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Messages - dariorpl

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151
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 08, 2019, 09:29:27 pm »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 04:45:00 pm
Just equivocation as chewing is not the same as juicing.


It's about the same if you discard the pulp after pressing and drinking the juice.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 04:45:00 pm
Besides, non-herbivores have no reason to chew plant foods.They simply don't have all the teeth necessary for thet.

Nonsense, I can chew plenty of plant foods easily even though my my teeth and gums are far from being in optimal health condition.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 04:45:00 pm
GCB was not perfect and did indeed recommend sweet fruits himself and even recommend against raw meats at one time, but his actual Instincto philosophy of eating only via taste/instinct is correct.

He arbitrarly claims some foods are non initial even though similar versions would've existed in the wild, and supports others that wouldn't have. And again, the whole notion that humans in the wild would have a whole buffet of hundreds of wildly different foods that grow in entirely different seasons and climates to choose from, at every single moment of every single day, 365 days a year, and that our instincts would be geared towards optimally consuming such foods, is ludicrous.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 04:45:00 pm
The claim re people eventually only eating raw sweet fruits is nonsense

I didn't say only sweet fruits. I said very high amounts. Go in the wild and tell me how many supersweet, mostly seedless, ripe fruits you find, and how many months a year does that happen and in what amounts you find them.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 04:45:00 pm
OH, and I stillf ar prefer the taste of raw fruit juices than any raw veggie-juices, even things like cucumber etc.(I have tried a large number of variations over time).

Of course you do, and it's still completely unnatural.

152
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 08, 2019, 06:59:45 am »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 08, 2019, 06:51:08 am
GCB in his wisdom banned raw veggie juice in the first place as juicing is a process and he only recommended unprocessed foods. GCB was nothing like AV, imo.

He was full of contradictions, claiming for instance that chewing a vegetable, drinking the juice and discarding the pulp was somehow unnatural, even though plenty of people have the natural instinct to do just that.

He was also unaware that our instincts were developed for a completely different set of circumstances, one where food wasn't as widely available and where the choice wasn't just to eat one thing or another as a wealthy person, but whether to eat at all or not. He also fails to recognize that super sweet fruit is very rare in nature, and even mildly sweet fruit is only available seasonally, except in the tropics and up the trees where monkeys and birds and squirrels and bats get it far before we are able to. He also fails to recognize that shipping fruit from all over the world, all year round, to your doorstep anytime you want by just pressing a button, is completely unnatural also.

If you follow GCB's philosophy entirely, like AV warned, you will find yourself eating larger and larger amounts of highly sweet fruit, which is completely unnatural and doesn't lead to long-term health.

In any case, what I meant is that in your juice experiment, you juiced vegetables that you would never have been able to chew yourself, and then you probably forced yourself to drink the juice even though it didn't taste good at all, and forced yourself to drink way more than your body could handle. AV's recommendations towards juicing would make a juice mixture that you would be able to chew yourself if you had the time and energy and had good healthy teeth / gums / jaw. AV Also said never to gulp anything, including juice, but to sip it instead, giving your body time to assess the effects and quantities, and to properly utilize the nutrients. Sipping mimics the rate at which the juice would be consumed if you were chewing the vegetables yourself.

153
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 08, 2019, 04:20:02 am »
You fail to recognize that AV's advice regarding juicing is actually pretty similar to GCB's philosophy. Mild tasting vegetables make up the bulk of the juice for a reason. If you take a bunch of really strong tasting vegetables that you would never be able to chew on your own due to how awful they would taste, and juice them, then drink the juice forcing yourself to ignore the strong bitter or pungent taste, and have way more of it than your body is able to handle, then yes you're going to have problems.

Don't blame AV for what you did because it's completely different to what AV suggested, and he even warned that many people made that mistake.

154
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 08, 2019, 01:21:02 am »
You can claim whatever you want, but don't say AV's advise regarding veggie juice is bad when you did exactly what he said not to do, in larger amounts than he recommended, and got the results he said you would get by doing what you did.

In synthesis, your juice was too strong and you had too much of it. Of course you were going to have issues.

155
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 08, 2019, 12:06:55 am »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 07, 2019, 11:15:08 pm
Juicing exerts far more pressure and really cuts into the cell-membranes, thus releasing more antinutrients/nutrients than chewing. Bear also in mind that we do not have the kind of chewing power re teeth etc. that herbivores like sheep do.

Our teeth, jaws, tongue etc, if in optimal condition are perfectly capable of "juicing" most vegetables. I don't think you're talking about slow masticating juicers when you say they exert a lot more pressure or cut deeper into cell membranes.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 07, 2019, 11:15:08 pm
Back in my PD group days, I used to encounter a large number of Primal Dieters who would consume more than a pint a day of raw veggie juice.

Per day yes, per sitting no. Even in his recipe book from 2002 he recommended as little as 1/4th of a pint per sitting, 3 times a day, and 3/4ths per sitting as the absolute maximum for people who needed more. And later on he started recommending even smaller amounts of juice in general.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 07, 2019, 11:15:08 pm
As regards the veg I used for raw veggie juice, it was a wide choice of carrots, radishes, but mostly greener veg like kale cucumber or whatever. It was a long time ago, so memory isn't great. I will agree that I never had issues with raw fruit juices.

That's not how AV recommended to mix your juices and in fact he strictly said not to do that. Cucumber is the only one out of all those which you should have a large amount of in your juices. And he said you should never juice fruits, except in small amounts and for particular formulas, as that makes the sugars rush into your bloodstream too fast.

156
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 07, 2019, 10:08:49 pm »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 07, 2019, 10:04:10 pm
A slow juicer is rather more extreme than chewing re pressure . Besides, most people don't spend ages chewing plant foods.

I don't see how it's more extreme, and plenty of people, myself included, have the natural instinct to chew vegetables like celery or carrots, drink the juice and discard the pulp.

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 07, 2019, 10:04:10 pm
Re my raw veggie juice experience:- I had 1 pint of raw veggie juice a day for several days - I also tried other times when I drank less a day or more a day, but not all at the same time .

What combinations and amounts of vegetables did the juice consist of?

And were you aware that AV never recommended more than 1/4th to 3/4ths of a pint as the absolute maximum per sitting?

157
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 07, 2019, 07:16:18 pm »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 06, 2019, 10:43:09 am
AV was often wrong and not in tune with the real experiences of most RVAFers. In the case of raw veggie juice, DPL is, of course, wrong. Juicing breaks down the cell-walls , thus making not only the nutrients but also the antinutrients  in raw vegetables far more bioavailable.

How is a slow masticating juicer like the greenstar any different in this regard than chewing? I know you're not a fan of chewing meats extensively but surely you don't think the same about fibrous plants like celery?

Quote from: TylerDurden on March 06, 2019, 10:43:09 am
Incidentally, I got diarrhea, too, after consuming raw veggie-juice.

What did your juice consist of and how much did you drink?

And was that the only time in your life you had diarrhea?

And how do you know it wasn't a detox?

158
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 06, 2019, 06:45:35 am »
Quote from: Kaaris on March 06, 2019, 06:09:39 am
Alright. I used to manage a cold pressed juicery, and in hindsight now I know why some of my clients would report that they would  get diarrhea from the straight veggie juices. I don’t intend to drink raw green juices anyway.

Most people mix their juices wrong. They put too much sweet root/bulb vegetables like carrots, beets, or they put sweet fruits in there, or too many dark strong leafy greens like kale that should only be used minimally if at all.

AV suggested some raw veggie juices for detoxification for everybody except ex-vegetarians/vegans or very long-term raw animal based dieters with optimal health, living in pristine environments and with few accumulated toxins in their bodies.

The way to properly mix a veggie juice is to make most of it out of mild tasting vegetables and bland fruits, such as celery and cucumber (peeled, always). I also like swiss chard, it's a lot like celery because of the thick juicy stems.

Quote from: Kaaris on March 06, 2019, 06:14:20 am
I would like to ask you, do you think completely fasting for the day would be a good idea in situations like this? So as to give the body a way to properly process every bit of food without the constant ingestion of more food throughout the day? I thought of perhaps consuming only liquids, such as milk and eggs, and postponing the consumption of  meat and other solid foods. Either that or just carry on with my regular routine?

No, I don't think fasting is a good idea and AV thought it was a terrible idea. To quote him, "every time you spend more than 4hs without eating, your cells start cannibalizing each other". He even suggested sleeping with small pieces of ground meat or organs next to your bed so you can wake up in the middle of the night, have your snack and continue sleeping. I'm not nearly this extreme about it, but that's what he thought. And he's someone that experimented heavily with long term fasting.

159
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 06, 2019, 04:58:46 am »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 06, 2019, 04:19:02 am
  Do NOT try raw veggie juices. They are the 2nd-worst problem that RVAFers experience(raw dairy is the worst). I once tried raw veggie juice and got green diarrhea c.30 minutes after drinking the stuff. The general idea is that juicing not only breaks down the cell-walls to release many more nutrients, but also similiarly releases more of the antinutrients as well. If you do try them, then mind the usual caution of never drinking more than 1 pint of raw veggie juice.

Those antinutrients would be released when eating the vegetables normally as well. Plenty of people have the natural instinct to chew vegetables, drink the juice and discard the pulp. Using a juicer just speeds up the process and makes it easier if you have bad teeth. Also, not all juicing methods break up cell walls or introduce oxygen equally.

Finally, AV recommended no more than 3/4ths of a pint per sitting as the absolute maximum.

160
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 06, 2019, 04:55:59 am »
Quote from: Kaaris on March 06, 2019, 04:06:32 am
Are you recommending vegetable juices with little to no fiber, and more watery, such as the case of cucumber? Or literally any vegetable?

What do you mean, little to no fiber? You mean little to no cellulose? Then yes. There's plenty of fiber in any plant foods, including cucumber.

161
Primal Diet / Re: Constipation
« on: March 06, 2019, 03:44:38 am »
AV had little to say regarding constipation except that it can take many years to solve this problem, sometimes decades.

He had many suggestions in his books, I don't know if you've read them.

He also said parasites can be very helpful here.

Personally I just eat more bland fruits for fiber, even though AV didn't recommend that.

One thing you might be lacking is vegetable juice. Even though the juicing process gets rid of a lot of the fiber, it doesn't get rid of all. And AV did blend in a little whole cucumber (or zuccini?) with his juice for extra fiber.

162
Off Topic / Re: World's most polluted cities
« on: March 06, 2019, 03:40:15 am »
Notice they only looked at these 62 cities, there is no data on other cities in the same countries or other cities in other countries.

I also wonder if the methodology is correct... They're only looking at parts per million of a given particle size, but make no distinctions as to the toxicity of said particles. They also don't care about particles of other sizes, no matter how toxic.

163
Omnivorous Raw Paleo Diet / Re: Best raw vegetables that can be eaten with meat without interfering digestion
« on: March 05, 2019, 08:03:33 am »
In my experience... Tomatoes, avocados, onions or other spicy vegetables in small amounts, coconut, lemon juice (be careful with tooth enamel erosion if having a lot), sweet red bell peppers, and pretty much anything else that is not a leafy green or otherwise highly alcalinizing like celery, as long as you have only moderate or small amounts and the meal contains enough fats.

164
Primal Diet / Leishmaniasis study: Raw honey outperforms medication 4 to 1
« on: March 03, 2019, 07:11:37 am »
https://www.omicsonline.org/treatment-of-cutaneous-leishmaniasis-by-topical-application-of-honey-2155-9597.1000110.php?aid=271

A group of 50 hamsters was infected with leishmaniasis, then separated into two groups. One group received the conventional treatment of intravenous injections of Sodium stibogluconate (pentostam) and took 12-16 weeks to heal. The other group received daily topical application of raw honey, and took 4 weeks to heal.

AV suggested raw honey application for all sorts of skin conditions and lesions, for many decades before studies such as this came out.

It's true that raw honey has been known to have healing properties on the skin for millenia, but the medical industry has largely ignored, minimized or ridiculed this ancestral knowledge, in favor of chemical pharmaceutical drugs.

165
Off Topic / Re: UK Animal Rights
« on: March 03, 2019, 04:03:49 am »
These are insane terrorists and it's only a matter of time before their tactics become deadly, and before they start targeting all meat producers, sellers, and consumers, no matter how natural.

Animal rights are a contradiction in terms and must necessarily lead to this kind of thing. Animals are property.

In time these terrorist will gain control of the State, and then they can incrementally make all meat illegal.

166
Info / News Items / Announcements / Re: Video on costs (and benefits) of cooking food
« on: March 02, 2019, 05:56:26 am »
The only benefits I would grant are social, taste related, long-term food preservation, to help keep warm in the winter, and for stopping detoxes. Also the allowing of consuming unnatural foods to provent starvation.

I think most if not all of the so-called "benefits" of nutrient availability are just a way for you to absorb something you're not supposed to, or worse, absorb something in a way that is chemically altered and harmful.

167
Off Topic / Re: EU rules halal meat cannot be labelled "organic"
« on: March 02, 2019, 03:26:01 am »
Quote from: TylerDurden on March 02, 2019, 12:56:36 am
Some Muslims are willing to stun electrically, not all of them. I grant that electrical stunning is a modern notion, and therefore not essential, but I disagree re removing the blood. In the UK, I used to buy raw wild hares, all vacuum-packed, with at least 1 litre of raw blood in them, not counting the vast amounts of blood already present in the raw meat.

Anyway, Tony Robbins, an almost-vegan, used to say that the primary taste of meat was due to the blood in it.

You could always ask for your meat to be sold to you soaked in its own blood... But it seems to me that exsanguination as the first step in butchering is the best way to keep things clean and tidy. If you value blood it's all the more reason to do this first, as this makes sure that as little as possible will be lost...

Look at how Derek does it, what's wrong with his method? He doesn't stun and he believes he's doing the animal a favor by not stunning, and I can't say I disagree with him... He also exsanguinates as a means not only to kill, but of preserving every last precious drop of blood...

168
Off Topic / Re: Google banning money-making ads from anti-vaccination videos
« on: March 02, 2019, 03:20:29 am »
Quote from: surfsteve on March 02, 2019, 12:43:13 am
Fair enough.

Sorry for the tone, I was having a bad day.

To be fair I still use it and still complain. I guess what I was trying to say is, maybe we should do something about it.

The analogy isn't really perfect because it's obvious that this company receives a lot of tax money and benefits, and therefore you are paying for it. The problem is that this can't be proven, only inferred.

169
Off Topic / Re: Google banning money-making ads from anti-vaccination videos
« on: March 01, 2019, 05:35:31 pm »
Quote from: surfsteve on March 01, 2019, 09:12:23 am
I use google and I have a right to complain. I think your Starbucks analogy isn't quite on because you can just go down the street and buy cheaper and better coffee but other search engines are not as good and some of them are just as evil. I could say it's like complaining about the government and continuing to draw social security rather than starve but that would be the other extreme. The truth probably lies somewhere in the middle of our two examples.

The analogy is perfect. So Google is the cheapest, faster and generally better service there is. Yes, there's a reason for that and it's that the State pours tons of money into it so that they can keep an eye on you and everybody else. If you care about your privacy, prove it by using other services or coming up with your own, that will respect privacy but probably be worse in every other sense. If you value cheap and convenient over privacy, then you really have no right to complain.

Social security is very different because you were forced to pay into it, i.e. you had your money stolen for it before, with the promise from the robbers that you'd be paid back. So now they owe you. Very different indeed.

170
Off Topic / Re: EU rules halal meat cannot be labelled "organic"
« on: March 01, 2019, 05:25:18 pm »
Isn't all meat drained of blood during or shortly after slaughtering? I'm pretty sure it is, otherwise it would be a bloody mess to cut into smaller pieces that can be sold to the consumer.

Why do you want your meat electrically shocked? That can't be healthy or paleo...

I've read somewhere that most halal meat is also stunned anyway. Probably electrically too. It seems the only difference is they must say a prayer to God during slaughter.

Labelling would be good though. As far as government schools and football stadiums (gov sponsored), I couldn't care less. The only problem I really see with this is adapting the whole meat food supply to accomodate the whims of a small minority of immigrants.

I sometimes buy kosher meat when I can find it and if the alternative is to buy conventional because I know that it must either be from a female animal or an intact male, and I believe castrated male meat is very unpaleo and probably unhealthy too, but it is the industry standard as it makes them easier to manage. I didn't notice they avoided the rear half. I'll check next time I see it.

171
Off Topic / Re: EU rules halal meat cannot be labelled "organic"
« on: March 01, 2019, 07:32:52 am »
I'm not sure what this is about... What exactly is halal meat? Like kosher meat for muslims? How is it worse than regular meat? And what happened with the forcing of buying this meat? How did that happen?

172
Off Topic / Re: Google banning money-making ads from anti-vaccination videos
« on: March 01, 2019, 07:24:30 am »
Quote from: surfsteve on March 01, 2019, 12:47:39 am
Whatever happened to google's motto "DON'T BE EVIL"?

I think that's only one half of the real motto. It's like using only the first half of "Don't steal. The government hates competition."... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6e7wfDHzew

This company has been an arm of the State from the beginning, this is no surprise, I'm actually surprised they had not done this already. They'll pull ads and ban anyone who disagrees with their degenerate ultra lefty statist agenda.

Still we all use it to varying degrees. Even this forum uses some of their services I think. If you're still using it, you really have no right to complain. It's like me complaining about Starbucks promoting degeneracy and then going and buying their coffee.

173
Primal Diet / Re: Aajonus Vonderplanitz and HCL
« on: February 26, 2019, 05:02:00 am »
van, I read your story and am now feeling regret for everytime I gave you a hard time here. Your success in coping with such a tragic situation and remain focused and able to pursue optimal health is admirable and inspiring.

The fact that you experimented with your own high quality dairy for such a long time before deciding to stop, also lends legitimacy to your views on the matter.

I hope to keep seeing many more posts of yours in the future, and I will certainly read them with another perspective now.

174
Off Topic / Re: The other side of the vaccination issue
« on: February 26, 2019, 12:50:09 am »
Pure pharma scare with no science to back it up...

How are people "fine" if most people are sick, and not with just one illness, but many illnesses? No, people are not fine.

Back in the 1950's, everybody was smoking, and everybody thought smoking tobacco wasn't a problem because everybody did it and everybody was "fine". But they were not fine, they dried up and died far before their time, they got several types of cancer and other illnesses associated with tobacco smoking, they had reduced pulmonary function, etc etc

Just like with tobacco, most of the health problems are not immediate, so in a society where everybody is doing it, indeed, where it is ILLEGAL not to do it... then you have no idea if people are fine. Especially when clearly they're not fine, but sicker and sicker than ever.

175
Carnivorous / Zero Carb Approach / Re: Starting off raw meat
« on: February 25, 2019, 03:19:08 am »
I'll occasionally eat something cooked for various reasons, but I always end up paying for it with some health problem caused by it.

I've had some symptoms that could be described as food poisoning from raw foods, but the only times I've had all symptoms of food poisoning together, have been from cooked foods.

Moreover, even if you do get these symptoms occasionally, it's your general health that matters, not what happens on any particular day or even week.

And it's not clear to me at all that eating raw increases the frequency or duration of these symptoms compared to eating cooked. What I will say is that highly processed, sterile food is unlikely to cause immediate problems. So you could eat chocolate and chips and pepsi all day and never have food poisoning. But how would your overall health be?

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