today at 04:24:26 am »
I found your #number four amusing, if not spot on.   The starch topic is a wild ride.  One that will probably take years to unravel as the iterations are infinite.   But for those who might be curious, you might like to check out Paleomedicina's website, and thus, their viewpoint.  Warning;  it is the exact opposite of what Phil was recommending.   For the record, I don't have an opinion yet, but do find the 'science' fascinating. 
Science / Re: Betaine for working out and for weak stomach acid
« Last post by van on Today at 04:19:23 am »
I agree on the HCL helping out in the beginning.   I did the same and tapered off to none.   Now I let the natural stop inform me when eating one piece after another how much I can digest.  That stop I believe informs more than just how much HCL is available, but a host of other factors probably so numerous or beyond imagination.   That's why I continually suggest eating and chewing thoroughly one piece after another to enable the stop to present itself. 
   It can be like smoking pot though,, "oh I'll just smoke a couple of times to expand or reset my consciousness and then I'll quit...."
Off Topic / Re: Raw Paleo Diet Forum Statistics
« Last post by Eric on Today at 02:17:15 am »
I think the decrease in involved members and posts stems from a few things, in no particular order:
1. Social media sites like Facebook provide the equivalent of 1-stop shopping, so are outcompeting sites like this for people's attention,
2. People grow tired of being back-stabbed and harangued by certain folks on this forum, so invest their time elsewhere,
3. People who see the benefits of eating more raw food often see the benefits of other things like staring at computer screens less, spending more time outdoors, interacting with actual people more, etc.
4. People avoid this site because some of its moderators use the site to plug unrelated political and conspiracy theory silliness,
5. People seem to be attracted more to audio and video as means of sharing information

I suspect I could come up with more reasons, but these are a good start. I used to post here a lot. Not so much anymore. I do plan on starting a YouTube channel though, and already have a podcast.

As far as whether Phil's theory about starches holds water, his thinking on that evolved over time so it is hard to characterize it as a static theory. Is there a particular post or set of posts you were curious about?
Journals / Re: Fenrir's Journal
« Last post by a_real_man on Yesterday at 11:55:07 pm »
More than anything I feel a strong need for emotional connection in my life but I struggle greatly to connect with people in my age group, I just lack any interest in most things that most people today concern themselves with and then I've got strange facets of my life including the whole raw diet and a few other manifestations and I never really have connected well with most people before all this, I do have friends and I have been growing closer with them in recent time but don't feel a connection on any incredible level yet, and I haven't been intimate with a girl in almost a year. Its not that I'm antisocial I'm outgoing I talk to people all day long at work, I have lots and lots of acquaintances, and I get numbers of people I'm sexually attracted to all the time, its just that none of it ever leads anywhere I just don't click with anyone. I know that I don't need anybody and really my primary goal is to find happiness on my own in a sustainable real tangible form, but I get lonely at the same time.

Where do you live, my friend? If I could give my two cents on connecting with people, in my view it's a matter of motivation and commonalities. It's pretty straightforward to understand what I mean by commonalities. To explain motivation, take for instance successful salespeople. They manage to connect with people from all walks of life, on a variety of topics. They don't necessarily have these hobbies in common, but they succeed in connecting because they take a strong interest in what people are doing. In other words, what allows them connect with people is the strong motivation/interest to do so, financial in this case. As long as you don't have a genuine interest in connecting, you will have difficulty connecting. I know I have. Hope this helps.
Science / Re: Betaine for working out and for weak stomach acid
« Last post by surfsteve on Yesterday at 11:52:49 pm »
I agree. Caution always. Though actually rather than becoming dependent on it and having to take it all the time I've read that taking betaine HCL will stimulate your body to produce it's own HCL and that you can take less as time goes on and may even be able to quit taking it. Generally the older you become the weaker your stomach acid. I think most of us on this forum eat a lot of meat and would benefit from having a high stomach acid. You are not what you eat. You are what you assimilate.

The main way I take lemons is to slice them with the peelings and dehydrate them in my drier. My mouth wants to eat more of them than my teeth can handle so I grind them up and sprinkle them on meat and fish.
More expensive than the brand I bought but had some nice reviews.

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